1275: Humor in B2B Marketing: A 5-Part Framework That Works w/ Andrew Tarvin

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.360 --> 00:00:08.310 Welcome back to the BB growth show. My name is James Carberry and I'm 2 00:00:08.310 --> 00:00:11.990 joined today by Andrew Tarvian. He is the founder of humor that works. 3 00:00:12.150 --> 00:00:14.669 Andrew, how you doing it in my man? I am doing well. 4 00:00:14.710 --> 00:00:19.510 I'm slightly jealous. You've got a great podcast voice, I hear mind. 5 00:00:19.589 --> 00:00:21.899 I don't know that people ever say that about my voice, that you get 6 00:00:21.940 --> 00:00:24.059 a great like Hey, here we are today and all that, and be 7 00:00:24.300 --> 00:00:27.100 like, oh no, what's Mickey Mouse is on the shows. He got 8 00:00:27.179 --> 00:00:30.379 the day. Yes, no, you definitely does sound like Mickey Mouse, 9 00:00:30.420 --> 00:00:33.659 but I I did pick the right line of work. I've got a face 10 00:00:33.780 --> 00:00:36.810 for radio and a voice for it as well. So, Andrew, I'm 11 00:00:36.850 --> 00:00:39.810 really excited for this conversation. I saw that you spoke at a at a 12 00:00:39.850 --> 00:00:45.210 virtual conference recently, a content marketing conference, and I have been fascinated by 13 00:00:45.250 --> 00:00:50.799 this idea of humor, especially in bdb marketing. We did a video series 14 00:00:50.920 --> 00:00:54.679 a few years ago called Gary V, want to be and I was blown 15 00:00:54.719 --> 00:01:00.200 away at how the response that I got because we just did a funny spoof 16 00:01:00.359 --> 00:01:04.709 on me trying to be Gary V and desperately failing, and it resonated with 17 00:01:04.750 --> 00:01:07.670 a lot of bad marketers. Obviously, everybody be marketer under the Sun knows 18 00:01:07.709 --> 00:01:11.709 who Gary V is, and so we tapped into something powerful there and we've 19 00:01:11.790 --> 00:01:15.909 since done a few funny videos for some of our customers. So we'll produce 20 00:01:15.950 --> 00:01:21.340 a show in the I ai space or financial space and we'll come up with 21 00:01:21.420 --> 00:01:23.859 a funny concept and shoot a little you know, shoot a funny one to 22 00:01:23.939 --> 00:01:30.019 two minute video. They put adspen behind it and that asset ends up driving 23 00:01:30.099 --> 00:01:34.530 a lot of eyeballs and attention because it's funny. And so, seeing what 24 00:01:34.650 --> 00:01:38.049 you talked about at that virtual event, I thought, men, we've got 25 00:01:38.090 --> 00:01:42.810 to have Andrew on to talk to us about how we can integrate humor into 26 00:01:42.409 --> 00:01:46.569 BB marketing. And so before we do that, Andrew tells just a little 27 00:01:46.609 --> 00:01:49.920 bit. How did you get it? You you were at PNG prior to 28 00:01:49.040 --> 00:01:53.640 starting this company. How did you get from working at PNG as a business 29 00:01:53.680 --> 00:01:57.480 analyst into teaching people how to be funny? Sure? Well, for me, 30 00:01:57.680 --> 00:02:01.790 my journey starts with a degree in computer science and Engineering, which confuses 31 00:02:01.870 --> 00:02:06.709 people even more, like what's but no. So I got my degree in 32 00:02:06.709 --> 00:02:09.909 computer science and engineering from the Ohio State University and while I was there, 33 00:02:10.909 --> 00:02:15.020 my best friend went to start an Improv comedy group needed people and basically force 34 00:02:15.099 --> 00:02:20.620 me to join. And certainly I was because I was never the life of 35 00:02:20.659 --> 00:02:23.180 the party or class clown type person growing up on that engineer type person. 36 00:02:23.300 --> 00:02:29.099 But what I found an Improv and then later stand up was there's almost a 37 00:02:29.860 --> 00:02:32.889 logic to it, like humors almost math with words, kind of in a 38 00:02:32.969 --> 00:02:36.729 way, or can be at least approach with that, and I fell in 39 00:02:36.810 --> 00:02:38.969 love with kind of that work. And you know, making people laugh, 40 00:02:38.090 --> 00:02:42.129 making people smile can be a little bit addicting. And then when I was 41 00:02:42.210 --> 00:02:46.159 at PNG, I started to realize it was helping me get better results as 42 00:02:46.199 --> 00:02:50.599 a project manager. It's constantly leading meetings and when I would incorporate a little 43 00:02:50.599 --> 00:02:53.039 bit of humor, people actually paid attention more. Or when I added humor 44 00:02:53.080 --> 00:02:57.280 to my emails, people actually like read them, clicked on them, went 45 00:02:57.400 --> 00:03:00.189 through the bottom like responded to them, etc. So, you know, 46 00:03:00.229 --> 00:03:02.189 similar to what you're kind of saying what you experience with these videos, as 47 00:03:02.189 --> 00:03:07.750 you get a lot more engagement when there is is humor. So fell in 48 00:03:07.830 --> 00:03:10.270 love with that and as the engineer I was like, okay, I'm curious, 49 00:03:10.349 --> 00:03:14.419 why does this work, started looking at the research of it, started 50 00:03:14.419 --> 00:03:16.500 seeing that there is actually a lot of research out there about the benefits of 51 00:03:16.580 --> 00:03:20.860 humor. Realize not a lot of people were talking about it, at least 52 00:03:20.900 --> 00:03:23.020 from the way that I was seeing it, because people would be like, 53 00:03:23.180 --> 00:03:25.259 Oh, you know, humors just kind of something you're born with or good 54 00:03:25.300 --> 00:03:28.169 luck or that kind of stuff, and I was like wait, no, 55 00:03:28.250 --> 00:03:30.490 I had to learn the skill of humor. I wasn't naturally funny. I 56 00:03:31.090 --> 00:03:36.169 learned it from books and from lots of repetition and later classes and things like 57 00:03:36.289 --> 00:03:38.129 that, and so the engineer brain was like, okay, well, if 58 00:03:38.169 --> 00:03:42.439 I can parse, if I can kind of break this apart, I could 59 00:03:42.439 --> 00:03:45.039 teach other people had to do this so that they could use it in their 60 00:03:45.120 --> 00:03:47.400 work and they could take what I've learned and apply it. And so started 61 00:03:47.479 --> 00:03:52.039 humor that works in two thousand and nine part time while still at PNG. 62 00:03:52.319 --> 00:03:54.750 Fell in love with it, became the full time Gig kind of in two 63 00:03:54.750 --> 00:03:59.389 thousand and twelve, and now since then we've worked with over you know, 64 00:03:59.509 --> 00:04:01.710 we've done over five hundred events for more than two hundred and fifty organizations all 65 00:04:01.750 --> 00:04:04.830 around the world on this topic. I love it. I love it makes 66 00:04:04.870 --> 00:04:09.430 a whole lot of sense to me why companies are clamoring to have you teach 67 00:04:09.469 --> 00:04:12.539 their teams how to do this, because I've, like I said again, 68 00:04:12.580 --> 00:04:15.860 I've seen firsthand that it works. I want to first start with how you 69 00:04:16.060 --> 00:04:19.699 define