Transcript
WEBVTT
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accelerating value by proof analytics
is the podcast for marketing,
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communications sales and operations
leaders who want to see their business
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value clearly and succeed. Learn how
leaders are closing the gap between
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creative work and business impact
through raw conversations. Don't
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believe me. Check out the show for
yourself from the CFO perspective it's
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value is what type of revenue
generation earnings cash flow that is
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only adding to the growth of the, of
the enterprise. You know, another
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dimension would be how our margins
performing are we, you know, we're
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getting the right value by seeing
margin expansion by creating products
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services that are generating, you know,
that incremental value to the
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organization. And I think from my lens,
you know that it's monetary in many
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dimensions, right? It's not, you know,
thinking about, okay what say from an
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employee perspective, other
perspectives. But as a leader, as the
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finance leader, as you're looking to
grow the revenue earnings and cash flow
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of an organization, it will only create
more opportunities for your employees,
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for your suppliers, for your customers
based on those services that you're
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creating. So to me that's how I view to
be value for more. Subscribe to the
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show wherever you listen to podcasts.
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Welcome back to be to be growth. My
name is Benji block here with sweet
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fish media and over the past several
episodes we have thrown it back to some
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classics. We have 2000 plus episodes in
our catalog. Always free to go back and
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listen to whenever you want But thought
it would be fun to pull some of those
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for you and the last one that we're
gonna pull for 2021 is a conversation
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that Dan Sanchez had with Dan McCall.
This is a Conversation where they talk
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about marketing automation techniques
that B2B companies can use to create
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some magical experiences for customers
and potential future customers. So this
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is a nerdy one that's kind of why I
liked it. They get into the weeds and
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uh they give away some automation tools
and ideas that I think are really fun
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to listen to and could be helpful for
you going into the new year. Hey hope
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you have a great New year's and have a
fun time celebrating with friends and
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family. Let's jump in to this throwback
episode of B two B growth. Welcome back
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to B. D. B. Growth. I'm dan Sanchez
with sweet fish media and today I'm
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joined by dan mega, who is the founder
of Mccall dot IO and to kick it off
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today dan, I like to come up with just
interesting questions for our guests
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that they haven't been able to prepare
for. And so today I want to ask you
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like what is a fun new marketing tool
that you've discovered recently and
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it's kind of like a fascination to you
right now. Oh, that's a fantastic one
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because I discovered tools like all the
time. I think there are two tools that
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were probably playing with the most
right now is either convert flow dot
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com or write message because we're
really trying to make sure that we can
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tailor that customers experience
through progressive profiling, Those
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are probably the two biggest today.
Nice. I kind of figured you were a tech
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guy tool guy. And the reason why I
figured that is because dan is a
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technical wizard. His company is
focused on marketing automation and
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helping b two B companies with their
automation and making it better. In
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fact, he says it's not enough just to
use marketing automation because it's
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there, but you want to make sure you
use it to make magical experiences and
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that's what we're going to dive into in
this episode. And I have to give you
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some for warning that if this is gonna
get pretty technical, I'm a technical
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marketer myself and I'm probably gonna
ask some technical questions. So if you
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can't hang in, just you know, listen to
it on double time, that's probably
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gonna be some amazing nuggets and ideas
and small case studies. But we'll
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probably be digging into some stuff,
I'll probably be asking some technical
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thing. So just giving you that warning
ahead of time that this is going to be
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a very geeky episode. But the first
thing I wanted to dive into is he was
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talking about in the pre interview what
he's doing with text messages and I
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love marketing automation in SmS
because let's be honest, a lot of
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people ignore email but very few people
ignore SmS when they're getting a text
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message there, checking it generally
within 15 minutes. And while they're
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very simple, you can still load links
in there, which in multimedia, like you
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could still do quite a bit with text
messaging. So I don't see a lot of
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people doing nearly enough of it coming
from a B to Seaworld myself. We were
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heavy in this and I'm curious to see
what dan and his team is doing in that
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realm, dan tell us what you're doing
there. Yeah, great question. So, I mean
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text messages a lot of fun. I think
what we try to focus on the most is
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like one of the, and I'll start with an
easy problem that we really faced is I
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do a lot of speaking in public before
covid happened. I went to a lot of
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conferences and a big problem you have
when you're out in public is you need
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to be able to capture leads and when
you're at a conference and you speak in
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front of 1000 people, you're not
getting any leads from that right? The
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conference has all that unless you buy
the leads list. So the initial problem
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that we started out with is I need the
ability for somebody to be able to text
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me something that would be fun. So they
could get something free and return. So
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something that they're gonna get. So
hey, get my slides because everybody's
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like, hey go to my slides a bit lee
this and like whatever, nobody goes to
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the bitter like, so we decided to come
up with something easy, which is like,
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hey listen, if you text Martek to this
number 4159159011, I'll send you a free
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copy of my book and my text but we'll
take care of all the work and people
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are always like what I get a free copy
of your book if I text this number and
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what people didn't realize is when they
text that it actually connects with our
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marketing automation to autopilot. So
autopilots connected in with Twilio
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when it sees the word Martek, it
creates a new lead record in our system.
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So it saves their phone number for us
and then the first thing it text back
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to them is hey thanks so much for
asking for a free copy of dance book,
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what's your email address? Just in case
if we need a way to follow up with you
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and where are we going to send the
tracking information for that book and
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people would respond back with dan
Imagawa Dario, whatever their email
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addresses and because we're using
autopilot that gets saved as part of
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their lead record. The cool thing is is
that autopilot bought would look for
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that, save that in the field and then
send them another question. So as an
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example, what's your first name, what's
your last name, what's your address?
