Dec. 10, 2019

1187: A 3-Part Diagram for Planning a New Product Launch w/ Kenny Hall

In this episode we talk to , Product Marketing Manager at . Check out the Product Marketing Alliance Slack Channel that Kenny mentioned in this episode here: Now you can more easily search & share your audio content, while getting...

In this episode we talk to Kenny Hall, Product Marketing Manager at Springbuk.

Check out the Product Marketing Alliance Slack Channel that Kenny mentioned in this episode here:

https://productmarketingalliance.com/join-slack/


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Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:05.639 Looking for a guaranteed way to create content that resonates with your audience? Start 2 00:00:05.679 --> 00:00:10.589 a podcast, interview your ideal clients and let them choose the topic of the 3 00:00:10.710 --> 00:00:15.109 interview, because if your ideal clients care about the topic, there's a good 4 00:00:15.150 --> 00:00:18.989 chance the rest of your audience will care about it too. Learn more at 5 00:00:19.030 --> 00:00:27.460 sweet fish Mediacom. You're listening to be tob growth, a daily podcast for 6 00:00:27.579 --> 00:00:31.820 B TOB leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard before, like Gary vanner 7 00:00:31.859 --> 00:00:35.659 truck and Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard from the majority of our 8 00:00:35.700 --> 00:00:40.689 guests. That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors. 9 00:00:41.289 --> 00:00:44.689 Most of our guests are in the trenches leading sales and marketing teams. 10 00:00:44.929 --> 00:00:49.929 They're implementing strategy, they're experimenting with tactics, they're building the fastest growing be 11 00:00:50.039 --> 00:00:53.600 tob companies in the world. My name is James Carberry. I'm the founder 12 00:00:53.600 --> 00:00:57.079 of sweet fish media, a podcast agency for B Tob Brands, and I'm 13 00:00:57.119 --> 00:01:00.799 also one of the CO hosts of this show. When we're not interviewing sales 14 00:01:00.840 --> 00:01:03.590 and marketing leaders, you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of our own business. 15 00:01:04.030 --> 00:01:07.269 Will share the ups and downs of our journey as we attempt to take 16 00:01:07.269 --> 00:01:12.269 over the world. Just getting well? Maybe let's get into the show. 17 00:01:19.939 --> 00:01:23.219 Welcome back to be tob growth. I'm Logan lyles with sweet fish media. 18 00:01:23.420 --> 00:01:27.859 I'm joined today by kidding call he is product marketing manager over at Springbuck Kenny. 19 00:01:27.900 --> 00:01:30.099 How's it going today, man, Hey, man, how you doing? 20 00:01:30.299 --> 00:01:34.810 Doing pretty good. I am doing fantastic. I am excited to talk 21 00:01:34.810 --> 00:01:38.090 to you today. We're going to be going over three steps to successful new 22 00:01:38.209 --> 00:01:42.370 product releases. Before we jump into today's topic, as we usually do, 23 00:01:42.489 --> 00:01:46.090 I'd love to kick it over to you, Kenny, to give folks a 24 00:01:46.129 --> 00:01:49.120 little bit of background on yourself, your marketing career and what you in the 25 00:01:49.120 --> 00:01:52.879 team at springbuck er up to these days. For a little bit of context. 26 00:01:53.439 --> 00:01:57.040 Sure. So I went to school for Marketing and get the pleasure of 27 00:01:57.120 --> 00:02:00.239 doing day to day marketing from what I studied in school, which I find 28 00:02:00.280 --> 00:02:04.950 a little bit of a rarity nowadays. So I'm enjoying doing that every day. 29 00:02:04.989 --> 00:02:07.590 Right out of college. I started out of car auction services, an 30 00:02:07.629 --> 00:02:13.629 automobile auction company, and I did quite a bit of marketing their early started 31 00:02:13.789 --> 00:02:17.580 my career. I started out with campaigns and promotions and learned a lot about 32 00:02:17.580 --> 00:02:23.939 that specific to partner marketing and really growing the customer and making sure that they 33 00:02:23.979 --> 00:02:30.969 are moving the right products along and their market, and then decided I really 34 00:02:30.009 --> 00:02:36.729 wanted to transition into something different, that being product focused or digital focused, 35 00:02:37.009 --> 00:02:40.530 and found that opportunity at springbuck to move into a product marketing role where I'm 36 00:02:40.569 --> 00:02:45.719 learning a lot about how to bring products to market, specifically in the cess 37 00:02:46.199 --> 00:02:51.080 world and being a being market and then with the product marketing role I sit 38 00:02:51.159 --> 00:02:55.159 right in the middle of marketing department, Sales Department and product market product teams. 