Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:04.559 Are you struggling to come up with original content weekend and week out? Start 2 00:00:04.559 --> 00:00:09.189 a podcast, interview your ideal clients, let them talk about what they care 3 00:00:09.230 --> 00:00:14.589 about most and never run out of content ideas again. Learn more at sweet 4 00:00:14.589 --> 00:00:23.699 fish Mediacom. You're listening to be tob growth, a daily podcast for B 5 00:00:23.820 --> 00:00:28.059 TOB leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard before, like Gary Vannerd truck 6 00:00:28.140 --> 00:00:32.020 and Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard from the majority of our guests. 7 00:00:32.659 --> 00:00:36.649 That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors. 8 00:00:37.210 --> 00:00:41.049 Most of our guests are in the trenches leading sales and marketing teams. They're 9 00:00:41.090 --> 00:00:46.570 implementing strategy, they're experimenting with tactics, they're building the fastest growing BTB companies 10 00:00:46.609 --> 00:00:49.770 in the world. My name is James Carberry. I'm the founder of sweet 11 00:00:49.770 --> 00:00:53.399 fish media, a podcast agency for BB brands, and I'm also one of 12 00:00:53.439 --> 00:00:57.439 the CO hosts of the show. When we're not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, 13 00:00:57.600 --> 00:01:00.159 you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of our own business. Will share 14 00:01:00.240 --> 00:01:03.549 the ups and downs of our journey as we attempt to take over the world. 15 00:01:04.189 --> 00:01:15.750 Just getting well maybe let's get into the show. Welcome to the AI 16 00:01:15.950 --> 00:01:19.420 segment of the be tob grills show. I'm your host Samantha Stone, and 17 00:01:19.540 --> 00:01:22.900 today I have my friend who, Steph Miserra, with me, whose last 18 00:01:22.939 --> 00:01:26.379 name might think I terribly mispronounced, and she can correct me in a minute. 19 00:01:26.540 --> 00:01:30.099 So I Apologize Advantage'll say it correctly for you. As you know, 20 00:01:30.340 --> 00:01:34.250 my loyal listeners, I don't often pronounce names correctly. It's a little bit 21 00:01:34.290 --> 00:01:38.010 of a disability that I have. I don't think that disability has a name, 22 00:01:38.049 --> 00:01:42.810 but I wish it did. But nonetheless, super enthusiastic for her to 23 00:01:42.849 --> 00:01:47.129 be here today. She's the founder of the core connect conference and a professor 24 00:01:47.200 --> 00:01:52.200 at Nyu, and the reason we're chatting today as we had the pleasure of 25 00:01:52.319 --> 00:01:57.480 CO presenting at an event that Mark Schaeffer hosted called the uprising a few weeks 26 00:01:57.480 --> 00:02:00.640 ago and we totally hit it off. And one of the reasons that we 27 00:02:00.680 --> 00:02:05.750 hit it off is because we both understand how important artificial intelligence is to marketing 28 00:02:05.790 --> 00:02:09.270 and how much it's an impacting us and how important is for us to understand 29 00:02:09.430 --> 00:02:15.110 how it can help with human interactions, and so I'm thrilled that she's joining 30 00:02:15.150 --> 00:02:19.900 us today to help share a little bit of our private conversations with you on 31 00:02:19.979 --> 00:02:23.780 the podcast today. Welcome. Thank you so much to ment. It's just 32 00:02:23.900 --> 00:02:27.060 so exciting. We've been talking about this to know and making it happen. 33 00:02:27.659 --> 00:02:31.610 And the last name is Mirrsa me on. Is that? Thank you. 34 00:02:32.729 --> 00:02:38.530 I beg you. You almost I was close. I was close. I 35 00:02:38.689 --> 00:02:43.689 have so thank you so much for being here today. I'm really excited. 36 00:02:44.009 --> 00:02:46.680 You have exciting news because you recently launched your own podcast. Is that not 37 00:02:46.879 --> 00:02:53.159 cracked? Yes, it's very, very exciting. I started my podcast about 38 00:02:53.159 --> 00:02:59.030 almost two months ago. It's called clarity connects and it's all about the human 39 00:02:59.069 --> 00:03:04.349 essence and brands, where I talk about branding, marketing and business and the 40 00:03:04.430 --> 00:03:08.110 human aspects as it flows through all those different areas. So I actually did 41 00:03:08.229 --> 00:03:13.460 one episode this morning, so I guess today it's write a podcast day. 42 00:03:13.780 --> 00:03:16.780 So I'm totally enjoying this, this new journey that I'm on now. Well, 43 00:03:16.860 --> 00:03:21.740 I thank you for squeezing us in and I'm really excited. I've had 44 00:03:21.780 --> 00:03:23.580 the chance to listen to you at one or two of the episodes and it's 45 00:03:23.659 --> 00:03:28.370 great and I'm really glad that you're talking about these important issues and I actually 46 00:03:28.409 --> 00:03:32.409 think that's a perfect sort of segue into our conversation today, because when we 47 00:03:32.610 --> 00:03:38.050 talk about artificial intelligence sometimes we get lost in the tech component of what that 48 00:03:38.250 --> 00:03:44.879 means, but in our conversations