#BehindTheCurtain 17: 3 Ways to Turn Prospects Into Friends

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.759 --> 00:00:10.189 Want to expand the reach of your content, start a podcast, feature industry 2 00:00:10.310 --> 00:00:14.589 experts on your show and leverage the influence and reach of your guests to grow 3 00:00:14.669 --> 00:00:24.379 your brand. Learn more at sweetphish MEDIACOM. You're listening to be tob growth, 4 00:00:24.780 --> 00:00:29.179 a daily podcast for B TOB leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard 5 00:00:29.179 --> 00:00:33.060 before, like Gary Vannerd truck and Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard 6 00:00:33.179 --> 00:00:37.369 from the majority of our guests. That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't 7 00:00:37.409 --> 00:00:41.969 with professional speakers and authors. Most of our guests are in the trenches leading 8 00:00:42.049 --> 00:00:46.850 sales and marketing teams. They're implementing strategy, they're experimenting with Pactics, they're 9 00:00:46.890 --> 00:00:51.399 building the fastest growing BB companies in the world. My name is James Carberry. 10 00:00:51.479 --> 00:00:55.000 I'm the founder of sweet fish media, a podcast agency for BBB brands, 11 00:00:55.119 --> 00:00:58.200 and I'm also one of the CO hosts of this show. When we're 12 00:00:58.240 --> 00:01:02.079 not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of 13 00:01:02.159 --> 00:01:04.790 our own business. Will share the ups and downs of our journey as we 14 00:01:04.870 --> 00:01:11.189 attempt to take over the world. Just getting well, maybe let's get into 15 00:01:11.230 --> 00:01:19.299 the show. Welcome back to be tob growth. I'm Logan lyles with sweet 16 00:01:19.299 --> 00:01:23.060 fish media. Today is another episode in our behind the curtain series where we 17 00:01:23.099 --> 00:01:26.219 share some of the things that we're learning and how we're growing here as a 18 00:01:26.260 --> 00:01:29.140 team at sweet wish. As usual in this series, I'm joined by my 19 00:01:29.180 --> 00:01:33.329 good Buddy James Carberry, founder and CEO of sweetish media. James, what's 20 00:01:33.329 --> 00:01:36.650 up and how you doing today? Oh Man, I am freaking pumped for 21 00:01:36.769 --> 00:01:41.769 this conversation. Just been fired up about the business as a whole more than 22 00:01:41.810 --> 00:01:46.810 I have, I mean probably more the last month or two than I have 23 00:01:47.090 --> 00:01:49.120 and honestly, the last couple years. We just got a lot of stuff 24 00:01:51.040 --> 00:01:56.280 firing on all cylinders. Rockstar team and personal life is going really well. 25 00:01:56.439 --> 00:02:00.200 Friendships are going extremely well, marriage is going extremely well. So, because 26 00:02:00.239 --> 00:02:02.310 I know I often say like, Oh, you know, doing great, 27 00:02:02.349 --> 00:02:07.989 excited for this episode, but I really am just doing so well. Well, 28 00:02:07.069 --> 00:02:09.909 that's saying something, because you do, you do tend to get excited. 29 00:02:09.990 --> 00:02:14.069 You see the positive, you're the dreamer, you're the visionary around here, 30 00:02:14.110 --> 00:02:16.699 man, and so when you're like pausing and saying no, like for 31 00:02:16.860 --> 00:02:22.020 Real, guys, that I take note and actually I kind of did a 32 00:02:22.060 --> 00:02:23.780 little faux pod there. We're actually going to be talking about how to turn 33 00:02:23.860 --> 00:02:29.740 prospective customers and your current customers, anybody who's in your network, really into 34 00:02:29.860 --> 00:02:32.889 friends very strategically in a be Tobe context. And one of the things we're 35 00:02:32.930 --> 00:02:36.969 going to be talking about later on is not to ask just kind of the 36 00:02:37.050 --> 00:02:39.090 standard questions, which I just did. How are you will circle back to 37 00:02:39.169 --> 00:02:42.889 that in a bit, but we're going to be talking about three things you 38 00:02:42.969 --> 00:02:46.560 can do and then the fourth is going to be conversational sparks. You and 39 00:02:46.719 --> 00:02:51.400 I have been thinking a lot about texting when it comes to potential customers. 