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What's your city and all that stuff.
And it would go through this full
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conversation and they would send us all
of their information and then it would
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end up with, hey we've got all of your
information, click on this link and
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confirm it for us. So of course they
would click on that link. They then go
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to our website, our website then
automatically identifies them because
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we have their email, it pre fills out
the entire form because of all the
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information they gave us and all I have
to do is click submit and the book is
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automatically shipped to them from our
website. But lo and behold we just
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captured their address, their name,
their email, all of that stuff and
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personalize that experience to them
naturally they get the book, they're
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super impressed. They feel magical.
They have a boat, they're all pumped up.
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But the interesting thing for us is
that we follow up that with as well as
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additional communication with them
through that tech spot. Again, we also
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follow up with them via email. So we
now we're gonna start to approach them
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through various channels. But what's
even more importantly is we identified
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them on our website. So we're able to
cookie them on their mobile device. So
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now anywhere they go, they see my ad
and they see my face all over the
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internet basically to buy our services
and we're constantly trying to close
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that loop in other places, but that's
an easy first stab at some of the easy
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stuff that we've done on SmS, which is
just a lot of fun. It's nice. I like
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the fact that you can go from speaking
on stage to getting them through this
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essentially mini funnel, because they
still have to go through a little baby
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steps through the bot, right? I'm sure
you have follow up systems if they give
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you their email, but then they don't
give you the address, then probably an
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email kicks in to ask for the address,
right? Um to help them finish it up if
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they don't because there's probably a
drop off right each step. But then it's
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kind of like they get, once they finish
it, like, man, they probably go through
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the gauntlet because now you have their
phone number, you have their address,
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you know, where they came from, you
have their name and you can hit them on
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all the channels, hopefully adding
value along the way, but they're not
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gonna forget you. That's for sure.
You're gonna be following them around
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for some time, which is pretty nice,
especially if you're following with
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good value afterwards. What are some
other creative things you've seen in
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text? Yeah, yeah, really, really good
question in regard to that. So we do a
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lot of types of reminders of people
text 11, you have to be able to get
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their their text message right, and
just heard some other easy sign up
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stuff like we've recommended a lot of
people use text message for their
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loyalty programs. Right? So instead of
being like, hey, sign up too stupid
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long form that I want you to fill out
on paper, my brick and mortar location
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and I'll give you this plastic card,
just say, hey, sign up for a loyalty
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program. Text loyal to this number and
they're automatically added. So we've
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seen a lot of companies basically do
that. And then after they actually get
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people into that loyalty program,
they're trying to connect the dots, of
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course using their pos, what they start
to do is then of course actually send
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those people, their promotions,
whatever they may like basically
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through that system. So of course if
you're a snow cone or an ice cream
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company, right, you're naturally going
to be able to send people free promo? S
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get them back into the store. Hey come
in with this text and we'll be able to
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give you these items. Those are some of
the easy ways to be able to kick those
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journeys off. But the big things that
we try to focus on with text because I
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think the problem with texas that you
have to remember, it's annoying as hell,
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right? It's not like email where I can
ignore it. If I get a text message, I'm
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immediately looking at my phone. So if
it's spammy, it's not going to be
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something I pay attention to. So we
highly recommend for people to do it
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mainly based upon somebody requesting a
text reminder. Somebody asking to be
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reminded about something or some sort
of behavior trigger. Right? So when you
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get my book gets delivered to you as an
example, you'll receive a text message
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saying, hey, just so you know, we were
made aware that the book arrived, check
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your door, let us know if it's not
their reply, yes, if it's not there.
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But as a second area of that, you're
gonna get a text message from us also
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five days later, that's gonna say, hey,
listen, we just wanted to see if you
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had a chance to start reading the book,
respond back with five if it's going to
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take you five days to read it and
things like that. We're trying to
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constantly be able to capture
information, but we're also trying to
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make it so that they can also tell us
to go away. But we're not trying to
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send them constant promotions because
spam in your inbox is even worse when
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it's in your sms and all they have to
do is respond stop and you're blocked
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forever. So it's, it's really, really
hard. Yeah. So it's interesting. I've
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always wondered like it's it's not hard
to continue a text message campaign if
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they've started with text because you
set the expectations from the beginning,
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they've given you permission to get in
their inbox. Have you ever found an
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excuse that's like not cringe e but
like a good way to start initiating
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text message conversations because you
have their mobile number. How do you
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get them from being an email subscriber
or someone who's just visiting your
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website or they're interacting with you
in a different way to text message if
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not first initiated there. Yeah, I mean
the common thing that everybody does is
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they just start just start texting them.
Right? So, but the way that we try to
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look at that is we try to associate it
with something that they're gonna want
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to be reminded about something which is
going to create value. Just telling me
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I get 20% off via text messages. That's
not where our relationship is started.
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That's chances are I'm just gonna hit
stop, right? Because I'm not that
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interested in their 20% discount. So
you really do want to make sure that
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it's focused much more on something.
That's timely. Something that's an
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important reminder in our company and
I'm gonna try to use our company cause
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I can't tell you all the things I talk
about with our clients, but it's gonna
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be, hey, you signed up for this webinar.
The webinar starts in an hour, here's a
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link. So that way, if you can't make it
to your desk, click on the link and you
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can see it from your phone. So we're
just trying to use them as helpers. And
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I think that's where I see a lot of
companies kind of go wrong is they try
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to use it as a hardcore marketing
channel. Yeah, it's definitely more
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utilitarian. It's a utility tool. If
you're looking at it that way and how
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that marketing automation can work, it
can be an assist to the marketing. Do
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you ever use it for content though?