that we've had, we both recognize that there's 49 00:03:44.879 --> 00:03:49.719 a very human element to how we use this technology and when we use this 50 00:03:49.879 --> 00:03:55.990 technology. That's instrumental to realizing the potential of it and also for holding off 51 00:03:57.150 --> 00:04:02.069 some of the concerns that we might have and abusing the technology in the vein 52 00:04:02.150 --> 00:04:08.990 of focusing on the positive and and helping our audience understand how to apply this 53 00:04:09.110 --> 00:04:12.860 and where to apply list. I'd love to just start by you talking about 54 00:04:12.939 --> 00:04:17.540 the role you think artificial intelligence has an interfacing with people. So I think 55 00:04:17.779 --> 00:04:21.019 I think you do bring a very good point. I think there's right now 56 00:04:21.379 --> 00:04:27.009 with artificial intelligence. It's still in its infancy, but we can already see 57 00:04:27.170 --> 00:04:30.970 the tremendous power that it has and with that power, I think there's a 58 00:04:30.009 --> 00:04:34.810 lot of fear that comes into that because we don't know how it's actually going 59 00:04:34.889 --> 00:04:40.879 to evolve, and I think it's a very important time right now to actually 60 00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:45.279 look at what we want to do with the technology. I mean, we 61 00:04:45.480 --> 00:04:49.480 are the owners of the technology and I think that it is a tremendous tool, 62 00:04:50.120 --> 00:04:55.230 but we also have to make sure that this tool is use it is 63 00:04:55.269 --> 00:04:58.110 a tool. Right, it feels like magic, but at the end of 64 00:04:58.149 --> 00:05:01.430 the day it's a tool. We have to make sure that we're using artificial 65 00:05:01.470 --> 00:05:10.019 intelligence that is helping us in terms of our humanness and also that it's helping 66 00:05:10.060 --> 00:05:15.339 us flourish, that it's actually complimenting the human experience and not taking over the 67 00:05:15.420 --> 00:05:20.339 human experience. And I think that this is where we need to really take 68 00:05:20.490 --> 00:05:25.329 the time to make the decisions that we need to do at this point, 69 00:05:25.649 --> 00:05:29.050 because I think because it's still in this in the infancy stage, it's very 70 00:05:29.410 --> 00:05:33.850 important to have these types of conversations and it's going to be harder interesting to 71 00:05:33.930 --> 00:05:36.120 people say well, you know, yeah, we'll address it. You know, 72 00:05:36.199 --> 00:05:40.600 when we get there, no know where they're. Like we are literally 73 00:05:40.639 --> 00:05:45.000 there and we need to have these conversations before it gets much more complicated. 74 00:05:45.079 --> 00:05:49.189 And I think also what's really important is to always ask ourselves the question, 75 00:05:49.870 --> 00:05:55.949 just because we can use AI, does it mean that we should? That's 76 00:05:55.990 --> 00:06:00.589 a choice. It doesn't mean that just because we have any type of technology 77 00:06:00.110 --> 00:06:04.740 that we should use that technology. And there's an example that I always give, 78 00:06:04.779 --> 00:06:09.459 which is a very simple example, which is pop up. Right, 79 00:06:09.540 --> 00:06:15.540 pop ups is very simple. If the technology that we use on platforms, 80 00:06:15.540 --> 00:06:17.889 that we use on landing pages, but it's through a choice whether you want 81 00:06:17.930 --> 00:06:20.689 to use it or not just because it's there. A lot of people what 82 00:06:20.810 --> 00:06:25.370 they do with their brand or their their personal pages. They say, Oh, 83 00:06:25.410 --> 00:06:27.730 you know, I can put a pop up, but you have to 84 00:06:27.970 --> 00:06:32.279 stop and think, is it actually bringing home the desired outcome that I want 85 00:06:32.360 --> 00:06:39.240 that technology to bring? And I mean I'm very annoyed by pop up because 86 00:06:39.279 --> 00:06:44.759 it's actually interfering with what I'm trying to get at, and so I'm sure 87 00:06:44.879 --> 00:06:47.949 that's not what the person that created the website wanted me to feel, but 88 00:06:48.029 --> 00:06:50.990 that's how I'm feeling and we pretty much, you know, pretty much everybody 89 00:06:51.029 --> 00:06:56.110 feels that way. So I think that's the same type of thought that we 90 00:06:56.310 --> 00:07:00.870 need to think about when we talk about artificial intelligence, is, is this 91 00:07:00.149 --> 00:07:05.019 really going to be a service of what I'm trying to reach as my objective? 