humor, because I think you think about it differently and I want to 70 00:04:19.779 --> 00:04:25.529 frame the conversation first by that, by and really, what does humor mean 71 00:04:25.850 --> 00:04:29.250 in the in the way that you think about it? Yeah, it's a 72 00:04:29.290 --> 00:04:30.649 great question, because I think you know. As for the for the listeners, 73 00:04:30.689 --> 00:04:32.769 I encourage you to start to think about okay, what's the first thing 74 00:04:32.810 --> 00:04:35.930 that comes to mind when you hear humor? And for many people, as 75 00:04:35.930 --> 00:04:39.160 you're starting to think about that, for a lot of people, they think 76 00:04:39.199 --> 00:04:42.759 of laughter, they think of jokes, they think of stand up Comedians, 77 00:04:42.879 --> 00:04:45.560 and certainly that is a component of humor. But there's a reason why the 78 00:04:45.639 --> 00:04:48.120 company is called humor that works, not comedy that works, and that's because 79 00:04:48.519 --> 00:04:53.629 humors more broad than comedy. Comedy is a subset of humor, but humor 80 00:04:53.670 --> 00:04:58.110 also includes things that are maybe a little bit silly or maybe just a little 81 00:04:58.110 --> 00:05:01.430 bit different. And so what we say is our work isn't necessarily about making 82 00:05:01.470 --> 00:05:05.509 your brand funny, but rather making the brand a little bit more fun. 83 00:05:06.029 --> 00:05:10.300 Now, certainly, as part of that that could be teaching some comedic structure, 84 00:05:10.339 --> 00:05:13.259 things like set up and punchline and what a comic triple is and things 85 00:05:13.300 --> 00:05:15.699 like that that might evoke laughter. But the bar isn't that high. Our 86 00:05:15.779 --> 00:05:19.019 goal is not for the people to go through our workshops and for people to 87 00:05:19.100 --> 00:05:21.290 be like, Oh my God, you're the funniest person ever. Now you 88 00:05:21.370 --> 00:05:24.810 should have a stand up comedy special, all that kind of stuff. It's 89 00:05:24.810 --> 00:05:27.769 like no, we want people to say, okay, here's how I can 90 00:05:27.769 --> 00:05:30.329 use humor strategically, here's how I can use it to get this result, 91 00:05:30.410 --> 00:05:33.290 not so that people think that I'm funny, but so they see that I 92 00:05:33.410 --> 00:05:38.399 am effective or that my brand is effective, and so recognizing that the bar 93 00:05:38.560 --> 00:05:41.839 isn't so high as okay, this has to be a standup comedy web level 94 00:05:41.959 --> 00:05:44.839 joke, but more of it's just something a little bit more fun that's going 95 00:05:44.839 --> 00:05:47.240 to increase that engagement. Gotta. I want to talk a little bit before 96 00:05:47.240 --> 00:05:51.110 we get into your five part framework for how how companies can do this. 97 00:05:51.949 --> 00:05:55.470 I want to dive a little bit more into what you just alluded to, 98 00:05:55.550 --> 00:06:00.430 which are some of the benefits of of really investing in humor, especially as 99 00:06:00.470 --> 00:06:04.220 it relates to the marketers listening to this. So why is humor something worth 100 00:06:04.300 --> 00:06:09.220 investing in from a marketing perspective? Sure, well, I'm certainly happy to 101 00:06:09.259 --> 00:06:12.980 talk about the the research in the actual benefits, but I want to start 102 00:06:13.019 --> 00:06:16.060 with a very, you know, dumb question perhaps, and the dumb question 103 00:06:16.180 --> 00:06:19.329 for people to consider, and you can consider as well as would you rather 104 00:06:19.410 --> 00:06:26.050 do something that is fun or not? Fun, Fun all day? UN 105 00:06:26.290 --> 00:06:29.170 Right? Yeah, so it stands the reason that if you were to make 106 00:06:29.329 --> 00:06:32.000 say, your marketing a little bit more fun, would be would people be 107 00:06:32.160 --> 00:06:35.199 more likely to share it? If you're to make your emails a little bit 108 00:06:35.240 --> 00:06:39.759 more fun, would people be more likely to read it? If you were 109 00:06:39.800 --> 00:06:42.560 to make your own work a little bit more fun, would you be more 110 00:06:42.720 --> 00:06:45.560 likely to be engaged with it? Right, and it's a civil question, 111 00:06:45.720 --> 00:06:48.269 but I think it has big implications and when you look at the actual research 112 00:06:48.350 --> 00:06:53.310 you see that. Right. So there's some studies that show that emails with 113 00:06:53.389 --> 00:06:57.069 humor in the subject line have an increase in click through rate of actually or 114 00:06:57.149 --> 00:07:00.110 open rates. You start to see right some of the most viral campaigns that 115 00:07:00.189 --> 00:07:04.420 have happened incorporate humor. Almost every super bowl commercial. If they're going to 116 00:07:04.420 --> 00:07:09.060 spend millions of dollars, they incorporate some humor. Now some of you are 117 00:07:09.060 --> 00:07:12.019 already probably starting to think it's like Oh yeah, well, I remember like 118 00:07:12.139 --> 00:07:15.420 that funny cat, you know, hurting cats, video from like ten fifteen 119 00:07:15.420 --> 00:07:17.250 years ago, but I don't remember what company it was for. It was 120 00:07:17.290 --> 00:07:20.769 like IBM or something. I remember, and you're absolutely right. There is 121 00:07:20.850 --> 00:07:25.490 an effective way to use humor. Humor isn't always effective. It can sometimes 122 00:07:25.529 --> 00:07:27.970 be a little bit of a distraction or it can be something where it's like 123 00:07:28.290 --> 00:07:30.319 that was interesting, but it's not actually going to move anymore product. So 124 00:07:30.399 --> 00:07:33.240 there is a certain way to do it. But humor there's tons of studies 125 00:07:33.279 --> 00:07:38.319 on overall benefits to it. So I think as marketers a kind of key 126 00:07:38.399 --> 00:07:42.319 areas. One getting people to pay attention, because if you get people laughing, 127 00:07:42.480 --> 00:07:45.709 you get them listening right and then you can actually tell them more about 128 00:07:45.750 --> 00:07:47.149 your product. So you get them to pay attention, you can use it 129 00:07:47.230 --> 00:07:50.589 to improve understanding. So if you can connect like through in association, you 130 00:07:50.629 --> 00:07:53.910 can help people understand. Oh, what is it that you actually do? 131 00:07:54.029 --> 00:07:56.910 This is particularly relevant and be to be so, like in some of the 132 00:07:56.949 --> 00:08:00.459 work that we've done with groups like IBM or even places like the Red Cross, 133 00:08:00.779 --> 00:08:05.379 you have something very complex and traditionally pretty dry to communicate. Well, 134 00:08:05.420 --> 00:08:07.899 that's going to cause people to fall asleep or they're going to click to the 135 00:08:07.939 --> 00:08:09.579 video and not actually watch it. But if it's engaging, if they have 136 00:08:09.660 --> 00:08:13.089 humor kind of throughout it, now people are actually, you know, resonating 137 00:08:13.089 --> 00:08:16.250 with that material a little bit more. So it helps them to understand it 138 00:08:16.689 --> 00:08:22.170 and ultimately it helps you to build rapport right as a brand, you want 139 00:08:22.209 --> 00:08:26.889 to create rapport in a relationship with people, and you see certain brands do 140 00:08:26.009 --> 00:08:31.120 that well, whether it's the hustile newsletter or cards against humanity or, you 141 00:08:31.199 --> 00:08:33.960 know, the windy's twitter account or whatever. They have a certain rapport or 142 00:08:33.080 --> 00:08:37.000 certain brand that allows them to build these connections and now, as an individual, 143 00:08:37.039 --> 00:08:41.429 you feel an emotional connection to that brand. Yes, I resonate so 144 00:08:41.590 --> 00:08:45.870 much with everything you're saying there. I love the example, as you shared. 