39 00:02:55.280 --> 00:03:00.990 So learning a lot about communicating with different stakeholders cross of business and finding 40 00:03:01.030 --> 00:03:05.590 a lot of enjoyment and learning from different people. Yeah, absolutely. And 41 00:03:05.710 --> 00:03:07.550 so for a little bit of context for folks, what a springbuck do? 42 00:03:07.669 --> 00:03:13.539 What's the market you guys serve real quick spring bug lives within the health analytics 43 00:03:13.539 --> 00:03:17.740 space. We are a health intelligence platform. It extends beyond that traditional data 44 00:03:17.780 --> 00:03:25.860 warehousing and analytics helping specifically consultants and employers unlocked data and maximize the value of 45 00:03:27.060 --> 00:03:31.849 their employee health investments. So really health intelligence provide that streamlined, easy to 46 00:03:31.969 --> 00:03:38.129 use interface to confidantly assess plans and programs so those consultants and employers can spend 47 00:03:38.169 --> 00:03:43.759 less time sorting through all that data and have more energy to make the actual 48 00:03:44.000 --> 00:03:47.680 decisions that matter. Data Day, yeah, whether it's health information or any 49 00:03:47.759 --> 00:03:53.240 sort of category of our lives. were all swimming in data and making it 50 00:03:53.400 --> 00:03:58.150 actionable with with analytics is a key part of a lot of different business functional 51 00:03:58.189 --> 00:04:00.110 roles and just our day to day lives. So you guys are doing some 52 00:04:00.229 --> 00:04:05.550 good work. They're so let's dive into today's topic. Kenny on three steps 53 00:04:05.710 --> 00:04:11.340 for releasing a new product. Can it step one is really getting organized and 54 00:04:11.620 --> 00:04:15.219 planning a new product release. Tell us a little bit you know at this 55 00:04:15.419 --> 00:04:18.779 phase what you've learned and some of the best practices that you guys have found 56 00:04:18.779 --> 00:04:24.730 at Spring Buck as you're doing the planning for a new product launch. Sure. 57 00:04:25.250 --> 00:04:29.529 So, kind of that first stage is that ideation and the goals of 58 00:04:29.649 --> 00:04:32.490 what we want to bring to market, and that comes from a lot of 59 00:04:32.930 --> 00:04:40.120 talking with our customers or brainstorming and internal innovation that we're pushing forward with our 60 00:04:40.120 --> 00:04:42.639 company. And some of the questions were asking is like, what is it 61 00:04:42.839 --> 00:04:46.480 right? What's the value profit this that it's going to actually benefit for our 62 00:04:46.560 --> 00:04:50.000 customers? And then we ask the question what tier is it in? So 63 00:04:50.199 --> 00:04:56.149 we have three different tiers that we try and bucket a different product within the 64 00:04:56.230 --> 00:05:00.149 first one being client satisfaction. So is this going to be something that pleases 65 00:05:00.269 --> 00:05:04.230 our current customers or, perspective, customers that are going to become customers? 66 00:05:04.589 --> 00:05:10.779 And then that second tier is is it going to drive sales or partner expansion? 67 00:05:11.220 --> 00:05:15.420 So is it going to end up being a tool or product that sales 68 00:05:15.459 --> 00:05:20.889 will really benefit from, driving new net new business? And then the third 69 00:05:21.050 --> 00:05:25.649 tier is market uniqueness. So is it a differentiator in the market? Is 70 00:05:25.810 --> 00:05:30.810 it something our competitors are not doing? Is it a way that makes us 71 00:05:30.889 --> 00:05:34.050 stand out from the crowd and is something that we can call our own and 72 00:05:34.250 --> 00:05:38.639 really capitalize on? So those are the three piers and I like to put 73 00:05:38.639 --> 00:05:44.040 them in this ven diagram format understand where they overlap, because different products might 74 00:05:45.360 --> 00:05:48.920 fall into multiple tiers. So if it's clients as faction and drive sales, 75 00:05:49.029 --> 00:05:53.430 you know, maybe it's in the middle of those or maybe it's really meeting 76 00:05:53.470 --> 00:05:56.430 