92 00:07:05.779 --> 00:07:10.819 I'm so glad that you brought that up, because I think we sometimes 93 00:07:10.899 --> 00:07:15.139 chase shining new objects. We get very, very excited about it and we 94 00:07:15.329 --> 00:07:19.649 don't always take the care we need to understand where is it going to add 95 00:07:19.769 --> 00:07:26.490 value to my interaction with a customer and where is it going to actually take 96 00:07:26.569 --> 00:07:30.639 away from the interaction with our with my customer? And one of the things 97 00:07:30.680 --> 00:07:35.519 that we need to understand is that sometimes artificial intelligence is used directly in their 98 00:07:35.560 --> 00:07:41.040 interaction, like a chat bought, for example, but sometimes it's actually used 99 00:07:41.199 --> 00:07:46.430 behind the scenes and analytics or serving up segmentation models and helping us, where 100 00:07:46.470 --> 00:07:49.589 it's sort of hidden from the person we're interacting with. They don't they don't 101 00:07:49.629 --> 00:07:55.629 see that. When you think about marketers making their plans for two thousand and 102 00:07:55.629 --> 00:08:01.019 twenty and so very sort of right around the corner short term, where are 103 00:08:01.100 --> 00:08:07.420 some of the places that you think marketers should begin their journey of experimenting with 104 00:08:07.620 --> 00:08:11.779 artificial intelligence? So, in the same vein, because I'm the human girl 105 00:08:11.819 --> 00:08:16.290 right, I always try to make sure that whatever we are creating, that 106 00:08:16.449 --> 00:08:20.250 it needs to resonate on a human level because at the end end of the 107 00:08:20.290 --> 00:08:24.089 day, thankfully, we are not robots. We are all human beings. 108 00:08:24.170 --> 00:08:28.639 We are individual human beings. We work with other human beings and we are 109 00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:31.639 trying to sell products and services to other human beings. So therefore we have 110 00:08:31.720 --> 00:08:37.919 to connect on an emotional level and that is an implication that also comes with 111 00:08:37.200 --> 00:08:43.190 with Ai. I think there's different ways to look at how you can include 112 00:08:43.190 --> 00:08:48.870 a eye in marketing. One way that that we can do that is is 113 00:08:48.629 --> 00:08:56.779 actually to inform better from the data of how you do creative so it's really 114 00:08:56.779 --> 00:08:58.139 a little bit like what you were saying in terms of the back end, 115 00:08:58.700 --> 00:09:03.940 because you know, twenty years ago we didn't have that much data. Now 116 00:09:05.059 --> 00:09:07.860 we have ridiculous amounts of data and now we have the opposite problem, right. 117 00:09:09.179 --> 00:09:11.169 So now we have so much data and we don't really know what to 118 00:09:11.289 --> 00:09:16.929 do with it and we don't really know how to actually fist through all of 119 00:09:16.049 --> 00:09:20.889 these points so that we can get certain insights that will help up, help 120 00:09:22.049 --> 00:09:26.879 us directionalize our decisionmaking, and I think this is an area where ai can 121 00:09:28.000 --> 00:09:33.200 be of great use, where you can literally, and again it's not just 122 00:09:33.360 --> 00:09:35.519 to say, okay, we're just going to use AI and we're going to 123 00:09:35.559 --> 00:09:39.190 see what comes out, what the AI is going to tell us in terms 124 00:09:39.230 --> 00:09:43.950 of the output I think it's very important that human at the beginning of the 125 00:09:45.149 --> 00:09:54.179 AI program or implementation process, that the individuals actually are really clear on what 126 00:09:54.379 --> 00:09:58.580 is the objective that we're trying to reach and bring forth those different guard rail 127 00:09:58.580 --> 00:10:03.899 and give that to into the code so that when AI is doing its job, 128 00:10:05.059 --> 00:10:07.610 that it knows what's to do. And I think the other thing that's 129 00:10:07.610 --> 00:10:11.289 really important from the front and before letting ai do its job in terms of 130 00:10:11.610 --> 00:10:16.330 going through the data and honing into what's important and and focusing on those areas, 131 00:10:16.850 --> 00:10:22.919 is to make sure that you are addressing unconscious biases, because that can 132 00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:26.919 come clearly skew the output and it's not going to be what you're going to 133 00:10:28.039 --> 00:10:31.399 be really looking for, that's not really going to be useful data. So 134 00:10:31.799 --> 00:10:35.080 it's really to be cognizant of those two things as number one, to really 135 00:10:35.120 --> 00:10:37.950 know the objective of what it is, and then number two is to make 136 00:10:39.070 --> 00:10:41.909 sure that you're addressing unconscious bys. And what I mean by that, I 137 00:10:41.990 --> 00:10:46.429 guess, in a more concrete way, is to make sure that what is 138 00:10:46.509 --> 00:10:52.580 the content that you're feeding the the AI machine and also who is feeding this 139 00:10:52.659 --> 00:10:54.740 Ai Machine? There's human beings that are going to decide this. So you 140 00:10:54.820 --> 00:11:01.460 need to make sure if that person has an understanding of the full breast of 141 00:11:01.700 --> 00:11:09.289 the types of content and data that we're trying to compile and analyze and so 142 00:11:09.450 --> 00:11:11.889 forth, and from the the other end of it. Then you put all 143 00:11:11.929 --> 00:11:15.850 that stuff into the AI. It does, it does it's magic. It 144 00:11:16.090 --> 00:11:20.039 gives you output and at that point again one it's it's the