145 00:08:46.470 --> 00:08:50.669 Who Doesn't love seeing windy's pull up in their twitter feed because you know 146 00:08:52.029 --> 00:08:54.629 you're going to smile whenever you see that. And and and I think I 147 00:08:56.179 --> 00:09:00.179 also loved your clarification and the question that you asked. That, I think, 148 00:09:00.299 --> 00:09:03.100 is a really smart question to ask ourselves. If we want the attention 149 00:09:03.259 --> 00:09:07.940 of our audience, would they rather pay attention to something that's fun or to 150 00:09:09.059 --> 00:09:11.570 something that's boring? And more often not, more often than not are'd argue. 151 00:09:11.690 --> 00:09:15.649 All of the time people are going to answer just the way I did, 152 00:09:15.730 --> 00:09:18.090 that you always want to engage with something that's fun, because we're humans. 153 00:09:18.409 --> 00:09:22.529 So that makes so much sense. I want to dive into enter your 154 00:09:22.610 --> 00:09:26.440 five part framework for how how companies need to be thinking about this as they 155 00:09:26.519 --> 00:09:33.320 go to implement humor in their marketing. The five part framework starts with define 156 00:09:33.480 --> 00:09:37.080 your maps. Can can you tell us what this means? Absolutely well. 157 00:09:37.120 --> 00:09:41.149 And so the five fournt part framework, if you're paying attention you'll probably notice, 158 00:09:41.350 --> 00:09:46.070 is pretty much the five same steps for problem solving, like if you've 159 00:09:46.070 --> 00:09:48.870 done research on problems, something you can be like. That sounds awfully familiar, 160 00:09:48.950 --> 00:09:52.070 and the reason is that it's exactly the same framework. We've adjusted it 161 00:09:52.190 --> 00:09:54.059 just a little bit, but because that's how we think of humor, we 162 00:09:54.139 --> 00:09:58.580 don't think of it as just a thing to randomly do because we were told 163 00:09:58.659 --> 00:10:01.460 to, but we do it to solve a specific challenge, and so that's 164 00:10:01.460 --> 00:10:05.899 why it follows this particular framework. And so yes, step number one is 165 00:10:05.019 --> 00:10:09.090 to define your map. So what we call your map that's capitalized, it's 166 00:10:09.090 --> 00:10:13.529 not because we're yelling it, but because it's an acronym and it stands for 167 00:10:13.570 --> 00:10:18.610 your medium, your audience and your purpose. And so this is how you 168 00:10:18.769 --> 00:10:20.879 start to define humor so that it actually gets the results that you're looking for, 169 00:10:20.960 --> 00:10:24.799 as opposed to, Hey, that funny commercial, but I don't remember 170 00:10:24.840 --> 00:10:26.799 what it was connected to. So your medium is how are you going to 171 00:10:26.840 --> 00:10:31.440 execute the humor? The humor that you would use and say a tick tock 172 00:10:31.519 --> 00:10:35.159 video is very different than the humor that you might use in an email or 173 00:10:35.480 --> 00:10:39.070 in a presentation to a specific client, is part of sales, engineering or 174 00:10:39.110 --> 00:10:43.269 whatever. Right. So your medium impacts your message. So you want to 175 00:10:43.309 --> 00:10:46.509 make sure that you're using the appropriate type of humor. Things like sarcasm and 176 00:10:46.710 --> 00:10:50.299 sat tire very difficult to pull off well unless it's part of the brand ethos. 177 00:10:50.860 --> 00:10:54.019 Right. So twitter can start to get away with that more and more 178 00:10:54.179 --> 00:10:58.659 windy's can, because that becomes part of their brand identity if that's not part 179 00:10:58.659 --> 00:11:01.500 of it to begin with, and hard to do that well in an email. 180 00:11:01.740 --> 00:11:05.809 So understanding your medium becomes very important. The second piece is your audience, 181 00:11:07.330 --> 00:11:09.730 and this is who is going to receive that humor. Is this a 182 00:11:09.889 --> 00:11:13.289 bunch of people who are already familiar with your brand and so it's just kind 183 00:11:13.289 --> 00:11:16.730 of building off of the brand, could readibility that you already have, or 184 00:11:16.929 --> 00:11:20.440 is are you introducing a product to someone for the very first time and they 185 00:11:20.519 --> 00:11:24.320 have no idea who you are? Right, you're coming in with a pitch 186 00:11:24.440 --> 00:11:26.480 for something and you're like, we don't know who you like. You're just 187 00:11:26.639 --> 00:11:28.759 on our calendar today. I guess you're here right. So that audience, 188 00:11:28.879 --> 00:11:31.639 in your relationship with the audience, has a big impact on the type of 189 00:11:31.679 --> 00:11:35.350 humor you can use. And then, finally, what is your purpose, 190 00:11:35.429 --> 00:11:37.190 and this is probably the most important, at least for me as an engineer, 191 00:11:37.309 --> 00:11:41.470 is why do you want to use humor? Is it to get people 192 00:11:41.470 --> 00:11:45.389 to pay attention? Is it to help them remember something longer? Is it 193 00:11:45.549 --> 00:11:48.580 to manage your own stress as part of the process and make it more fun 194 00:11:48.740 --> 00:11:50.779 so that when you're more engaged in a presentation, other people are as well. 195 00:11:52.220 --> 00:11:56.259 But that purpose is very important to identify, because the humor that you 196 00:11:56.340 --> 00:12:00.340 use might be very different. So step one of the process is basically to 197 00:12:00.580 --> 00:12:03.769 articulate and we encourage our clients to actually write them down and say, think 198 00:12:03.769 --> 00:12:07.850 of a specific moment that you want to use humor for. Okay, my 199 00:12:07.009 --> 00:12:11.289 medium is it's going to be a short video that I post on Youtube that 200 00:12:11.330 --> 00:12:13.250 we're going to send out to all of our clients. Be Email. Our 201 00:12:13.330 --> 00:12:18.440 audience is this is going to be people that are new to our campaign. 