all three of those tiers and it sits right in the middle, in which, 77 00:05:57.310 --> 00:06:00.709 as we actually keep the product and go through the entire launch, we're 78 00:06:00.750 --> 00:06:04.220 going to capitalize on all of our tactics that we've identified or most successful for 79 00:06:04.259 --> 00:06:08.579 launching a product, because it meets all those different tiers. Hmmm, I 80 00:06:08.740 --> 00:06:12.060 love them. And so those three are one, is it going to help 81 00:06:12.100 --> 00:06:16.980 us increase client satisfaction to is it going to help drive mostly net new sales 82 00:06:17.060 --> 00:06:20.610 or some sort of market expansion? And three, is it going to give 83 00:06:20.649 --> 00:06:28.170 us some sort of competitive differentiation in the market? Depending on where you decide 84 00:06:28.290 --> 00:06:31.009 that, you know, a new product that you've decided to launch fits within 85 00:06:31.129 --> 00:06:33.720 those and I think you make a really good point that you know they're not 86 00:06:33.839 --> 00:06:38.120 just buckets. Look at it as a then diagram and does it, you 87 00:06:38.199 --> 00:06:41.759 know, fit in all three or, you know, seventy percent in client 88 00:06:41.839 --> 00:06:46.720 satisfaction, with a little bit into driving net new sales? Does that inform 89 00:06:46.839 --> 00:06:50.589 your approach differently, depending on where it falls on that ven diagram, in 90 00:06:50.910 --> 00:06:55.470 either how quickly you bring it to market, how you prioritize it, I 91 00:06:55.550 --> 00:07:00.269 imagine, depending on, you know, what your current objectives are at a 92 00:07:00.350 --> 00:07:03.220 high level within the organization. Depends on okay, where it falls in the 93 00:07:03.220 --> 00:07:09.180 van die a gram will help us prioritize it against those high level objectives as 94 00:07:09.259 --> 00:07:13.339 an organization. Would you agree with that? Yeah, absolutely. I think 95 00:07:13.379 --> 00:07:18.730 one of the things that we we will figure out across different stakeholders and different 96 00:07:18.769 --> 00:07:23.370 teams as is this going to be something we just waunt in the market right 97 00:07:23.370 --> 00:07:27.410 away, or is it going to be something we test and iterate and then 98 00:07:27.449 --> 00:07:31.319 launch and go through maybe a Beta period or pre launch with current customers to 99 00:07:31.360 --> 00:07:35.360 allow them to test this product and give their feedback on it and say, 100 00:07:35.360 --> 00:07:40.639 Hey, this does meet my expectations or the value that you're saying this will 101 00:07:40.720 --> 00:07:44.000 bring really isn't bringing me that value, but it brings me this idea. 102 00:07:44.120 --> 00:07:46.910 Maybe we have the opportunity to pivot before we do more of a general release 103 00:07:47.430 --> 00:07:51.949 to all customers and then start selling it to prospects. And so I think, 104 00:07:53.029 --> 00:07:57.149 based on the tears that we determine this product falls into, we have 105 00:07:57.269 --> 00:08:01.379 the opportunity to either go to a Beta period or just launching into market and 106 00:08:01.500 --> 00:08:05.980 then test and iterate along the way, depending on what tier goes into. 107 00:08:07.540 --> 00:08:11.779 Hey, everybody logan with sweet fish year. You probably already know that we 108 00:08:13.009 --> 00:08:16.329 think you should start a podcast if you haven't already. But what if you 109 00:08:16.449 --> 00:08:20.089 have and you're asking these kinds of questions? How much has our podcast impacted 110 00:08:20.250 --> 00:08:26.290 revenue this year? How's our sales team actually leveraging the PODCAST content? If 111 00:08:26.329 --> 00:08:30.839 you can't answer these questions, you're actually not alone. This is why cast 112 00:08:30.920 --> 00:08:35.320 it created the very first content marketing platform made specifically for be tob podcasting. 