That's something I've wondered, I've
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seen Gary V experiment with it and
creating communities and stuff like
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where else have you seen content as
played in text messages? There's
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definitely a content service out there
and I can't hear what it's called. Gary
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V I think is one of the people that
super something around community. It's
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like community dot Co, I can't remember
what it is, but basically like people,
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you text it and then you get part of
their community. So whenever they put
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out content and text you and makes you
aware like, hey, join this thing. I'm
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not a big fan of those just because
that's not how I use text messages, but
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I do know that like when you have a
fans only account, maybe you will send
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text messages to get people to be aware
that you have new content, especially
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when push notifications are turned off.
So there is definitely that opportunity
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once again for most of the use cases
that we see that are really being
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helpful. It's about somebody wanting
something from you on that channel,
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right? So they really have to have a
need for you to send them a text
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message and they should be the one who
basically designs that. Right? So
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that's gonna be like, once again,
somebody needs something, it should be
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a value add to make the experience
better. So that way they can be alerted
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or notified because that's, that's the
thing we have to remember. Text is not
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a marketing channel, it's a
communication channel. It's really,
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really done differently than email
because an email, you have an inbox
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that you don't check with text, you
always check it. So it's a much
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different medium. So it's really got to
be about like important and timely
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messages that need to be looked at now
as a podcaster and marketer. I've
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certainly been thinking about how to
use texting with podcast because
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obviously they're usually listening on
their phone, their phones on them and
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they're on the go, which means they're
not going to be going to a website
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necessarily unless it's really good
right now. But it just seems like a
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good opportunity to get leads or to
walk them through a different part of
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the journey or at least to get even
invite conversation to invite questions
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on a podcast episode. It's not live,
but I don't know, something interesting.
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There probably something we'll be
experimenting with it on this show in
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the future, but we'll see, can I give
you an idea. Sure. So there's two
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things that I would look at in a
podcast. Right? So because naturally I
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do lots of these, I do 4 to 8 podcast a
month. Right? So I see a lot of these
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amazing shows. There's two things that
we would automatically look at just
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like that conference situation, right?
I don't have any access to the people
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that are listening to this. They are
completely on their phone and we have
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no connection to them. So, like I said
earlier, go to 4159159011 and text that
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number Martek and go through that. But
we'll look now. I just got all the
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leads from the people that are in your
audience, right? Because they they want
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a free copy of my book. So that's the
natural obvious one to go for now. In
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your case, an interesting thing that I
would highly recommend if I was doing a
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podcast which hopefully we're going to
work with your company one day to do a
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podcast. I joked about that earlier, I
would roll out polls because since
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everybody's listening to this at a
different time, you have no way to have
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a web interface and say, hey, why don't
you click on this thing Now, if you
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said, hey, listen, what I want you to
do is we want to find out who on this
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podcast is things SmS is the next thing
I want you to text Yes, 24159159011. If
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you are interested in rolling out
podcast and text. No, if you're not.
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And then when that podcast response or
achieving that text message comes in or
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you can use 10 different variables.
Whatever you want to have is the
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promotion. Just respond back with
whatever the results were of everybody
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that's listening to the podcast and
you've just created as a podcast owner
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away to capture their information,
their lead information. But you've also
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made something that's engaging which
provides the listener value, which is I
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can give this response and see what all
the other dodo birds that responded to
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this as well did as well. Which is that
value of knowing the survey response.
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So lots of different ways to do it in
that. And that's where going back to
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the point of sMS, stop using it as a
damn spam channel, right? Like use it
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for something that's engaging. We have
the technology and it's not even hard.
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That's good. What tool is your favorite
texting tool? Um, I know you said
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Twilio and autopilot though. I find
that it's been a while since I've been
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on that combination probably over a
year. I found it pretty limited as far
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as what it could actually do unless you
were like a Twilio developer of some
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kind. Are you customizing the heck out
of Twilio or is autopilot actually
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added more stuff to be able to do that
on. Yeah. So it's, I mean don't get me
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wrong, the connection between Twilio
and autopilot can be a little confusing.
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Right? So definitely like hire a $50 up
work developer and they'll be able to
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make sure that you get going if you
can't figure it out on your own. But
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the actual application that you use
inside of autopilot is actually pretty
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robust. So hey, you can receive a text
message when it has this variable save
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this here. It doesn't do any like
parsing or anything like that. So there
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are some like kind of things you have
to work around. I think text it was the
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other one that we had seen a lot of
companies use and then um, when you're
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like a big enterprise company right? Of
course you can build whatever you want,
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we see for a lot of e commerce
companies them using a company called
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blue shift, their customer data
platform. But that's more about sending
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compared to receiving. And that's the
big difference is not all the services
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allow you to receive, They allow you
just send, yeah, actually prefer long
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codes versus short code so that you can
kind of fly under the radar a little
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bit better and people don't know short
code sometimes I don't know if you've
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run into this, but people like they're
like, wait, what, where's the rest of
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the numbers, especially if it's like
baby boomers or something. They're just
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like we're missing numbers. I'm like,
so I like giving the long code. It
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actually seems more like a real number,
especially if I call from that number,
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which I don't think you can call from
short codes. Right? But a lot of times
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I might follow up with an actual phone
call from the same number and we're
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already in a texting conversation. They
recognize it, take the call versus not
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right. There's a cool technology that I
forgot about, especially for
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salespeople. It's called sales message.