202 00:12:18.440 --> 00:12:22.120 are like our automation campaign. They've signed up on the newsletter and this is 203 00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:24.120 the they sign up for the something on our website. This is the first 204 00:12:24.159 --> 00:12:28.080 email that goes out to them. So they're brand into it. Our purpose 205 00:12:28.200 --> 00:12:31.230 is we want to one show that we're funny so that people listen and open 206 00:12:31.309 --> 00:12:33.629 our videos a little bit later. One of the things that I think that 207 00:12:33.710 --> 00:12:37.470 you did very well with the kind of like pretend to be Gary B series 208 00:12:37.669 --> 00:12:43.590 that brands can do is create a structure for humor, create a series where 209 00:12:43.590 --> 00:12:46.539 it's constantly going to be going. So I mentioned the hustle as a newsletter 210 00:12:46.899 --> 00:12:50.899 they have. Every Friday they share and their newsletter shower thoughts from reddit. 211 00:12:50.220 --> 00:12:54.860 And so now I know as an observer, I know every Friday gets shower 212 00:12:54.980 --> 00:12:58.059 thoughts. So every Friday I'm more inclined to even open that email because I 213 00:12:58.179 --> 00:13:01.769 know there's something humorous in it. So creating a structure for that creates that 214 00:13:01.929 --> 00:13:03.370 and so that might be okay. We want to show that we're going to 215 00:13:03.409 --> 00:13:07.529 use humor and that's part of the part of the reason. And then also 216 00:13:07.570 --> 00:13:09.649 we want to use humor to improve understanding. Okay, now that you have 217 00:13:09.769 --> 00:13:15.440 the map that's going to help you create more specific, more effective humor from 218 00:13:15.480 --> 00:13:20.279 it about it. So the first part being definition. You've got to define 219 00:13:20.279 --> 00:13:24.080 your medium, your audience, your purpose. The second step of your framework 220 00:13:24.240 --> 00:13:26.080 is you've got to now develop your ideas. Talk to us about this one. 221 00:13:26.710 --> 00:13:31.950 Yeah, so there's sometimes I think people forget that. If you look 222 00:13:31.950 --> 00:13:35.669 at like, say, SNL or the late show or any of these groups, 223 00:13:35.789 --> 00:13:39.350 they have a team of writers. Like SNL, they have a team 224 00:13:39.350 --> 00:13:43.139 of writers or their whole job is for an entire week they're coming up with 225 00:13:43.179 --> 00:13:46.179 an hour and a half episode, and so sometimes you can forget that with 226 00:13:46.259 --> 00:13:46.940 humor, of like Oh, we can go, you know, we can 227 00:13:46.980 --> 00:13:50.700 go sit in a room for fifteen minutes and bang out the copy for that 228 00:13:50.740 --> 00:13:54.059 and it's going to be perfect. Right. It's like no, humor requires 229 00:13:54.139 --> 00:13:56.769 creation. This is why you even stand up comedians. They do a ton 230 00:13:56.889 --> 00:14:01.009 of testing a material before it makes it into their netflix comedy special. And 231 00:14:01.210 --> 00:14:05.049 so within comedy it's helpful to recognize there's kind of an unwritten rule called the 232 00:14:05.090 --> 00:14:09.090 rule of ninety, which is ninety percent of what you write will be crap, 233 00:14:09.809 --> 00:14:13.679 and so you need to create a decent amount of content to then whittled 234 00:14:13.720 --> 00:14:16.639 down to the ten percent that will be good, that will really make people 235 00:14:16.759 --> 00:14:20.919 kind of resonate things like that. The other thing about developing materials that it 236 00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:24.470 can be very difficult to just sit down and be funny. Right, if 237 00:14:24.509 --> 00:14:26.309 you've ever tried that, of like, all right, we're going to try 238 00:14:26.309 --> 00:14:28.429 to be funny. Now, let's open up a spreadsheet. All right, 239 00:14:28.470 --> 00:14:31.669 everyone, get in here and go create hilarity. Well, it turns out 240 00:14:31.909 --> 00:14:37.269 that creativity benefits a lot from structure, and so part of what we teach 241 00:14:37.389 --> 00:14:41.220 is in the development process. There's a couple of things that can help in 242 00:14:41.500 --> 00:14:45.740 creating humor. One of them is understanding some of the common comedic devices. 243 00:14:45.779 --> 00:14:48.220 And so perhaps one of the most common that people maybe have heard of, 244 00:14:48.820 --> 00:14:52.860 but it's also one of the most easy to explain, is is a device 245 00:14:52.929 --> 00:14:56.809 called a comic triple. And a comic triple is you have a list of 246 00:14:56.889 --> 00:15:00.889 three things and the third thing is something unexpected. So, for example, 247 00:15:00.929 --> 00:15:05.090 when I'm I'm talking about you know, my my work. You know, 248 00:15:05.090 --> 00:15:07.519 I say, you know, I'm an engineer. As a kid I used 249 00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:09.639 to love to take things apart and put them back together again, things like 250 00:15:09.799 --> 00:15:15.720 clocks and radios and my parents marriage. Right. So that's a comic triple. 251 00:15:15.799 --> 00:15:18.840 The first two things are normal, third thing is something unexpected. It 252 00:15:18.159 --> 00:15:22.269 creates a little bit of laughter. Well, learning structures like that become very 253 00:15:22.309 --> 00:15:26.509 easy because then if you're ever writing your own marketing copy and you realize you 254 00:15:26.590 --> 00:15:30.710 have a list, you could be like, oh, could I replace the 255 00:15:30.750 --> 00:15:33.950 last item in this list with something a little bit unexpected, and again, 256 00:15:33.990 --> 00:15:37.179 it's maybe not going to be hilarious, but it's going to get people to 257 00:15:37.179 --> 00:15:39.580 lean in more. Like when we talk about our client list, I say, 258 00:15:39.820 --> 00:15:43.539 you know, we've done work with Microsoft, the FBI and the International 259 00:15:43.620 --> 00:15:48.820 Association of Canine Professionals. And the last one is like enter what now can 260 00:15:48.860 --> 00:15:52.210 I'm professionals what it is that dogs who have jobs, what kind of like? 261 00:15:52.610 --> 00:15:54.690 And so it's like creating that, just a little bit of leaning in, 262 00:15:54.769 --> 00:15:58.690 a little bit more of that engagement. So and the developed process. 