output. I 145 00:11:20.120 --> 00:11:24.240 don't think you should be taking it just as okay, this is what we're 146 00:11:24.279 --> 00:11:28.840 going to go with. You have to again bring the human lends and look 147 00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:33.590 at the output and to see whether or not this is actually it. Did 148 00:11:33.669 --> 00:11:39.070 we miss something? Is actually the data giving us information, which now we 149 00:11:39.230 --> 00:11:45.590 need to go back and fine tune actually the algorithm so it can give this 150 00:11:45.750 --> 00:11:48.100 more precise information? So you have to have the human judgment at the end 151 00:11:48.100 --> 00:11:52.340 of the day as well and and address any biases that might have fallen through 152 00:11:52.379 --> 00:11:56.740 the crux in order to make a final position. So I think that the 153 00:11:56.820 --> 00:12:01.100 human at the beginning, the AI does its job and the human at the 154 00:12:01.139 --> 00:12:03.690 end, and then once you have that output and it's and it's ebitded, 155 00:12:05.169 --> 00:12:09.169 then you can use that content to actually really inform you in terms of your 156 00:12:09.570 --> 00:12:13.289 creativity and you have much more specific data, much more relevant data, much 157 00:12:13.289 --> 00:12:18.080 more potentially juicy data that you can use to help in the creative process. 158 00:12:18.720 --> 00:12:22.240 I think it's this idea of sort of, I know you didn't call it 159 00:12:22.320 --> 00:12:24.080 an AI sandwich, but you know, sort of that's the visual that I 160 00:12:24.320 --> 00:12:28.159 create when I when I think of this. But I actually think that, 161 00:12:28.320 --> 00:12:31.429 you know, joking aside, that's a really important concept. We often think 162 00:12:31.429 --> 00:12:37.149 of artificial intelligence as living independent of human thought, because we can't keep up 163 00:12:37.269 --> 00:12:39.549 with the speed of thought of machines. But in fact there's a lot of 164 00:12:39.590 --> 00:12:43.820 work, as you've described, in preparing the data that the system will be 165 00:12:43.980 --> 00:12:50.580 using and in interpreting the recommendations that assistem may be giving us and and choosing 166 00:12:50.740 --> 00:12:54.500 when to use and what to use. And so, for those of you 167 00:12:54.580 --> 00:13:01.889 who are beginning to think about things like chat bots and segmentation strategies and personalization 168 00:13:01.009 --> 00:13:07.690 in our web pages and better ads serving and all the places that we as 169 00:13:07.769 --> 00:13:15.120 marketers use artificial intelligence, this point about keeping the human as a part of 170 00:13:15.320 --> 00:13:20.279 the formula and a part of the process isn't just something we can do, 171 00:13:20.080 --> 00:13:22.840 it's actually something we have to do right to stuff. I mean this is 172 00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:30.629 this is actually a responsibility of ours to include that it is absolutely essential for 173 00:13:31.230 --> 00:13:37.470 our evolution on this planet. I mean, I love the author you all 174 00:13:37.590 --> 00:13:39.950 know, a Harari. He wrote the book stapens and he also wrote the 175 00:13:39.990 --> 00:13:45.700 Book Twenty One lessons for the twenty one century, and he has this tremendous 176 00:13:45.860 --> 00:13:50.659 mind that is able to really bring forth all the different aspects of history and 177 00:13:50.740 --> 00:13:56.370 philosophy and marketing and artificial intelligence and uses that from a historical perspective to understand 178 00:13:56.409 --> 00:14:00.970 where we are now and where we are going. And it was really by 179 00:14:01.929 --> 00:14:07.610 by reading his works that I understood just the implications and the impacts of Ai 180 00:14:07.889 --> 00:14:11.200 if we don't talk about it in a very sir regular way in everything that 181 00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:18.200 we're that we're creating. And this is where artificial intelligence and ethics comes into 182 00:14:18.279 --> 00:14:24.669 play, and I actually went to a conference last year. It's from an 183 00:14:24.669 --> 00:14:28.950 entity that's called a I now, artificial intelligence now, and it is a 184 00:14:30.710 --> 00:14:35.269 sort of a collective of different people from Nyu that come together and talk about 185 00:14:35.269 --> 00:14:39.899 the social implications of artificial intelligence. So you have people who are background in 186 00:14:39.980 --> 00:14:43.500 technology, of people in anthropology, you have lawyers and so you have really 187 00:14:43.580 --> 00:14:50.340 rich conversations of all the different implications. And one of the things that's really 188 00:14:50.580 --> 00:14:54.370 important to understand is when we talk about ethics, what ethics really mean in 189 00:14:54.450 --> 00:14:58.929 terms of the definition, because it can feel a little abstract. It's more 190 00:15:00.169 --> 00:15:05.210 principles that govern a person's behavior or conducting of an activity. So when we're 191 00:15:05.210 --> 00:15:09.879 talking about artificial intelligence, you actually need to swap the person part to a 192 00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:16.159 machine. So that basically means that it is moral principles that govern a machine 193 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:22.909 behavior or conducting of an activity. Because as as a very simple way to 194 00:15:22.230 --> 00:15:28.230 talk about artificial intelligence, it's depending on what you feed it. He will 195 00:15:28.230 --> 00:15:31.629 learn from that and then it will grow from there by looking at the environment 196 00:15:31.789 --> 00:15:35.700 that it is exposed to. So it's literally learning from what you're feeding it 197 00:15:37.059 --> 00:15:41.100 and where it's growing. And when we talk about you know, I'm going 198 00:15:41.100 --> 00:15:43.940 to like sway well a little bit from marketing here, but when you talk 199 00:15:45.019 --> 00:15:50.129 about we talk about self driving cars, that's when everything becomes so critical of 200 00:15:50.250 --> 00:15:56.490 understanding how are we going to make these decisions, because before you could philosophize 201 00:15:58.210 --> 00:16:00.049 all the time about well, you know, if I'm sitting in a car 202 00:16:00.330 --> 00:16:04.000 and then you know there's a tree and there's a person walking in front of 203 00:16:04.120 --> 00:16:07.519 me, and obviously I'm going to make the right decision and I'm going to 204 00:16:07.600 --> 00:16:11.879 crash in the tree because I want to kill another person. That being said, 205 00:16:11.399 --> 00:16:15.960 if that actually comes in reality and I'm behind the wheel at that point, 206 00:16:17.039 --> 00:16:18.870 I'm going to make a flid decision. Right. I'm not going to 207 00:16:18.909 --> 00:16:23.669 go through all my principles of whole year than now. I'm actually just going 208 00:16:23.710 --> 00:16:26.549 to go with a gut and I'm going to make a decision at that point 209 00:16:26.590 --> 00:16:30.190 and maybe my intuition is going to kick you know. Who the hell knows 210 00:16:30.470 --> 00:16:33.139 what's going to kick in and I'm going to make the decision I'm going to 211 00:16:33.179 --> 00:16:37.980 make. But when we're dealing with algorithms, that decision needs to be coded 212 00:16:37.059 --> 00:16:44.419 in. It means that decision actually we need to figure out before this unfortunate 213 00:16:44.460 --> 00:16:48.250 accident happens, we actually have to tell the computer now, okay, now, 214 00:16:48.289 --> 00:16:51.889 you're actually going to crash into the tree and then you know you're the 215 00:16:51.929 --> 00:16:56.289 guy that that owns the car who's sleeping in the back might be kails, 216 00:16:56.409 --> 00:17:00.129 or are you going to instead go towards the four year old kid who ran 217 00:17:00.169 --> 00:17:04.000 down the street to grab a ball, and so it's that serious. And 218 00:17:04.160 --> 00:17:08.880 so that's why one of the things that Mr Harare he says is that we 219 00:17:10.039 --> 00:17:15.519 have to really look at engineers now as philosophers, like they have to understand, 220 00:17:15.029 --> 00:17:19.109 they have to understand morality and because they have to embent that in the 221 00:17:19.190 --> 00:17:25.750 code. And that's why it's such a it is and and like any any 222 00:17:26.390 --> 00:17:30.380 powerful tool, I think ai can be used for tremendous good, like it 223 00:17:30.500 --> 00:17:36.220 can be used for tremendous bad. It's all a question of are we going 224 00:17:36.259 --> 00:17:41.339 to take that responsibility, to have full ownership and make the right decisions to 225 00:17:41.539 --> 00:17:45.569 bring in it that direction? And like with any great power comes great responsibility, 226 00:17:45.650 --> 00:17:48.529 and this is another form of that. I love that example because it 227 00:17:48.609 --> 00:17:52.650 seems like very straightforward example when you first say that do I hit a tree 228 00:17:52.650 --> 00:17:53.690 or do I hit a person? Of course the hit the tree. What 229 00:17:53.769 --> 00:17:56.289 if hitting the tree kills the passenger? Right, is just sort of where 230 00:17:56.369 --> 00:18:00.480 where you took that example. And so these are really big, hard decisions 231 00:18:00.519 --> 00:18:03.519 for our human being to make. So now we want to have a machine 232 00:18:03.640 --> 00:18:07.039 make them and it's it's equally hard. And look, that's a it's that's 233 00:18:07.079 --> 00:18:11.559 a dramatic example because we're talking about life and death of a person, but 234 00:18:11.720 --> 00:18:15.630 we make these kinds of decisions every day and our interaction with customers. We 235 00:18:15.789 --> 00:18:22.950 make the decision when our electricity has been turned off for home and someone needs 236 00:18:22.990 --> 00:18:26.710 to explain why the power is off at that person's home and they're calling up 237 00:18:26.750 --> 00:18:30.940 our customer support department, or we're shipping out a an item that a customer 238 00:18:32.059 --> 00:18:36.059 has ordered and we are considering what we put in with it and how do 239 00:18:36.140 --> 00:18:40.059 we pack it. Like every decision we make may not be life threatening, 240 00:18:40.460 --> 00:18:45.289 but they are brand threatening right. They affect how people perceive who we are 241 00:18:45.329 --> 00:18:51.609 as a company and the relationship and how much we value them as a customer. 