So sales msG dot com, Not to be
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confused with the msg from bourbon
chicken, but sales msg dot com, they're
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integrated in with hubspot. There's
this pretty cool, my buddy chris bryson
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owns that company because it allows you
to have two way conversation from your
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cell phone and things like that through
hubspot but mainly used for sales. That
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was another really cool texting
technology, which I see a lot of
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companies using now awesome. Hey
everybody Logan with sweet fish here.
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If you're a regular listener of GDP
growth, you know that I'm one of the co
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hosts of the show but you may not know
that. I also head up the sales team
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00:17:30.230 --> 00:17:34.790
here at sweet fish. So for those of you
in sales or sales ops I wanted to take
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a second to share something that's made
us insanely more efficient lately. Our
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00:17:39.000 --> 00:17:43.100
team has been using lead I. Q. For the
past few months. And what used to take
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00:17:43.100 --> 00:17:48.830
us four hours gathering contact data
now takes us only one where 75% more
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00:17:48.830 --> 00:17:52.550
efficient. We're able to move faster
with outbound prospecting and
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00:17:52.560 --> 00:17:57.250
organizing our campaigns is so much
easier than before. I'd highly suggest
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00:17:57.250 --> 00:18:01.460
you guys check out lead I. Q. As well.
You can check them out at lead I. Q.
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Dot com. That's L E A D I. Q dot com.
Alright, let's get back to the show. So
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moving on from text. I wanted to learn
more about you said direct mail and I
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just got excited because honestly even
as a digital marketer, I know that like
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if you can hit direct mail well like as
not in sending mail to people who have
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no idea who you are but you're using it
as part of your funnel, it's magic
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because people don't expect it anymore.
You send a letter and you're a tech
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company. It just blows their minds
sometimes even if it's boring, they
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still notice it. Right? So what are you
doing with direct mail and automation?
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Yeah. Really really good question. And
once again like you don't have to do
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this with autopilot. There's multiple
other technologies that do this.
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There's a company called lob dot com.
So L O B dot com that makes direct mail
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really really easy and basically you
can use their product if you import
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your emails and home addresses to it,
you can basically send whatever you
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want. You can do batch and blast and
stuff like that. So what we've tried to
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do is make sure that we actually add to
the customer journey by using direct
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mail. So as an example when somebody
orders my book, we manage that through
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a direct mail integration in with
Windows so and lob and as well as some
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other services. So when somebody does
that text message experience with us,
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we get their email address, we also get
their direct mail address. So naturally
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they're going to get a copy of that
book and they're going to receive a
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digital experience with us. That's
going to happen online through email
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also through retargeting and things
like that. They're going to get a copy
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of my book and then if they don't do
certain actions or if they do do
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certain actions, we're going to then
send them postcards. Those postcards
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are going to be tailored to them and
one of the common ones that we use is
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we learn the technology that your site
uses. So just to use my business as an
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example because it's really easy. We
specifically sell the companies that
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are trying to improve their marketing
technology, marketing automation or
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analytics. But we like certain
technologies. So if you're using
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segment autopilot or amplitude on your
website, we know that we have an
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integration with built with that
directly integration with our site,
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integrate them with our sales force and
our autopilot. And what happens is when
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you give us your email and has a domain,
it pings that service and tells us the
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technology you have, if it sees one of
those technologies segment equals true,
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it's then going to take that variable,
send it over to autopilot. It's then
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gonna put in, hey joe, we noticed that
you're using segment on your site. We
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recently sent you a copy of dance free
book and we sent it to this address. We
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just wanted to make sure that you have
a flyer about some of the information
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that we want to teach you about segment
right? As an example they then get this
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direct mail and the first thing they go
was like how did they know I use
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segment Right? How do they know I have
these technologies? Is anybody like
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waving the creepy flag and calling you
back or is it more as a good or bad?
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I'm sure there's some people that are
freaked out by it but most people don't
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really think too much about it but we
definitely have one of my talks is
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about creepy. So if you want to see the
creepy flow text, creepy 24159159011
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you'll get something creepy in your
email as long as you are not in the
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Martek flow but yes, sometimes people
are like how do they know this stuff
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but that's actually where the magic
comes from, right? And that's what
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people really, really look for is when
they were getting they get something
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that they never expected could be
possible. And that's where the magic
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really comes into play. And those
postcards tell you the four reasons why
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you should use a segment or the four
reasons why you should use amplitude.
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And it resonates with them because they
naturally have that technology and it
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connects them directly with us because
it wasn't something that they were
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expecting. So that's just one of the
ways that you could use direct mail.
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You're doing anything beyond postcards.
And postcards is kind of like, it's
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just showcasing what you do and how
much information, you know, I mean,
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it's kind of nice for you guys because
you can put that information to use and
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it's almost novel in itself, but I'd
love to hear if it's possible to get
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like one case study of direct mail that
you're using for a customer without
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trying the customer's name or whatever.