263 00:15:58.730 --> 00:16:00.889 You might be doing, say, comic triples, or maybe creating some associations 264 00:16:02.049 --> 00:16:04.320 through the toby ten list, or maybe you're using observations or whatever it is. 265 00:16:04.480 --> 00:16:07.720 But you can pick a certain device, use a couple of exercises, 266 00:16:07.840 --> 00:16:11.919 generate ideas and that gives you a whole list of then choose from. You 267 00:16:12.039 --> 00:16:15.200 mentioned something there, Andrew. You said the ten by ten list. Can 268 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:19.350 you elaborate what that means? Sure. So one of the this is actually 269 00:16:19.389 --> 00:16:25.549 particularly helpful for B tob is again, when you have something that's kind of 270 00:16:25.789 --> 00:16:30.389 dry to talk about, creating an association or a metaphor can be a great 271 00:16:30.429 --> 00:16:33.220 way to add humor to it. You know, I remember attending a conference 272 00:16:33.259 --> 00:16:37.539 where it actually help with facebook adds as well. He was saying so he 273 00:16:37.940 --> 00:16:42.500 wanted to look for people who were going who are into email marketing and also 274 00:16:42.700 --> 00:16:48.049 who watched game of thrones and then he created copy that was all about game 275 00:16:48.210 --> 00:16:52.289 and game of thrones related to email marketing. So it was like, you 276 00:16:52.370 --> 00:16:56.649 know, are your emails Khalisi or more you know, ned stark or whatever, 277 00:16:56.690 --> 00:16:59.809 right, you know, relating to it? And so what that does 278 00:16:59.850 --> 00:17:03.000 is one and helped him create like these very specific facebook adds. But to 279 00:17:03.200 --> 00:17:06.599 what you can do is in a ten by ten list, you can take, 280 00:17:06.640 --> 00:17:10.680 okay, here's the thing that I need to train the email marketing or, 281 00:17:10.920 --> 00:17:14.400 you know, my product or whatever. Here's ten things related to that 282 00:17:14.599 --> 00:17:17.589 thing that I need to teach people about. And then now let me pick 283 00:17:17.670 --> 00:17:21.069 something that's more interesting, quote unquote, more interesting, or that we know 284 00:17:21.190 --> 00:17:23.950 the audience likes. Maybe it is pop culture, maybe it is sports, 285 00:17:25.029 --> 00:17:29.430 maybe it is a passion activity, whatever. List ten things related to that 286 00:17:29.710 --> 00:17:33.700 passion or topic and then start to see where their intersections okay, so email 287 00:17:33.700 --> 00:17:37.059 marketing is kind of like game of thrones. Because of this or, you 288 00:17:37.140 --> 00:17:41.740 know, this part of our product is like this aspect of baseball or whatever 289 00:17:41.740 --> 00:17:45.849 it is. You find those interesting connections and what that does is one, 290 00:17:45.450 --> 00:17:48.210 it'll g gives you a chance to talk about the thing that's more interesting. 291 00:17:48.329 --> 00:17:51.970 Oh, now you can talk about baseball, you can make some humor about 292 00:17:52.009 --> 00:17:55.250 baseball, right, and then you can say oh, but it turns out 293 00:17:55.250 --> 00:17:57.799 that baseball is actually a lot like this. And then you talk about your 294 00:17:57.839 --> 00:18:00.359 product and you don't have to then be making fun of your product, but 295 00:18:00.440 --> 00:18:04.400 you've created more humor because it's talking about something interesting and you've had humor related 296 00:18:04.440 --> 00:18:07.200 to that. And then now when people are like Oh yeah, so he 297 00:18:07.359 --> 00:18:11.160 and that presentation is talking about baseball, and he's kind of like, oh, 298 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:12.549 this is kind of like a home run. What was a home run? 299 00:18:12.910 --> 00:18:15.190 Oh, it was that subject. So it helps them to remember it 300 00:18:15.549 --> 00:18:18.470 later. That makes a lot of sense. There's someone that I follow on 301 00:18:18.630 --> 00:18:23.109 Linkedin, the names Blake Emal, and he has done something very similar. 302 00:18:23.190 --> 00:18:26.500 He's been doing a lot of slide decks in. He did, you know, 303 00:18:26.660 --> 00:18:30.740 on draft night for the NFL draft this year. It was like, 304 00:18:30.259 --> 00:18:33.859 you know, it's draft night, we're picking the best, you know, 305 00:18:33.140 --> 00:18:38.339 bb marketers on Linkedin and he did a slide deck basically of the ten top 306 00:18:38.700 --> 00:18:42.970 BB marketers on Linkedin and framed it like it was, you know, a 307 00:18:44.329 --> 00:18:48.009 draft, because that night was draft night. So I think tapping into relevancy, 308 00:18:48.410 --> 00:18:52.410 tapping into pop culture, happening, into what people are thinking about outside 309 00:18:52.410 --> 00:18:56.039 of work and then tying it into your expertise or the way that you can 310 00:18:56.160 --> 00:19:00.519 help your customer. I think is such a smart way and and I love 311 00:19:00.599 --> 00:19:06.279 that you talked about having frameworks and having structure and how that actually evokes creativity. 312 00:19:06.799 --> 00:19:10.109 The I. I the Comic Triple Idea, I think is brilliant, 313 00:19:10.589 --> 00:19:11.910 and the ten by ten list, I think, is all. I mean, 314 00:19:12.069 --> 00:19:15.470 it just makes sense when you go in with with a structure and a 315 00:19:15.549 --> 00:19:18.549 purpose, to say, Hey, this is what we're going to try to 316 00:19:18.789 --> 00:19:22.269 do, here's the rabbit like, here's the wrapper that we're going to put 317 00:19:22.269 --> 00:19:26.019 it in, so that we know that the output is predictable and it's and 318 00:19:26.099 --> 00:19:27.779 it's going to be good. It makes a lot of sense. So this 319 00:19:29.099 --> 00:19:32.740 third part of your framework. So we've got define develop this third one. 320 00:19:32.819 --> 00:19:34.900 Is Now you've got to decide. You got you, you've probably developed a 321 00:19:36.019 --> 00:19:38.730 ton of ideas at this point. How do you go about deciding which idea 322 00:19:40.410 --> 00:19:44.170 needs to be used? Yeah, well, and t your just about at 323 00:19:44.210 --> 00:19:47.009 that point of the developing as like the engineer and me as like yet how 324 00:19:47.049 --> 00:19:49.089 do we make this as simple as possible. And of course you can break 325 00:19:49.170 --> 00:19:52.000 it right. You can like Oh, you start maybe with a comic trip 326 00:19:52.119 --> 00:19:53.920 on mine, but then it becomes like, Oh, I'm going to have 327 00:19:53.960 --> 00:19:56.559 a list of five things in the six thing is funny or whatever. That's 328 00:19:56.599 --> 00:20:00.839 completely fine. It's just more of a it's to get around the paradox of 329 00:20:00.920 --> 00:20:03.400 choice, right. It's to get around that like a feeling of like I 330 00:20:03.480 --> 00:20:06.880 don't know where to start, and so you just have some of these activities 331 00:20:06.880 --> 00:20:10.150 and you can do them for storytelling, for observations, except where you find 332 00:20:10.190 --> 00:20:12.390 these things you develop on the end. Then ultimately you've got to decide right, 333 00:20:12.430 --> 00:20:15.789 because hopefully you have a list of multiple things, and so when it 334 00:20:15.869 --> 00:20:18.630 comes to deciding, there's a couple things. We have just kind of a 335 00:20:18.670 --> 00:20:22.579 checklist or a flow chart that we encourage people to go through. Can you 336 00:20:22.619 --> 00:20:26.700 tell them an engineer flow charts for humor? But we it starts kind of 337 00:20:26.779 --> 00:20:32.940 with one going back and checking does the humor idea fit your medium, audience 