242 00:18:52.049 --> 00:18:56.160 Absolutely, absolutely. Yeah, I went completely like the the crazy world 243 00:18:56.160 --> 00:18:59.599 that we living in an AI. So we need to really take this seriously. 244 00:18:59.880 --> 00:19:04.440 But absolutely it's also completely applicable in so many small details that that are 245 00:19:04.519 --> 00:19:07.480 important as well from a grand perspective. You know, one of the things 246 00:19:07.480 --> 00:19:11.829 that we have chatted a lot ourselves about, you and I, but also 247 00:19:11.910 --> 00:19:15.109 we see talking about, is sort of the rise and the use of chat 248 00:19:15.230 --> 00:19:22.829 bots. So chat bots are an artificial intelligence engine of some kind interacting with 249 00:19:22.869 --> 00:19:26.460 a real human being who is asking a question or looking for information, typically 250 00:19:26.500 --> 00:19:30.460 on a website or on their mobile device, and we have all seen, 251 00:19:30.539 --> 00:19:34.099 as consumers, a dramatic rise in the availability of it. Now, just 252 00:19:34.420 --> 00:19:37.690 you go on record and say chat blocks can be really useful if I'm looking 253 00:19:37.690 --> 00:19:41.289 for what are your hours, or I'm trying to do something and I don't 254 00:19:41.289 --> 00:19:45.529 necessarily need to talk to human, and sometimes talking to human, frankly, 255 00:19:45.690 --> 00:19:49.490 is overrated right and I just want some information or help finding something. But 256 00:19:49.890 --> 00:19:57.119 there are instances where talking to machine can be very frustrating and may actually not 257 00:19:57.440 --> 00:20:02.839 be the right thing to do. I'm curious, from your perspective, with 258 00:20:02.960 --> 00:20:07.150 this this cone of always being human, what are some of the ways and 259 00:20:07.349 --> 00:20:15.390 places we should not depend on technology but stay true to human to human interactions? 260 00:20:15.869 --> 00:20:19.470 That's a good question. I think we need to it's okay to experiment. 261 00:20:21.190 --> 00:20:25.299 I think it's okay to try. You know what, if I tried 262 00:20:25.619 --> 00:20:33.019 this chat box and see what happens and if I realize that people are aggravated, 263 00:20:33.259 --> 00:20:37.329 that people are not engaging, or maybe it's also like the interface of 264 00:20:37.369 --> 00:20:40.089 the chat bocks and it might not be to Chet pucks itself it could be 265 00:20:40.170 --> 00:20:44.170 many things, and then you need to say, all right, so this 266 00:20:44.369 --> 00:20:48.490 is not working, so how can I actually we make this a little bit 267 00:20:48.529 --> 00:20:52.279 more of a human experience? I feel that the end of the day, 268 00:20:52.839 --> 00:20:59.039 you're trying to create experiences for people that are not just innovative but that needs 269 00:20:59.079 --> 00:21:03.750 to feel comfortable. And what I mean by that is that technology is moving 270 00:21:04.190 --> 00:21:11.309 very fast and human beings are not moving as fast at that the technology is 271 00:21:11.349 --> 00:21:15.750 going, and for some people that might bring a sense of things as anxiety 272 00:21:15.190 --> 00:21:22.140 because they have they're losing control they didn't there's something that feels really unfamiliar and 273 00:21:22.220 --> 00:21:23.660 they don't know how to handle it and they don't even want to go there. 274 00:21:23.740 --> 00:21:29.420 So I think that when you are presenting new technology, new AI, 275 00:21:30.140 --> 00:21:33.569 it's fine to to try to see how much you can push the envelope, 276 00:21:33.930 --> 00:21:37.410 but the user, at the end of the day, still needs to feel 277 00:21:37.410 --> 00:21:41.410 a certain level of comfort of what they already know, and you can you 278 00:21:41.490 --> 00:21:45.410 can sort of build up on that. And there's one thing I was even 279 00:21:45.529 --> 00:21:48.640 talking about thinking about at a certain point, which was, you know, 280 00:21:48.680 --> 00:21:55.680 the iphone is pretty completely novel product. That came through. How many years 281 00:21:55.720 --> 00:21:57.160 ago now? I don't know, like eight years ago, ten years ago 282 00:21:57.200 --> 00:22:03.190 or something like that, and it came through and the people adopted fairly readily, 283 00:22:03.509 --> 00:22:06.509 and so then I started to think, okay, so what was the 284 00:22:06.589 --> 00:22:10.869 comfort level there if it was a completely novel product that was adopted like pretty 285 00:22:10.869 --> 00:22:14.230 much right off the bat? But then, when you start thinking about it, 286 00:22:14.509 --> 00:22:18.940 we were already exposed to the IPOD, so we were already exposed to 287 00:22:18.460 --> 00:22:22.460 that interfaith and that