113 00:08:35.840 --> 00:08:41.590 Now you can more easily search and share your audio content while getting greater visibility 114 00:08:41.789 --> 00:08:48.070 into the impact of your podcast. The marketing teams at drift terminus and here 115 00:08:48.110 --> 00:08:52.750 at sweet fish have started using casted to get more value out of our podcasts, 116 00:08:52.909 --> 00:08:56.500 and you probably can to. You can check out the product in action 117 00:08:56.659 --> 00:09:05.460 and casted dot US growth. That's sea steed dot US growth. All right, 118 00:09:05.659 --> 00:09:11.370 let's get back to the show. Yeah, any best practices or even 119 00:09:11.490 --> 00:09:16.809 you know, sometimes we learn best from failures, right, any potential pitfalls 120 00:09:16.009 --> 00:09:20.889 in that user testing period that you go through, which, again, depending 121 00:09:20.929 --> 00:09:26.080 on where the new product falls in this ven diagram you've been sharing with us, 122 00:09:26.080 --> 00:09:30.639 might inform how you test it with current customers or whether you do a 123 00:09:30.759 --> 00:09:33.960 Beta or you know, those sorts of things. But in that testing period 124 00:09:33.039 --> 00:09:37.440 you know we can get some false positives or you know, different things like 125 00:09:37.559 --> 00:09:41.350 that, where we think we're getting this indication but it's not actually going to 126 00:09:41.429 --> 00:09:43.830 hold true when we bring it to market. Any pitfalls in kind of how 127 00:09:43.909 --> 00:09:48.950 you approach that testing and those initial feedback loops that you've seen as a product 128 00:09:48.990 --> 00:09:54.620 marketer? Sure, so, we've just put a product into Beta recently and 129 00:09:54.899 --> 00:10:01.100 it's something that we've experienced. Our customers are interacting with it and they've had 130 00:10:01.139 --> 00:10:03.860 a chance to use it for a little while now and said, Hey, 131 00:10:03.899 --> 00:10:07.019 I really wish it could do this and if it can't do this, then 132 00:10:07.059 --> 00:10:09.889 I don't really think it's going to be as beneficial as you had intended it 133 00:10:09.970 --> 00:10:13.730 to be. And so what we've done in reaction to that is extended our 134 00:10:13.769 --> 00:10:16.889 Beta period and said, hey, we're going to go back and go back 135 00:10:16.889 --> 00:10:20.169 to our engineering teams, development teams and we're going to build this into this 136 00:10:20.370 --> 00:10:24.000 product. They'll come back to you and expend that Beta, Beta period so 137 00:10:24.120 --> 00:10:28.720 that we can get that feedback and see if this meets the expectation and the 138 00:10:28.840 --> 00:10:33.440 full value that you were hoping the product would. And so right now we're 139 00:10:33.480 --> 00:10:37.549 in the stage of building that into the product again and then we'll go back 140 00:10:37.590 --> 00:10:41.470 to our group of Beta users, it's about ten, ten to fifteen users, 141 00:10:43.309 --> 00:10:46.309 and get their honest feedback, which has been very helpful in terms of 142 00:10:48.350 --> 00:10:50.980 is this product going to be successful and how do we want to go to 143 00:10:52.100 --> 00:10:54.460 market with it? And as I create the messaging to go to market with 144 00:10:54.580 --> 00:10:58.259 it, I can really capitalize on the value props that our customers think are 145 00:10:58.299 --> 00:11:03.220 most important of the product so that it really resonates for potential net new business 146 00:11:03.370 --> 00:11:07.370 and then other customers that weren't a part of the Beta period, that true 147 00:11:07.490 --> 00:11:13.169 value is realized really quickly. Yeah, that makes sense. So basically keeping 148 00:11:13.250 --> 00:11:16.889 that feedback loop very tight, as opposed to saying, well, this was 149 00:11:16.929 --> 00:11:20.879 a flop, take that and you know, you may be going all the 150 00:11:20.919 --> 00:11:24.559 way back to the drawing board, but maybe not entirely, but then go 151 00:11:24.799 --> 00:11:28.120 back to those users that have already given you feedback, as opposed to starting 152 00:11:28.200 --> 00:11:31.679 over with a brand new product and a brand new set of Beta users. 153 00:11:31.720 --> 00:11:35.470 I think that's that's really good advice. They're Kenny. So you mentioned something 154 00:11:35.509 --> 00:11:39.389 at the top of the episode I'd like to come back to and that is, 155 00:11:39.830 --> 00:11:43.909 I think, going to be crucial in this second step of a new 156 00:11:43.990 --> 00:11:48.019 product launch and that's aligning with the different departments that often product marketing sits right 157 00:11:48.220 --> 00:11:52.740 in between marketing, sales and product. Can you tell us a little bit 158 00:11:52.860 --> 00:11:56.100 about, you know, as you start to go to market with a new 159 00:11:56.179 --> 00:12:01.100 product, some things that you've learned in aligning with those three other functional roles? 