338 00:20:33.059 --> 00:20:34.809 and purpose? Because maybe in the brain storm and you're like, Oh my 339 00:20:34.890 --> 00:20:37.569 God, I have this brilliant idea. We want to do this big thing 340 00:20:37.730 --> 00:20:42.369 that's connecting top business marketers with the NFL draft and stuff like that, but 341 00:20:42.529 --> 00:20:45.410 we were going to send this for an email. Actually doesn't quite make it 342 00:20:45.569 --> 00:20:48.490 match. It's probably better for a video. So we can either say let's 343 00:20:48.490 --> 00:20:52.680 turn that into a video now, or okay, let's put that, you 344 00:20:52.759 --> 00:20:55.680 know, in our humor notebook to come back to later and let's pick a 345 00:20:55.799 --> 00:20:57.640 different idea for the email itself. Right. So you want to do another 346 00:20:57.640 --> 00:21:03.119 sense check of doesn't match your medium audience purpose. The second thing is you 347 00:21:03.160 --> 00:21:06.710 want to check what we call both the newspaper rule and the onion rule. 348 00:21:07.309 --> 00:21:11.470 The newspaper rule is people are sometimes worried about is it appropriate right? Is 349 00:21:11.509 --> 00:21:14.349 it something that you know? Could this get the could this give me fired? 350 00:21:14.670 --> 00:21:17.029 And I think one of the easiest ways to think about this from a 351 00:21:18.509 --> 00:21:22.460 be to be perspective or a business perspective. Not a stanic comedian, but 352 00:21:22.619 --> 00:21:26.099 is a business. Is What I want whatever I did showing up in the 353 00:21:26.220 --> 00:21:30.220 front page of my hometown newspaper or The Wall Street Journal or whatever. And 354 00:21:30.380 --> 00:21:33.170 if you're like, Ha, I don't know if I'd want the Wall Street 355 00:21:33.210 --> 00:21:37.369 Journal publishing that we made fun of Soandso kind of in this way, then 356 00:21:37.410 --> 00:21:41.329 it's probably not appropriate. For Your Business Marketing. If instead you're like, 357 00:21:41.329 --> 00:21:45.049 Oh yeah, I'd want the world to see that I created this like clever 358 00:21:45.250 --> 00:21:48.160 anagram or whatever for things, it's like, okay, then that's probably pretty 359 00:21:48.160 --> 00:21:52.000 good. We also added the onion rule, which is the onion the satirical 360 00:21:52.039 --> 00:21:56.440 newspapers. You don't necessarily want to do something so crazy that it would look 361 00:21:56.440 --> 00:22:00.430 like it's an onion headline, that it's like so addiction. That's just our 362 00:22:00.509 --> 00:22:03.630 own personal thing. As a brand you might decide that might be the case. 363 00:22:03.750 --> 00:22:07.750 Like certain brands, maybe that's good for I would imagine, for most 364 00:22:07.829 --> 00:22:11.630 be too be things. You don't want to seem too wacky or too crazy. 365 00:22:11.950 --> 00:22:14.390 So it's just another sense check to say, okay, is this in 366 00:22:14.509 --> 00:22:18.980 that middle ground between those two areas? And then the last thing as an 367 00:22:18.019 --> 00:22:22.059 individual person creating humor, potentially even as a brand, is doesn't make you 368 00:22:22.180 --> 00:22:26.099 smile to doesn't make you happy. Does it make you laugh? Because when 369 00:22:26.140 --> 00:22:30.250 you do the things that you're interested in, if you're already putting the initials 370 00:22:30.289 --> 00:22:33.450 time in it, your one going to enjoy your work more, which means 371 00:22:33.450 --> 00:22:37.410 you're going to be more effective for the organization and to you are more likely 372 00:22:37.529 --> 00:22:42.089 to deliver it with confident with excitement, etc. Because if you're bored with 373 00:22:42.170 --> 00:22:45.000 your own content, right, you see this all the time with presenters, 374 00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:48.799 where it's like hey, here's this thing, or if you're not confident about 375 00:22:48.839 --> 00:22:52.960 it, then there's no reason the people listening should be confident about it or 376 00:22:53.000 --> 00:22:56.960 excited about it. So you want to do things that naturally gets you confident 377 00:22:56.039 --> 00:23:00.750 and excited about the things so that that energy is contagious. Fantastic. All 378 00:23:00.750 --> 00:23:04.670 right. Moving to this fourth part of the framework, Andrew, it's deliver. 379 00:23:06.190 --> 00:23:11.029 Now we've actually we've developed our ideas, we've picked which one is MAPP 380 00:23:11.150 --> 00:23:14.859 to our map and and now we've got to deliver. Talk to us about 381 00:23:14.980 --> 00:23:18.980 this. Yeah, so this is all the execution, right. We we 382 00:23:18.180 --> 00:23:22.579 know that. You know, there's in all comedy, there is and humor. 383 00:23:22.660 --> 00:23:26.410 There is both content and delivery, and some people are better than others 384 00:23:26.450 --> 00:23:30.809 at different things. Right. The you know, David Sadaris is a fantastic 385 00:23:30.970 --> 00:23:34.890 writer. If you've seen he's he does okay reading some of his own stuff, 386 00:23:34.930 --> 00:23:37.569 but it's more the writing in and of itself that kind of you know 387 00:23:38.250 --> 00:23:42.000 from the page is good versus other people are great, like Dane Cook was 388 00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:45.279 kind of the quintessential person where if you ever looked at Dane Cook's material, 389 00:23:47.240 --> 00:23:48.839 not all of it was like laugh out loud funny just reading it, but 390 00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:52.599 then you saw him perform it and you're like Oh, this person is really 391 00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:56.750 funny. Right. So the delivery of how you do something becomes very important 392 00:23:56.990 --> 00:24:00.269 and when it comes to using humor as a brand, that delivery also becomes 393 00:24:00.349 --> 00:24:06.190 important because one you sometimes have to set the stage for humor. Not Always, 394 00:24:06.230 --> 00:24:07.750 but sometimes, if you're giving a presentation, you might want to. 395 00:24:07.869 --> 00:24:11.700 You might give a quick like I want to share a short story that's going 396 00:24:11.700 --> 00:24:14.900 to relate to what we're talking about today, right, just to set the 397 00:24:14.940 --> 00:24:17.380 stage so that if you were like wait, why are they telling the story 398 00:24:17.420 --> 00:24:19.299 about their grandmother? Oh wait, it's going to be that connection. Right. 