That's not a marketing automation
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technology company, like how you're
putting some of that information to use
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and direct mail. Yeah, So we work with
a large insurance company. They do auto
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insurance, home insurance and things
like that. So what we have is we have a
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direct mail service which is
immediately attached their salesforce
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Marketing cloud, Salesforce Marketing
Cloud basically when an attribute
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happens, we send a web hook over to the
direct mail service. The direct mail
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service is basically sending out those
letters. So those letters that are sent
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out to those people are basically
because they hit a certain credit score
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because they have a life attribute. So
we're basically pulling in data from
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all kinds of other third party services,
whether that be experience or anything
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else like that. These are basically
purchased lists as that data comes into
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us. These are former customers or
people who are in a prospect list as
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that data is coming to us And we're
starting to see that somebody is above
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700 credit score or somebody recently
purchased house. What happens is market
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or excuse me, Salesforce Marketing
cloud then sends an api call to say
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send this direct mail mailer, those are
all gonna be enveloped mailers because
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they are things that we don't want the
public to see. And inside that mailer
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may say congratulations on the new
purchase of your home. We're here
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whenever you need to have home
insurance or auto insurance, things
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like that because this insurance
company is selling to hire more fluent
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buyers. They're not like trying to
compete with Geico when somebody has a
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higher credit score, we're gonna send
them auto insurance quotes, things like
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that. So there's a lot of different
ways that you can leverage those
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technologies. But I will say when
you're working with a large insurance
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company like this, it's nowhere near is
easy because they're using like old
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archaic systems but definitely all
still really, really possible. And the
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last thing that I would say that I
would love to do is that we like taking
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data from all kinds of enrichment
sources and using that. And there's a
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technology out there. It's called Small
Body I think is what it is. It's a
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small business enrichment service so it
knows all the attributes about small
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businesses, but it makes it really,
really easy to get the fire signals of
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what's going on there and then the
address and then you can send direct
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mail to those people and once again,
you can do that using autopilot or any
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other technology that's integrated in
with lob to automate that whole
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experience be interesting to see even
using it as an A. B. M. Campaign if you
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had a list of ideal buyers but didn't
know as much about them as you like.
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What kind of sources are usually
tapping into to enhance the information
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around their, their company or the
individual buyers within a Yeah. Just
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to make sure I understand. So you have
one lead at a company but you want to
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expand out to the entire account and
try to get other decision makers
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involved there too. Is that kind of the
question right. Or just more
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information about the company? Like how
big is the company? How many employees
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they have if they're public. Like what
was the revenue? Like how big company
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isn't Exactly, it's right. You can
scrape list from things like angel list,
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but you don't always have all the if
you'd like. Right. Yeah. The most
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common one that people were using for a
long time is a company called Clear Bit
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dot com. Uh They integrate in with
Salesforce market, all that stuff. They
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00:24:37.890 --> 00:24:41.520
have a great A. P. I. They have a CSB
import thing and clear but would enable
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you with an email address to
automatically be able to get anybody's
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information right? So you can get for
demographic, demographic and techno
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graphic which is really valuable to us.
I now know all the technologies that
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are on your website which is super
super helpful even if you're not in a
403
00:24:53.730 --> 00:24:56.630
business like me knowing the
technologies that are on another
404
00:24:56.630 --> 00:24:58.890
businesses site really helps you
understand how much money they're
405
00:24:58.890 --> 00:25:02.800
willing to spend because if they have
adobe analytics they spend a lot more
406
00:25:02.800 --> 00:25:06.130
money on on things compared to google
analytics free. They're not willing to
407
00:25:06.130 --> 00:25:09.650
spend any money. So it definitely good
signals for other other people. Clear.
408
00:25:09.650 --> 00:25:13.010
But a really really good technology for
that. I would also recommend built with
409
00:25:13.020 --> 00:25:15.460
built with dot com which is
specifically for knowing the
410
00:25:15.460 --> 00:25:18.980
technologies on people's sight even
though that they focus on that they
411
00:25:18.980 --> 00:25:22.630
still give you all of this metadata for
demographic information for a very low
412
00:25:22.630 --> 00:25:25.930
cost. So they can be really really
helpful naturally. You have like
413
00:25:25.930 --> 00:25:30.740
discover or zoom in for all the big big
big players in the space but full
414
00:25:30.740 --> 00:25:34.020
contact dot com is really really
popular for demographic. Not as good on
415
00:25:34.020 --> 00:25:37.320
the firm. A graphic space, not gonna
lie there. But those are the kind of
416
00:25:37.320 --> 00:25:41.350
the main players in that firm. A
graphic as we would call uh space.
417
00:25:41.740 --> 00:25:46.820
Fantastic. And the last one I like to
jump into is email and that seems like
418
00:25:46.830 --> 00:25:51.650
kind of boring vanilla when it comes to
marketing automation. But how do you
419
00:25:51.650 --> 00:25:55.600
make it not that you know, how do you
make it go beyond the normal drip that
420
00:25:55.600 --> 00:25:58.540
everybody sets up? Which is always
makes me want to cry. I'm like you have
421
00:25:58.540 --> 00:26:01.230
this robust marketing automation tool
and the only thing you can do is set up
422
00:26:01.230 --> 00:26:04.790
a drip campaign for your lead for him.
Like what do you usually do to go
423
00:26:04.790 --> 00:26:08.960
beyond that? And what are some early
triggers and behaviors you can map to.
424
00:26:09.140 --> 00:26:12.900
And just your normal, let's just say a
B two B saas company who's trying to
425
00:26:12.900 --> 00:26:16.470
drive the demos is doing content,
marketing and doing a lot of these
426
00:26:16.470 --> 00:26:21.200
normal demand gen campaigns. Yeah, well
I definitely want to, I mean one thing
427
00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:23.890
to start out with your B two B saas
company naturally you have automation
428
00:26:23.890 --> 00:26:26.200
which is going to be sent by the sales
reps and you're gonna have automation
429
00:26:26.200 --> 00:26:30.140
which is sent by marketing right? And I
want to always advise people. Do not
430
00:26:30.140 --> 00:26:33.830
hesitate to send out sales emails
through your marketing automation tool?