160 00:12:01.139 --> 00:12:05.289 Yeah, of course. I think the biggest thing is just overcommunicate, 161 00:12:05.490 --> 00:12:09.129 and I'm just learning that over and over again, and I think one of 162 00:12:09.169 --> 00:12:13.570 the things I'm also realizing is it doesn't take a lot of time or effort 163 00:12:15.009 --> 00:12:20.679 to have high impact, and I think that an example that can be just 164 00:12:20.879 --> 00:12:22.840 sending a simple email and saying, hey, this is where we're at in 165 00:12:22.919 --> 00:12:26.759 the product release process, that we're in Beta period, and we to use 166 00:12:26.840 --> 00:12:30.990 that. Last example. Just learned this from our customers, so we're going 167 00:12:31.149 --> 00:12:33.830 back to the drawing board to add this into the product and just making sure 168 00:12:33.870 --> 00:12:39.590 that that's communicated across the team, making sure that our client success team knows 169 00:12:39.710 --> 00:12:43.149 that so that when they are on the phone of those Beta users daytoday, 170 00:12:43.629 --> 00:12:48.779 understanding how they can keep that relationship positive, that they know that, okay, 171 00:12:48.860 --> 00:12:52.659 they have provided feedback for our product. That's in production right now and 172 00:12:54.539 --> 00:13:00.690 that relationship is a to way street, so that basically that customer success team 173 00:13:00.769 --> 00:13:03.889 knows that those conversations are happening or on the other end, product will know, 174 00:13:05.049 --> 00:13:09.889 hey, this is what we're hearing from the Customer Success Team K on 175 00:13:09.970 --> 00:13:15.440 the daytoday basis, and they're struggling with maybe data issues or maybe they're trying 176 00:13:15.480 --> 00:13:20.159 to go to market with Spring back to grow their business and they'd really like 177 00:13:20.399 --> 00:13:24.639 to have this feature represented. So making sure that each team kind of has 178 00:13:24.720 --> 00:13:28.990 a voice at the table, and I kind of become the cog or the 179 00:13:28.070 --> 00:13:33.029 middle of that to make sure every team has a voice there. Yeah, 180 00:13:33.110 --> 00:13:37.230 absolutely, I think it echoes what we were talking about, you know, 181 00:13:37.350 --> 00:13:41.460 with the customer facing communication and keeping those feedback loops tight, with just regular, 182 00:13:41.580 --> 00:13:46.259 consistent communication with those other departments as going to keep you on the same 183 00:13:46.299 --> 00:13:50.299 page as you move through the process. So we've got, you know, 184 00:13:50.659 --> 00:13:56.090 getting organized, deciding where the the new product fits in your overall strategy, 185 00:13:56.450 --> 00:14:01.129 aligning with the other departments that are going to be crucial in a successful new 186 00:14:01.169 --> 00:14:03.490 product launch. And then, you know, step three really is, once 187 00:14:03.570 --> 00:14:07.009 you've launched, how do you measure success? And you know this. There's 188 00:14:07.049 --> 00:14:09.879 probably no, you know, just one and done, quick, easy answer 189 00:14:09.919 --> 00:14:13.360 to this, but I would love to hear from you, Kenny, some 190 00:14:13.440 --> 00:14:16.720 of the ways that you guys approach measuring success after a new product launch, 191 00:14:18.279 --> 00:14:20.159 some of the leading indicators, some of the things that you do once you 192 00:14:20.320 --> 00:14:24.389 bring a new product to market to test and iterate, you know, in 193 00:14:24.549 --> 00:14:28.230 this third stage of the process. Sure. So what we're doing today is 194 00:14:28.950 --> 00:14:35.509 defining a process for collecting success on our product. So, thirty days after 195 00:14:35.629 --> 00:14:39.139 launch, we're going to meet with all those teams, the sales team, 196 00:14:39.299 --> 00:14:41.779 product team, marketing team. We're going to sit around, we're just going 197 00:14:41.779 --> 00:14:46.659 to talk about, Hey, what well through our product release process and say, 198 00:14:46.259 --> 00:14:50.419 now that it is in market, what are the results look like? 199 00:14:50.659 --> 00:14:56.049 Has It driven good conversations? Has It allowed you to get your foot in 200 00:14:56.090 --> 00:15:00.169 the door in a conversation you've been trying to have for quite a long time 201 00:15:00.210 --> 