sleekness and sort of that screen was a little bit similar 288 00:22:22.500 --> 00:22:26.539 to that, and so we were already aware of that that product. And 289 00:22:26.660 --> 00:22:30.970 then also there was a phone capability, and we all know what a phone 290 00:22:32.130 --> 00:22:34.329 was because we've already always been around phone. It was just the interface that 291 00:22:34.450 --> 00:22:40.089 was different. So also from that perspective it was already there. The thing 292 00:22:40.130 --> 00:22:45.359 that was extremely novel that wasn't there previously worthy apt and that was an addition 293 00:22:45.720 --> 00:22:49.200 that was completely new. But after thinking about it some more, I think 294 00:22:49.240 --> 00:22:53.200 that's probably one of the reasons why it was able to be so successful, 295 00:22:53.880 --> 00:23:00.750 because it's still had a foundation of elements that we were all already comfortable with 296 00:23:00.990 --> 00:23:04.109 and that we trusted. And and then from those two perspectives, then you 297 00:23:04.190 --> 00:23:11.670 can build on different types of technological aspects that are more abstract, but then 298 00:23:11.750 --> 00:23:15.220 we can adopt further from that point. That's such an important guiding principle, 299 00:23:15.299 --> 00:23:18.740 which is, you know, sometimes things feel like these overnight successes and these 300 00:23:19.059 --> 00:23:22.579 rapid, you know, magic things happen, but the truth is they're typically 301 00:23:22.579 --> 00:23:29.650 building. It's really evolution that revolution, and we what we can control and 302 00:23:29.769 --> 00:23:33.210 what we can do as business leaders is spend the time to figure out what 303 00:23:33.250 --> 00:23:37.089 a natural next step is to evolve over something that we know today, to 304 00:23:37.210 --> 00:23:41.920 get better, to get more intuitive, to improve the relationship we have with 305 00:23:41.039 --> 00:23:48.559 customers. It doesn't have to be fully forming completely new. It will feel 306 00:23:48.640 --> 00:23:52.759 like a new experience, but in fact it's actually has some aspect of familiarity 307 00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:59.670 to it, and that is something that I think we have a big opportunity 308 00:23:59.750 --> 00:24:02.990 around to look at all the places that we interact and say, oh, 309 00:24:03.069 --> 00:24:06.589 how can I just make these three things a little bit better? What what 310 00:24:06.710 --> 00:24:10.019 might I be able to do right and and just say, how can I 311 00:24:10.299 --> 00:24:14.019 make a step back and make this feel a little bit more human, make 312 00:24:14.140 --> 00:24:18.220 this feel a little bit more normal to our usual experience? I'll give you 313 00:24:18.259 --> 00:24:23.140 a quick example. I was talking with a person that that I don't remember 314 00:24:23.140 --> 00:24:26.930 if who was chase that it was. It was one of the it was 315 00:24:26.970 --> 00:24:30.089 at a conference and I was having this conversation and they were saying that they 316 00:24:30.130 --> 00:24:34.849 we were trying to implement into their ATMs. They wanted to have much fewer 317 00:24:34.930 --> 00:24:41.279 tellers, live tellers, and have everything in the ATM. And you know, 318 00:24:41.359 --> 00:24:44.480 most of us goes to the ATM, but you had a certain segments 319 00:24:44.640 --> 00:24:48.640 of people who were more elderly, like sixty, seventy and up, that 320 00:24:48.759 --> 00:24:52.710 would just still go see the teller and they said, you know, we 321 00:24:52.829 --> 00:24:57.750 tried everything. We tried to put like more explanations on the screen and all 322 00:24:57.789 --> 00:25:03.789 that stuff to try to help them through the process, but it still didn't 323 00:25:03.789 --> 00:25:06.789 work. And then I said for them, I said, but why do 324 00:25:06.829 --> 00:25:08.859 you think they go see let's take two steps back. Of what that what 325 00:25:10.099 --> 00:25:14.539 the more human experience could be through the ATM. Why do they go see 326 00:25:14.539 --> 00:25:18.579 the teller? If because they probably know the teller right, so maybe it's 327 00:25:18.700 --> 00:25:22.089 Nadia or Tom, they know, not your Tom. What if you would 328 00:25:22.130 --> 00:25:26.609 put Nadia or Tom's voice in BTM? Or what if you would have their 329 00:25:26.730 --> 00:25:30.849 faith on on the screen and that that helps you through and that's what I 330 00:25:30.970 --> 00:25:37.480 mean is just to go back like what is the original human experience that we 331 00:25:37.640 --> 00:25:44.000 want and how can you start integrating that into a technological platform? And that 332 00:25:44.119 --> 00:25:48.880 way it's innovative but it's also comfortable. And I think you know the big 333 00:25:48.000 --> 00:25:51.670 word. I it's been a while. That's this is a big word and 334 00:25:51.750 --> 00:25:53.910 I think it's going to be here for a while. Disruption. So everybody 335 00:25:53.910 --> 00:25:56.710 wants to disrupt. Everybody wants to disrupt, but I think you have to 336 