431
00:26:33.830 --> 00:26:36.330
Yes, they're not gonna like you for it,
but I don't really care for marketing
432
00:26:36.330 --> 00:26:38.890
automation tool doesn't like me. Um
just make sure you have your
433
00:26:38.890 --> 00:26:43.240
unsubscribe links in there and make it
a plain text email. Right? So like if
434
00:26:43.240 --> 00:26:46.680
you need to use your automation tool to
enable superpower automation, then do
435
00:26:46.680 --> 00:26:50.000
it. If you don't have access to all the
engineers in the world to do send grid
436
00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:52.670
stuff, who cares? Just send it out to
your map, right, your marketing
437
00:26:52.670 --> 00:26:55.930
automation platform. But in either case
I think the biggest thing that you want
438
00:26:55.930 --> 00:26:58.780
to look for is right, you have to
understand the triggers at which people
439
00:26:58.780 --> 00:27:01.150
are going to get value and this really
helps you with your ideal customer
440
00:27:01.150 --> 00:27:04.540
profile, understand the triggers that
why somebody would be interested in
441
00:27:04.540 --> 00:27:07.460
your product or why somebody is
interested in your service and try to
442
00:27:07.460 --> 00:27:10.190
understand those signals because if you
can get those signals from third
443
00:27:10.190 --> 00:27:13.080
parties, like I talked about clear bit
enrichment, talked about built with
444
00:27:13.080 --> 00:27:16.740
things like that. Um it's really,
really helpful to send target emails
445
00:27:16.740 --> 00:27:20.070
based upon actions that are happening
in a company or actions that are
446
00:27:20.070 --> 00:27:22.760
happening for an individual. And I'll
just say if you're doing like outbound
447
00:27:22.760 --> 00:27:26.680
prospecting a key attribute like that
we look for is new VP of marketing and
448
00:27:26.680 --> 00:27:29.660
company that's an immediate reach out
for us. If somebody's within three
449
00:27:29.660 --> 00:27:33.780
months of starting as a new VP or a new
CMO that's an immediate insight for us
450
00:27:33.780 --> 00:27:37.010
to be able to reach out. We have an
entirely automated system to tell us
451
00:27:37.010 --> 00:27:39.940
about that. And then of course we reach
out to them and say, hey, you're brand
452
00:27:39.940 --> 00:27:42.820
new at the company, looks like you're,
you're probably going to be looking to
453
00:27:42.830 --> 00:27:45.770
overhaul your marketing technology
stack. So that's an easy thing that I
454
00:27:45.770 --> 00:27:50.060
would say if you're a SAAS company, say
you're in marketing tech or say even an
455
00:27:50.060 --> 00:27:54.290
insurance, look for new CFOs at a
company. Hey, you congratulations on
456
00:27:54.290 --> 00:27:57.540
the new position notice, you just
started. This can be all completely
457
00:27:57.540 --> 00:27:59.920
automated. You don't actually have to
know that they just started, you can
458
00:27:59.920 --> 00:28:02.990
buy that data and that's a really,
really good way to start that
459
00:28:02.990 --> 00:28:06.880
conversation and tailor that. And then
the secondary part to that is try to
460
00:28:06.880 --> 00:28:10.230
make it so that you're not wasting
their time and add personalization to
461
00:28:10.230 --> 00:28:13.880
that email, try to make it as magical
as possible. Right? So, and then
462
00:28:13.880 --> 00:28:17.090
leverage the direct mail, like I had
talked about before right? To add in
463
00:28:17.090 --> 00:28:20.270
that extra magic. Like hey, I sent you
a piece of mail the other day. Did you
464
00:28:20.270 --> 00:28:24.660
get that? Every single person who gets
an email that says you just got mail
465
00:28:24.660 --> 00:28:28.040
for me is gonna look and see if they
got mail from you and then they're
466
00:28:28.040 --> 00:28:30.780
gonna respond and say, no, it hasn't
arrived here. Yes, it has arrived. I'm
467
00:28:30.780 --> 00:28:33.830
talking about not everybody, but these
are simple multi channel things which
468
00:28:33.830 --> 00:28:37.250
are going to push your conversions
higher and get you going. And I think
469
00:28:37.250 --> 00:28:40.650
from an outbound perspective for SAs
that's really, really helpful. So where
470
00:28:40.650 --> 00:28:43.980
are you, where are you buying
subscriptions like this to find out if
471
00:28:43.980 --> 00:28:47.710
a new CFO started at a certain segment
of companies that you would sell to you,
472
00:28:47.710 --> 00:28:50.230
where are you buying the subscriptions
and are you buying a subscription of
473
00:28:50.230 --> 00:28:54.150
information that then plugs into your
marketing automation software? So it's
474
00:28:54.150 --> 00:28:57.450
just like each time that happens and
they find out about a new one, it just
475
00:28:57.460 --> 00:29:01.330
runs into your marketing automation
part flow. Yeah. I'm actually gonna try
476
00:29:01.330 --> 00:29:05.890
to pull up a service right now. Get
Rocket signal I think is one of the
477
00:29:05.890 --> 00:29:10.880
companies that get rocket signals dot
com I think is one of the signals I
478
00:29:10.880 --> 00:29:14.050
think that has that unfortunately I'm
struggling to pull it up at rocket
479
00:29:14.050 --> 00:29:18.340
signals. Is the company that gives us a
lot of that data as well for new hires.