00:15:03.730 and now with this product and feature in our playbook, then it allows us 202 00:15:03.889 --> 00:15:11.279 to actually have that conversation. Or maybe it's actually helped you to get a 203 00:15:11.440 --> 00:15:16.399 few new opportunities that you wouldn't available to get before capturing those results and then 204 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:22.029 actually sharing them and putting them on paper allows us to set up better goals 205 00:15:22.070 --> 00:15:26.870 for the next product as it launches. I think today is a little bit 206 00:15:26.950 --> 00:15:31.909 difficult and something that we're learning and I think it'll just continue to become more 207 00:15:33.029 --> 00:15:37.580 clear what those goals should be as we continue to measure the success after it 208 00:15:37.659 --> 00:15:41.460 launches. What are some of the other like kind of benchmark points that you 209 00:15:41.539 --> 00:15:46.419 guys have put outside of that, you know, thirty day meeting kind of 210 00:15:46.620 --> 00:15:50.009 further into the future for folks that are maybe getting ready to go through this 211 00:15:50.129 --> 00:15:54.610 process as they think about okay, what should be our cadence of reviewing things 212 00:15:54.649 --> 00:16:00.250 beyond that initial period? Kenny, right now we're folcusing on revenue goals and 213 00:16:00.809 --> 00:16:08.120 can as we launch new products, can they increase potential revenue and forecast in 214 00:16:08.200 --> 00:16:12.240 that revenue can be difficult, but something that if you align a product and 215 00:16:14.240 --> 00:16:18.360 it is maybe a differentiator in the market, try and put a price tag 216 00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:22.590 on it based on customer research and then forecast out to say, if we 217 00:16:22.750 --> 00:16:30.309 can generate this amount of income and potential net new business down the road time 218 00:16:30.470 --> 00:16:34.860 to this product, then we can deem it successful and keep promoting it as 219 00:16:36.019 --> 00:16:41.419 is or shift in our strategy and say maybe we need to increase the cost 220 00:16:41.539 --> 00:16:45.740 because everyone's buying it and saying it is the best product in the market and 221 00:16:45.940 --> 00:16:51.409 that's that's a great opportunity. Yep, absolutely, I love that kind of 222 00:16:51.529 --> 00:16:55.529 two sided approach to measuring the the impact on revenue. I mean one just 223 00:16:55.649 --> 00:16:57.409 that you're talking about it and so many marketing leaders we talked to on a 224 00:16:57.409 --> 00:17:02.080 day to day basis on this show and offline are talking about, you know, 225 00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:04.640 aligning themselves to revenue goals. So I love to hear you say that 226 00:17:04.680 --> 00:17:10.519 as a product marketer as well, and so you know what you were saying. 227 00:17:10.559 --> 00:17:14.440 They're Kenny is, you know, try to extrapolate out a potential forecast 228 00:17:14.519 --> 00:17:18.990 based on the value or your assigning to this new product and don't just look 229 00:17:18.990 --> 00:17:22.430 at Hey, did we get to where we wanted to go? But if 230 00:17:22.470 --> 00:17:25.470 you way overshoot that, that's not a bad thing. Like you said, 231 00:17:25.509 --> 00:17:27.710 it's a great problem to have, but you may need to revisit, you 232 00:17:27.789 --> 00:17:32.220 know, the pricing strategy with it because you may be leaving money on the 233 00:17:32.259 --> 00:17:34.900 table. I think that's that's great advice to not just, you know, 234 00:17:36.019 --> 00:17:38.259 accept hey, we blew it out of the water and and let's keep pressing 235 00:17:38.339 --> 00:17:42.339 on as is. You want to pay attention to that just as much as 236 00:17:42.420 --> 00:17:48.289 if you fall short of those revenue forecast goals as well. Kenny, this 237 00:17:48.329 --> 00:17:52.250 has been a great conversation. I love the way that you've kind of broken 238 00:17:52.289 --> 00:17:56.089 down into three steps. New Product releases. One of the things we like 239 00:17:56.210 --> 00:17:59.640 to do with a lot of our guests here on BB growth is ask them 240 00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:04.160 a learning resource that's been informing their approach lately, as we try to help 241 00:18:04.240 --> 00:18:08.240 folks embody one of our core values here at sweet fish to never stop learning. 