00:25:56.789 --> 00:26:00.349 take that with a grain of salt. You can disrupt and at the same 337 00:26:00.390 --> 00:26:03.980 time, how do you still remain human? Then is such a good example 338 00:26:04.140 --> 00:26:07.460 because I think about it, and I think you know, I'm going to 339 00:26:07.900 --> 00:26:11.859 believe this bank had goodness in their heart when they're making the decision, but 340 00:26:11.900 --> 00:26:17.019 the decision to get rid of people in the tellers and focus more than machines 341 00:26:17.140 --> 00:26:22.569 really was never a probably about the customers, probably that efficiency and collecting data. 342 00:26:22.210 --> 00:26:27.250 And so instead, if we had taken the frame that said what do 343 00:26:27.369 --> 00:26:33.880 people want to do in our physical environment right and started mapping out the business 344 00:26:34.000 --> 00:26:38.240 things, the way people interact is the big having more automated things may have 345 00:26:38.319 --> 00:26:42.160 ended up still being the solution, but the frame of references did it, 346 00:26:42.240 --> 00:26:47.390 and so the experience they create in those automated things might have more likely had 347 00:26:47.470 --> 00:26:52.750 some of the human elements that you're talking about and that, as leaders and 348 00:26:52.910 --> 00:26:56.589 for those of you who are listening, that's what I want you to do. 349 00:26:56.750 --> 00:26:57.869 That's what we want you to think about. We want you to think 350 00:26:57.869 --> 00:27:02.180 about the ethics. We want you to think about confirmation by us. We 351 00:27:02.299 --> 00:27:08.420 want you to think about the applications of familiarity and do the hard work of 352 00:27:10.619 --> 00:27:15.410 separating what we want from what the people were interacting want and put that front 353 00:27:15.450 --> 00:27:22.410 and center and that let that lead to the technology solutions instead of starting with 354 00:27:22.609 --> 00:27:26.890 the technology and trying to figure out how to apply it to so thank you 355 00:27:26.009 --> 00:27:30.160 so much. If joined, if I could talk for four hours on this 356 00:27:30.359 --> 00:27:33.240 with you, I just think I think you make a very good point. 357 00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:37.519 If the customer, the customer, the customer and, depending on who you're 358 00:27:37.559 --> 00:27:41.680 talking to, the fact that we are all emotional being the fact that still 359 00:27:42.319 --> 00:27:47.470 still with all this technology, fifty to sixty percent of effectiveness of an ad 360 00:27:47.589 --> 00:27:51.750 is based on treativity. That is still who we are, and technology and 361 00:27:51.829 --> 00:27:56.109 artificial intelligence is there to help. Like propagate that, but it is not 362 00:27:56.230 --> 00:28:00.859 the foundation of it. Thank you so much for all of you have been 363 00:28:00.940 --> 00:28:04.220 listening. This has been a really important conversation and you know, it's not 364 00:28:04.299 --> 00:28:07.259 always unto, I wouldive, to talk about people when we talk about artificial 365 00:28:07.299 --> 00:28:12.569 intelligence, but it is imperative that we do so. Thank you so much 366 00:28:12.569 --> 00:28:17.410 for joining us on our discussion today. I would encourage you to check out 367 00:28:17.410 --> 00:28:22.410 two steps podcast. It's a really great continuation of our humanity and understanding how 368 00:28:22.450 --> 00:28:26.730 we interact with people and how to think about it and how to map out 369 00:28:26.730 --> 00:28:30.240 our processes. I wish you a very successful rest of your day and thank 370 00:28:30.279 --> 00:28:33.480 you again for joining us to Suff for those folks who are listening who might 371 00:28:33.519 --> 00:28:37.519 want to follow up with you and learn a little bit more about the podcast, 372 00:28:37.640 --> 00:28:41.319 where can they find it and where can they find you? First of 373 00:28:41.359 --> 00:28:42.829 all, thank you so much again, Samantha, for having me. This 374 00:28:42.990 --> 00:28:48.750 is great. You can follow me on twitter at team there's that. My 375 00:28:48.950 --> 00:28:56.299 podcast is called clarity connects. The website is cloudy Connect Dot Coeo that you 376 00:28:56.380 --> 00:29:00.420 can find me on itunes and anywhere else where there is a podcast and also, 377 00:29:00.460 --> 00:29:03.019 if you want to learn more about me, you can go at my 378 00:29:03.380 --> 00:29:07.940 website, which is truth, and there's Acom. Excellent. Thank you so 379 00:29:07.019 --> 00:29:15.289 much for joining us. Thank you. We totally get it. We publish 380 00:29:15.329 --> 00:29:18.849 a ton of content on this podcast and it can be a lot to keep 381 00:29:18.849 --> 00:29:22.930 up with. That's why we've started the BB growth big three, a no 382 00:29:22.089 --> 00:29:26.880 fluff email that boils down our three biggest takeaways from an entire week of episodes. 383 00:29:27.319 --> 00:29:33.200 Sign up today at Sweet Phish Mediacom Big Three. That sweet fish Mediacom 384 00:29:34.000 --> 00:29:34.759 Big Three