480
00:29:18.350 --> 00:29:21.770
Um there's other services out there
that give this stuff too and I'm just
481
00:29:21.770 --> 00:29:26.590
trying to pull up some of the different
things it used to be called Zen put or
482
00:29:26.590 --> 00:29:30.220
then reach. I think it was enrich and I
can't remember what they become with
483
00:29:30.220 --> 00:29:33.550
their new name was but they were also
another company that was able to really
484
00:29:33.550 --> 00:29:38.920
be able to get you that that real time
data we use job postings I know in our
485
00:29:38.920 --> 00:29:42.450
company as well as a secondary source
of understanding that somebody's gonna
486
00:29:42.450 --> 00:29:45.960
be leaving their job and to look at a
new company, rocket signals is the one
487
00:29:45.960 --> 00:29:49.020
that we get new hires from. We have
access to a lot of apps that give us a
488
00:29:49.020 --> 00:29:52.680
lot of information and deliver leads to
us. Crunch base would be another really
489
00:29:52.680 --> 00:29:56.100
good place of signals. They always tell
you like somebody got funded, somebody
490
00:29:56.100 --> 00:30:00.140
changed the role. They added this new
executive. That's a huge channel for
491
00:30:00.140 --> 00:30:03.530
that stuff, adding technologies to
people's websites, which is another
492
00:30:03.530 --> 00:30:07.200
common thing we use, which is I already
mentioned, built with clear bit keeps
493
00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:10.260
us updated in regards to like any other
firm a graphic, that stuff changes on a
494
00:30:10.260 --> 00:30:14.360
monthly basis for us. We use radar and
some of our clients mobile apps that
495
00:30:14.360 --> 00:30:17.620
basically tell us when somebody's near
anything that's a geo fence location.
496
00:30:17.630 --> 00:30:20.550
Typically that's used for, hey,
somebody's at this location, send them
497
00:30:20.550 --> 00:30:24.340
a push notification. So they know you
have a free whopper in our situation.
498
00:30:24.340 --> 00:30:27.140
We're like, hey, tell us that
somebody's near our competitor and send
499
00:30:27.140 --> 00:30:30.990
us a notification. So that way we know
that they're doing something. I
500
00:30:31.000 --> 00:30:34.760
remember you mentioned zen reach, which
isn't, isn't what you said it was. But
501
00:30:34.760 --> 00:30:38.630
I've used to enrich it's actually more
of a coffee shop bar marketing
502
00:30:38.630 --> 00:30:42.370
automation system. So if someone walks
into a coffee shop and you log into
503
00:30:42.370 --> 00:30:45.780
their wifi, they now know every time
you walk into the coffee shop whether
504
00:30:45.780 --> 00:30:49.760
you logged into the wifi or not because
of the Miami code on your what you
505
00:30:49.760 --> 00:30:53.210
can't wipe. But that's a fantastic
marketing automation tool. But it's for
506
00:30:53.220 --> 00:30:56.440
it's for restaurants. Yeah, zen which
is really good. And actually one thing
507
00:30:56.440 --> 00:30:59.000
that's really, really creepy and I want
everybody to know this about their
508
00:30:59.000 --> 00:31:03.920
Alexa. Your Alexa is attached to your
home wifi and it has a thing called, I
509
00:31:03.920 --> 00:31:07.590
think it's called sidewalk in it. So
every single person who walks by your
510
00:31:07.590 --> 00:31:12.100
house as their phone passes your house,
it connects to your Wifi and the I. M.
511
00:31:12.100 --> 00:31:15.840
E. I. Number is connected to your thing
and they get access to your internet.
512
00:31:15.850 --> 00:31:19.930
And Jeff Bezos tracks every single
thing. Um and there's like three
513
00:31:19.930 --> 00:31:24.460
features, I saw it on Tiktok, but turn
off sidewalk, turn off, save
514
00:31:24.470 --> 00:31:27.910
communication, history and then turn
off like can listen to everything in
515
00:31:27.910 --> 00:31:32.670
your Alexa because Alexa records every
single thing you say and keeps it and
516
00:31:32.670 --> 00:31:36.380
then they email it to Jeff Bezos and he
leads it reads it as his nighttime
517
00:31:36.380 --> 00:31:42.530
story. All of this is true except for
the Jeff Bezos part at the end, but
518
00:31:42.530 --> 00:31:46.430
sidewalk is terrifying. He tracked if
he wanted to, he could, that's the
519
00:31:46.430 --> 00:31:50.030
thing, if you could, but zen reaches
super cool as you pass by the locations,
520
00:31:50.030 --> 00:31:53.590
it's good, oh man, the internet is
creepy. But I mean just to take a step
521
00:31:53.590 --> 00:31:56.850
further and just to help you understand
of like where this gets super super
522
00:31:56.850 --> 00:32:01.430
creepy and we see this happening. So as
an example we worked with the company
523
00:32:01.440 --> 00:32:05.780
Caros I can't marry this, its facial
recognition and facial sentiment. So
524
00:32:05.780 --> 00:32:09.000
basically facebook, your profile images
public, your first and last name of
525
00:32:09.000 --> 00:32:11.780
public. So people have basically
downloaded all the facebook, all of
526
00:32:11.780 --> 00:32:14.980
Lincoln and all these things and
profiled all of the faces. So what
527
00:32:14.980 --> 00:32:18.490
happens is these have been put into
massive databases by amazon and other
528
00:32:18.490 --> 00:32:22.260
companies. So as Karros is basically
tracking every person who walks into a
529
00:32:22.260 --> 00:32:26.110
restaurant within a matter of a second,
they automatically know within about a
530
00:32:26.110 --> 00:32:30.200
95% accuracy who has just walked into
the restaurant with their first name,
531
00:32:30.200 --> 00:32:33.130
their last name and potentially any
other attributes they know they then
532
00:32:33.130 --> 00:32:36.490
also know the sentiment of that person
and contract that So I don't know if
533
00:32:36.490 --> 00:32:40.170
you've ever been to target but if
you're at target and you use the self
534
00:32:40.170 --> 00:32:44.420
checkout, you use your credit card, you
walk up to a screen that screen
535
00:32:44.420 --> 00:32:47.220
recognize you because there's a camera
and your credit card gets attached to
536
00:32:47.220 --> 00:32:50.780
it. Target then takes that credit card
information that facial recognition
537
00:32:50.780 --> 00:32:54.490
maps it back to facebook that know
exactly who you are credit card then
538
00:32:54.490 --> 00:32:58.240
gets mapped to experience. So they can
download every bit of information. Do
539
00:32:58.240 --> 00:33:01.450
you like cars? Do you like magazines,
do you drive a suburban all of this
540
00:33:01.450 --> 00:33:05.860
stuff? And then they buy it on the as
we like to call it the red market right?