242 00:18:08.279 --> 00:18:11.559 So, whether it's a podcast, a book, someone you follow on 243 00:18:11.720 --> 00:18:17.109 social I would love for you to share with fellow marketers out there something that's 244 00:18:17.150 --> 00:18:22.029 got you excited or is helping improve your approach, either personally or professionally lately. 245 00:18:22.470 --> 00:18:26.829 Sure I actually have two things that come to mind quickly. The first 246 00:18:26.910 --> 00:18:33.980 being taken some time to actually rest and just regenerate my brain and doing something 247 00:18:33.059 --> 00:18:37.460 creative outside of work. It just allows me to be so much more productive 248 00:18:37.859 --> 00:18:42.609 in the daytoday work life. And I think it was Ken Coleman works with 249 00:18:42.650 --> 00:18:48.849 Dave Ramsey. He said burnout is not really something that is existent. It's 250 00:18:48.890 --> 00:18:52.490 just people that don't actually take the time to rest their mind and their heart 251 00:18:52.609 --> 00:18:56.640 and actually focus on what one are the most important things at least once a 252 00:18:56.720 --> 00:19:00.519 week, and so I try and practice that and it keeps me high energy 253 00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:04.200 and keep some focus on my daytoday. So that's that's the one thing. 254 00:19:04.319 --> 00:19:08.400 And then the second thing has been interesting resource, not a book, not 255 00:19:08.559 --> 00:19:14.869 a Podcast, by a slack channel specifically for product marketers. It's product marketing 256 00:19:14.910 --> 00:19:21.630 alliance. Out there different channels like product marketing, questions, resources, different 257 00:19:22.990 --> 00:19:26.940 general content. That just allows me, on a team of one right now, 258 00:19:26.140 --> 00:19:30.859 to have a channel to collaborate with other product markers that have similar challenges 259 00:19:32.299 --> 00:19:37.059 in their day to day and talking among different stakeholders within a business can be 260 00:19:37.140 --> 00:19:40.650 difficult at times, and just having a place to say hey, are you 261 00:19:40.769 --> 00:19:45.769 going through a similar challenge and bouncing those ideas off each other has been pretty 262 00:19:45.809 --> 00:19:48.289 good resource to me. I love it, man. So will put a 263 00:19:48.369 --> 00:19:52.410 link to that Product Marketing Alliance slack channel in the show notes since it's been, 264 00:19:52.769 --> 00:19:56.279 you know, so valuable to your approach, especially anyone else listening to 265 00:19:56.400 --> 00:19:59.279 this in product marketing. We want to make sure they've got access to that 266 00:19:59.359 --> 00:20:03.400 resource. So I really appreciate it and I can echo what you're saying about 267 00:20:03.400 --> 00:20:07.230 about burnout, not only taking time for rest but, like you said, 268 00:20:07.230 --> 00:20:11.190 taking time for other creative endeavors not associated to work and how they're going to 269 00:20:11.829 --> 00:20:17.750 help you do better work and be more creative at the job at hand, 270 00:20:17.789 --> 00:20:19.750 day in a day out. So love what you're saying there. Kenny, 271 00:20:19.750 --> 00:20:23.059 you've been a great guest on the show. If anybody listening to this would 272 00:20:23.059 --> 00:20:26.900 like to reach out or stay connected with you, what's the best way for 273 00:20:26.059 --> 00:20:32.140 them to do that? Yeah, you can reach me on Linkedin and Kenneth 274 00:20:32.180 --> 00:20:37.329 l hall, backslash or Kenny Hall just searching with Springbuck, or you can 275 00:20:37.369 --> 00:20:41.730 shoot me an email at Kohol at springbuck bacot. I love it. Man, 276 00:20:41.809 --> 00:20:42.970 thank you so much for being a guest on the show today. This 277 00:20:44.130 --> 00:20:47.849 was a lot of fun. Thank you so much. We totally get it. 278 00:20:48.250 --> 00:20:51.640 We publish a ton of content on this podcast and it can be a 279 00:20:51.759 --> 00:20:55.799 lot to keep up with. That's why we've started the BB growth big three, 280 00:20:56.240 --> 00:21:00.480 a no fluff email that boils down our three biggest takeaways from an entire 281 00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:04.710 week of episodes. Sign up today at Sweet Phish Mediacom. Big Three, 282 00:21:06.069 --> 00:21:08.430 that sweet fish Mediacom Big Three