399 00:24:19.299 --> 00:24:22.019 So you do want to set the stage. You don't necessarily always set 400 00:24:22.099 --> 00:24:26.250 the stage, although it can be kind of that funny Tonu and tongue in 401 00:24:26.250 --> 00:24:27.690 cheek humors are that I'm going to tell you a joke so that you like 402 00:24:27.809 --> 00:24:30.930 our brand more and give us more money. You might not necessarily say that. 403 00:24:30.970 --> 00:24:33.849 That might just be implied, but sometimes you have to set the stage 404 00:24:33.849 --> 00:24:37.210 to say, okay, this is why humors exist. Executing. Next, 405 00:24:37.289 --> 00:24:40.960 you then have to actually deliver that humor, and what we talk about is 406 00:24:41.079 --> 00:24:45.519 commitment, and commitment being confidence through completion. Because sometimes what will happen, 407 00:24:45.599 --> 00:24:52.240 particularly more in person type events, but also sometimes written as people will start 408 00:24:52.480 --> 00:24:56.670 with apology face. They'll be like here's kind of maybe a joke, is 409 00:24:56.710 --> 00:25:00.390 it okay? And that's not going to help your humor actually execute. Or 410 00:25:00.869 --> 00:25:03.549 so they'll do that either on the front end of like is this okay, 411 00:25:03.630 --> 00:25:07.259 or they'll do it on a back end and they'll try to deliver material and 412 00:25:07.339 --> 00:25:08.180 be like Oh, that was stupid. Anyway, let's move on to this 413 00:25:08.220 --> 00:25:11.220 next thing. Right, you don't want to like undercut yourself, and even 414 00:25:11.220 --> 00:25:14.819 the same thing in writing, though, is you don't want to have too 415 00:25:14.859 --> 00:25:17.539 much preamble. Right, this is just good. You know, he being 416 00:25:17.619 --> 00:25:21.140 brief, and writing is you don't want necessarily like hey, here's the okay, 417 00:25:21.299 --> 00:25:23.170 maybe lead up to it's like note, set up, punchline, deliver 418 00:25:23.490 --> 00:25:27.009 in and out how people laugh. Right, keep it brief, keep it 419 00:25:27.130 --> 00:25:30.849 well structured with set up and punchline, etc. And and allow that to 420 00:25:30.970 --> 00:25:37.440 commit to basically confidence through through completion on the humor and then the final pieces, 421 00:25:37.559 --> 00:25:40.960 you may sometimes need to connect it back to purpose. If it's not 422 00:25:41.039 --> 00:25:42.680 going to be very obvious to your people of like hey, why did you 423 00:25:42.759 --> 00:25:45.079 tell me that story or why did you do this? You can say the 424 00:25:45.200 --> 00:25:49.190 reason I told you that story is blank and now connect the points, connect 425 00:25:49.190 --> 00:25:52.430 the dots for people. The reason why I'm talking so much about baseball is 426 00:25:52.509 --> 00:25:56.430 because actually baseball is a lot like our product that we are going boom, 427 00:25:56.509 --> 00:26:00.069 here the reasons why, and that helps to solidify and this is what a 428 00:26:00.150 --> 00:26:04.180 lot of commercials don't do, the ones that we forget about, is they 429 00:26:04.259 --> 00:26:08.099 don't make that connection back for us. Right the hurting cats from years ago 430 00:26:08.660 --> 00:26:11.460 had a very loose connection of like hey, you know, this thing is 431 00:26:11.539 --> 00:26:15.619 difficult, like hurting cats, but it wasn't a crystal clear connection for us 432 00:26:15.619 --> 00:26:18.569 to then remember back to this thing. So you want to have that crystal 433 00:26:18.609 --> 00:26:23.529 clear connection for the delivery piece. Love it, Andrew. The the fifth 434 00:26:23.609 --> 00:26:29.769 and final part of your framework is debriefing. Talk to us about this. 435 00:26:30.049 --> 00:26:33.000 How where do you see a lot of people messing up when it comes to 436 00:26:33.079 --> 00:26:36.960 the debrief? A lot of times you are messing up is that they don't 437 00:26:36.960 --> 00:26:41.279 do it at all. And so essentially the debrief process is review how things 438 00:26:41.319 --> 00:26:44.880 went, check in from start to finish. Hey, how did the the 439 00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:48.349 the medium, audience and purpose workout? Did that work out? Where you 440 00:26:48.390 --> 00:26:51.990 are accurate and articulate and that? How did the developing of ideas work? 441 00:26:52.069 --> 00:26:53.990 Did it take too long? Was it a good process? WAS IT efficient? 442 00:26:55.269 --> 00:26:56.589 Who is actually good as part of that process? If you're doing it 443 00:26:56.630 --> 00:26:59.789 as a group thing, who are the people to type, you know, 444 00:26:59.910 --> 00:27:03.299 to bring in? Would it be more efficient or effective to bring in a 445 00:27:03.380 --> 00:27:07.059 comedian and ask them for some ideas or to connect with some? Maybe maybe 446 00:27:07.140 --> 00:27:10.059 not. Same thing with this siding. Did you make the right decision? 447 00:27:10.140 --> 00:27:12.420 Do you want to add your own criteria to that humor flow chart of like, 448 00:27:12.500 --> 00:27:15.089 oh, we should also make sure that all of our humor does blank 449 00:27:15.609 --> 00:27:19.890 right? Another thing that we've been working more recently with people is creating a 450 00:27:21.250 --> 00:27:23.849 brand, a humor style guide. So just like you have a brand style 451 00:27:23.930 --> 00:27:26.690 guy, just as you know kind of here the logos, the colors to 452 00:27:26.769 --> 00:27:30.880 use, the outline, etc. You can create a humor style guide. 453 00:27:30.359 --> 00:27:34.440 Does your brand you sarcasm or sat tire? Is it more aggressive or is 454 00:27:34.519 --> 00:27:37.400 it more affiliative? Is it you know, our Pun's okay or not? 455 00:27:37.559 --> 00:27:41.200 Okay, like you know. You can start to articulate that a little bit 456 00:27:41.200 --> 00:27:44.079 more and that could be part of your framework. How did the delivery go? 457 00:27:44.309 --> 00:27:47.109 Was it executed well? Basically, you want to take a look at 458 00:27:47.109 --> 00:27:51.230 it and one you can iterate then on that approach is, Oh hey, 459 00:27:51.349 --> 00:27:53.269 that tweet is actually performing really well. What did we do? What can 460 00:27:53.269 --> 00:27:56.309 we do? Can we do more similar to that idea? Can we follow 461 00:27:56.349 --> 00:28:00.819 that process and knowing that, just like programming, just like standup comedy, 462 00:28:00.859 --> 00:28:04.500 it is an iterative approach that you're going to adapt over time, especially if 463 00:28:04.539 --> 00:28:07.740 it's something like in presentations. Right then it's like, Oh yeah, if 464 00:28:07.779 --> 00:28:11.299 a joke work really well, then keep that for the next time you do 465 00:28:11.380 --> 00:28:14.170 that presentation and now I'll start to build off of the grow off of it, 466 00:28:14.369 --> 00:28:17.609 or even email marketing. At you're doing split testing. Which ones did 467 00:28:17.730 --> 00:28:19.490 well? Okay, let now can I how can I do a little bit 468 00:28:19.529 --> 00:28:22.849 more of that and the future, basically, use as an opportunity to learn 469 00:28:22.890 --> 00:28:26.240 and grow as you go forward. I love it, Andrew. This has 470 00:28:26.279 --> 00:28:33.319 been so tangible. I I'm I've gotten a page of notes here that I'm 471 00:28:33.359 --> 00:28:37.440 going to be talking with our team about. I love your definition of humor 472 