541
00:33:05.860 --> 00:33:08.950
It's red hot. Nobody wants to know it's
there and they use all that stuff so
542
00:33:08.950 --> 00:33:11.470
they can then predict whether you're
going to be pregnant in the next six
543
00:33:11.470 --> 00:33:16.180
months so they can send you ads like it
is just the amount of personalization
544
00:33:16.180 --> 00:33:24.530
which is out there. It's crazy. That's
why text creepy to 9154159011. And if
545
00:33:24.530 --> 00:33:27.240
you're well known on the internet
you'll understand how creepy the
546
00:33:27.240 --> 00:33:31.010
enrichment services I have because
you'll get an email from me that has
547
00:33:31.010 --> 00:33:34.150
all the creepy information the internet
knows about you. This is a new level of
548
00:33:34.150 --> 00:33:36.890
creepy man. I mean I just watched that
documentary on netflix. I can't
549
00:33:36.890 --> 00:33:39.830
remember what it's called but I
remember watching it being like yeah we
550
00:33:39.840 --> 00:33:42.200
marketers have been all over this for a
while. There's nothing new in this
551
00:33:42.200 --> 00:33:46.570
documentary. That's surprising me.
Social dilemma. Their social dilemma.
552
00:33:46.580 --> 00:33:50.450
I'm sure everybody was waking up to the
fact that how deeply marketers were
553
00:33:50.450 --> 00:33:54.870
thinking about your interactions and
behaviors and I'm like I'm only I'm not
554
00:33:54.870 --> 00:33:59.110
like a big player in this. I'm just a
small guy. I'm only spending $100,000
555
00:33:59.110 --> 00:34:02.770
on Facebook ads. I'm only spending I'm
only mean a small team putting together
556
00:34:02.770 --> 00:34:05.720
marketing automation campaigns and
trying to tap into the available A. P.
557
00:34:05.720 --> 00:34:08.610
I. S and facebook marketing and all
that kind of stuff and I know about
558
00:34:08.610 --> 00:34:11.190
this, I'm like I can't imagine what
some people are doing it like at the
559
00:34:11.190 --> 00:34:16.530
top who are like Rhodes scholars and
stuff targets the best man target is
560
00:34:16.530 --> 00:34:21.650
the best Look up target, predicts
pregnancy of teenager, look up that
561
00:34:21.650 --> 00:34:27.440
story and that was like years ago.
Their data science team is legit. Oh
562
00:34:27.440 --> 00:34:31.460
cool man, this has been a fun episode
and I hope everybody hearing it has
563
00:34:31.460 --> 00:34:35.130
gotten some great nuggets and has
texted both those numbers for some fun
564
00:34:35.139 --> 00:34:39.889
and a free book dan to wrap things up.
Where can people learn more from you
565
00:34:39.900 --> 00:34:46.719
and about you? Yeah, so go to my God
dot Io, so m C G A W dot Io check out
566
00:34:46.719 --> 00:34:49.420
our website so you can learn a lot of
stuff on there and follow me on
567
00:34:49.420 --> 00:34:53.239
linkedin, it's just Daniel ***, I'm
most active on linkedin. I don't do the
568
00:34:53.239 --> 00:34:55.840
whole twitter thing but check me out on
linkedin, I'm happy to have a
569
00:34:55.840 --> 00:35:00.210
conversation. Fantastic! Thanks again
so much for joining us on the show
570
00:35:00.210 --> 00:35:05.890
today. Thanks for having me another
great conversation Here on B two B
571
00:35:05.890 --> 00:35:10.850
growth as always, you can connect with
me over on linkedin. Just search Benji
572
00:35:10.850 --> 00:35:15.480
block, subscribe to be to be growth on
your favorite subscription service to
573
00:35:15.480 --> 00:35:20.970
stay connected and we will talk to you
in 20 22
574
00:35:23.840 --> 00:35:27.610
for the longest time. I was asking
people to leave a review of GDP growth
575
00:35:27.610 --> 00:35:32.060
in apple podcasts, but I realized that
was kind of stupid because leaving a
576
00:35:32.060 --> 00:35:37.220
review is way harder than just leaving
a simple rating. So I'm changing my
577
00:35:37.220 --> 00:35:40.920
tune a bit instead of asking you to
leave a review, I'm just gonna ask you
578
00:35:40.920 --> 00:35:45.460
to go to BBB growth in apple podcasts,
scroll down until you see the ratings
579
00:35:45.460 --> 00:35:49.530
and reviews section and just tap the
number of stars you want to give us no
580
00:35:49.530 --> 00:35:54.840
review necessary. Super easy. And I
promise it will help us out a ton. If
581
00:35:54.840 --> 00:35:58.430
you want a copy of my book, content
based networking, just shoot me a text
582
00:35:58.440 --> 00:36:02.930
after you leave the rating and I'll
send one your way, text me at 4074 and
583
00:36:02.930 --> 00:36:07.060
I know 33 to 8.