00:28:37.480 --> 00:28:41.390 and how you differentiate it between humor and comedy, that it requires different types 473 00:28:41.430 --> 00:28:47.309 of thinking. I love this five part framework. Define, develop, decide, 474 00:28:47.470 --> 00:28:51.950 deliver the brief. I think the BB marketers listening to this are going 475 00:28:51.990 --> 00:28:55.230 to be able to apply a lot of this to what they're doing in their 476 00:28:55.269 --> 00:28:57.980 own marketing. If there's somebody listening that wants to connect with you, wants 477 00:28:57.980 --> 00:29:00.859 to learn more about this stuff, what's the best way for them to connect 478 00:29:00.859 --> 00:29:04.779 with you? Sure the best way is probably to head to our website, 479 00:29:04.779 --> 00:29:07.940 humor. That workscom there we've got, you know, a bunch of free 480 00:29:07.940 --> 00:29:11.289 articles talking more about the map and some of the process and other things that 481 00:29:11.410 --> 00:29:15.210 we've got going on. Link to our book which came out last year. 482 00:29:15.250 --> 00:29:19.289 We're also we also do a number of virtual events. So there's information about 483 00:29:19.329 --> 00:29:23.210 some of our virtual or in person workshops, because our goal is, you 484 00:29:23.289 --> 00:29:29.000 know, we don't do a ton of copywriting for people. Our goal is 485 00:29:29.039 --> 00:29:32.359 rather we would rather teach marketers this skill of humor and then for them to 486 00:29:32.440 --> 00:29:34.680 develop them the selves that they can use kind of going forward. So we 487 00:29:34.759 --> 00:29:38.430 work with teams and things like that at developing that particular skill. Certainly humor 488 00:29:38.509 --> 00:29:41.509 ideas come from that, but it's our intention, you know, that the 489 00:29:41.670 --> 00:29:47.029 teacher person to fish type mindset. And I will say some people like will 490 00:29:47.069 --> 00:29:49.190 listen like that wasn't that funny of a podcast, and this is the engineer 491 00:29:49.349 --> 00:29:52.829 part of taking a part, this is the work of it. So we 492 00:29:52.980 --> 00:29:56.019 try to make all of our programs fun, but also most important is the 493 00:29:56.099 --> 00:29:59.579 engineer first. So you've got at least a couple of takeaways. Hopefully now 494 00:29:59.660 --> 00:30:00.900 that you can say, Oh, I can at least try a comic triple 495 00:30:00.980 --> 00:30:03.299 as a, you know, initial starting point, or I can walk through 496 00:30:03.299 --> 00:30:07.410 that framework. So hopefully maybe laugh or smiled a little bit, but more 497 00:30:07.490 --> 00:30:10.769 importantly, hopefully you do something that leads to better results where you're going forward. 498 00:30:10.809 --> 00:30:14.890 Actually you know how to actually engineer these types of results in your organization. 499 00:30:15.130 --> 00:30:18.329 So even though you didn't laugh hysterically listening to this interview, you can 500 00:30:18.410 --> 00:30:22.440 now go and make your audience laugh after applying what you've learned here Andrew One 501 00:30:22.559 --> 00:30:26.839 on. One final question. Who are you learning from? Or there are 502 00:30:26.880 --> 00:30:30.279 there? Is there anybody in the space that you that you are personally learning 503 00:30:30.319 --> 00:30:33.799 a lot from as it relates to humor and and marketing and business. Well, 504 00:30:33.799 --> 00:30:37.710 I mean one of the beautiful things about deciding that humor something you want 505 00:30:37.710 --> 00:30:41.549 to study a little bit more is that it's a perfect excuse to watch more 506 00:30:41.630 --> 00:30:45.829 stand up comedians. Right. So I just watch Seinfeld's new special that dropped 507 00:30:45.869 --> 00:30:48.750 on Netflix and I had a number of ideas for myself as I was like 508 00:30:48.869 --> 00:30:52.259 going through it and what's his technique and looking at how physics more physical in 509 00:30:52.299 --> 00:30:55.220 this special than he's been and other one. So I love watching that. 510 00:30:55.380 --> 00:30:57.619 Alley Wong, the way that she structures an entire set and brings things that 511 00:30:57.819 --> 00:31:02.380 back, I think is super helpful. Drew Davis as a speaker, a 512 00:31:02.500 --> 00:31:07.369 keynote speaker. He was also at that same virtual marketing conference. Just the 513 00:31:07.450 --> 00:31:11.569 way that he thinks about ideas and executes them, I think is impressive. 514 00:31:11.890 --> 00:31:15.130 And yeah, seeing different brands. Like I said, the Hustle is one 515 00:31:15.210 --> 00:31:18.359 that's great at creating kind of a framework. Cards against humanity is really impressive 516 00:31:18.400 --> 00:31:22.880 in terms of just the way that they kind of think of the anti you 517 00:31:22.960 --> 00:31:26.920 know what you know, led the bit best example was, you know, 518 00:31:26.039 --> 00:31:30.079 from years ago for Black Friday. They increase their prices instead of decreasing them 519 00:31:30.119 --> 00:31:33.309 and it's that kind of a reverend type and it fits their brand right as 520 00:31:33.349 --> 00:31:37.549 within their humor style guide, and so I think seeing organizations like that are 521 00:31:37.789 --> 00:31:41.589 super helpful. And then certainly some were inspired by some of the work of 522 00:31:41.630 --> 00:31:44.750 our clients. Say, Oh yeah, even though IBM is, put unquote, 523 00:31:44.750 --> 00:31:48.779 a more conservative organization, these are some pretty impressive ways that you're they're 524 00:31:48.819 --> 00:31:52.339 using humor internally, so beautiful things. You can find a lot of inspiration 525 00:31:52.380 --> 00:31:53.900 all around the world. I love it. Andrew, thank you so much 526 00:31:53.940 --> 00:31:56.940 for your time and this has been incredible. I really appreciate it absolutely. 527 00:31:56.940 --> 00:32:05.529 Thank you for having me. Hey, everybody, logan with sweet fish here. 528 00:32:05.809 --> 00:32:08.170 If you're a regular listener of BB growth, you know that I'm one 529 00:32:08.210 --> 00:32:12.369 of the cohosts of the show, but you may not know that I also 530 00:32:12.490 --> 00:32:15.759 head up the sales team here at sweetish. So for those of you in 531 00:32:15.920 --> 00:32:19.559 sales or sales offs, I wanted to take a second to share something that's 532 00:32:19.640 --> 00:32:23.279 made us insanely more efficient lately. Our team has been using lead Iq for 533 00:32:23.359 --> 00:32:28.599 the past few months and what used to take us four hours gathering contact data 534 00:32:28.880 --> 00:32:32.309 now takes us only one we're seventy five percent more efficient. We're able to 535 00:32:32.390 --> 00:32:37.950 move faster without bound prospecting and organizing our campaigns is so much easier than before. 536 00:32:38.430 --> 00:32:42.950 I'd highly suggest you guys check out lead Iq as well. You can 537 00:32:42.990 --> 00:32:49.059 check them out at lead iqcom. That's Elle AD iqcom.