40 00:02:51.800 --> 00:02:57.960 Partners are existing customers, and that's taking the communication off of email and slack 41 00:02:58.080 --> 00:03:00.870 and linked into a channel that's more personal. Man, tell us a little 42 00:03:00.870 --> 00:03:02.150 bit about how we've been in about this. So I want to go back 43 00:03:02.590 --> 00:03:07.310 one step before we start talking about texting. I want to really pound home 44 00:03:08.310 --> 00:03:15.180 why becoming friends with people that are your customers and potential customers is so freaking 45 00:03:15.219 --> 00:03:20.419 strategic and beneficial. One it's way more freaking fun to go to work every 46 00:03:20.419 --> 00:03:25.020 day and work with people that are your friends. To it actually drives more 47 00:03:25.099 --> 00:03:30.409 retention and better results. So, like when your friends with somebody like we 48 00:03:30.569 --> 00:03:35.210 get very candid feedback from our customers that you and I have become friends with 49 00:03:35.650 --> 00:03:38.490 about like how we can better our service, how we can deliver our value, 50 00:03:39.009 --> 00:03:44.879 and because we take their advice and implement it, we make our service 51 00:03:45.039 --> 00:03:49.439 better and it helps the rest of our business because we've got friends. When 52 00:03:49.479 --> 00:03:51.719 you're friends with somebody, you want them to win, you want them to 53 00:03:51.800 --> 00:03:54.400 succeed. So not only are they likely going to stick around, obviously, 54 00:03:54.439 --> 00:03:58.110 if your service sucks, if your product Sox, I don't care how many 55 00:03:58.110 --> 00:04:00.750 friends you are. If you're not delivering value with what you do, even 56 00:04:00.789 --> 00:04:05.349 your friends can't keep paying you. But they will give you candid feedback and 57 00:04:06.150 --> 00:04:11.099 the opportunity to they'll give you a lot of grace in fixing the product or 58 00:04:11.139 --> 00:04:13.620 the bug or that, you know, the lack of process. I've seen 59 00:04:13.659 --> 00:04:15.779 it us in the past month over ever again, over and over and over 60 00:04:15.819 --> 00:04:19.540 again. So becoming for like. I don't think we use the term friendship 61 00:04:19.540 --> 00:04:23.860 enough. have been doing a lot of podcast interviews for the book and I 62 00:04:23.939 --> 00:04:27.649 feel like I beat this over the head, this idea that like we should 63 00:04:27.649 --> 00:04:32.889 be saying the word friendship in business. More Dale Dupre literally built his entire 64 00:04:33.410 --> 00:04:39.680 breaking sales rebellion army on the back of this message. Like he sold copiers 65 00:04:39.759 --> 00:04:43.759 for over a decade. WHO The hell wants to buy a freaking copier? 66 00:04:44.399 --> 00:04:47.879 You did the same thing. Dale, like did these super innovative things to 67 00:04:48.040 --> 00:04:53.350 create friendships with people in his community that were strategic. He wasn't just going 68 00:04:53.389 --> 00:04:57.149 out and becoming friends with anybody, but he knew if he could become friends 69 00:04:57.189 --> 00:05:00.709 with the guy that owns the coffee shop or the girl that runs the, 70 00:05:00.269 --> 00:05:05.910 you know whatever, the pet store in town, they needed sixteen copiers and 71 00:05:06.110 --> 00:05:11.500 the Veterinary Office needed twenty four copiers, or you know whatever the case was. 72 00:05:11.579 --> 00:05:14.740 I don't even know if that's realistic, but those are those are the 73 00:05:14.819 --> 00:05:16.540 wrong targets for selling copiers. I can tell you that just because I could 74 00:05:16.540 --> 00:05:20.300 it for ten years. It's more really lawyer. I love nothing about anyway, 75 00:05:20.569 --> 00:05:25.209 the point we really made know nothing about selling copiers, but but the 76 00:05:25.370 --> 00:05:29.610 idea that that Dale literally so you, you and they'll both sold something, 77 00:05:30.009 --> 00:05:35.160 this commoditized thing that nobody wants to be sold copiers. But you guys were 78 00:05:35.199 --> 00:05:40.000 effective in doing it because you built friendships with people that could that could buy 79 00:05:40.079 --> 00:05:44.319 from you, and I think that applies to be the SASS companies. I 80 00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:48.720 think if your product is a Fiftyzero, you know contract value, it is 81 00:05:49.069 --> 00:05:54.829 worth twenty five thousand dollar contract value. Like I just think it's worth going 82 00:05:54.910 --> 00:05:57.949 through the process of becoming friends, like I got. We literally I got 83 00:05:58.029 --> 00:06:01.870 a text message three nights ago from somebody who would be who is on this 84 00:06:02.110 --> 00:06:05.699 podcast, like I don't know, three years ago, I think he was 85 00:06:05.779 --> 00:06:10.060 episode like in the in the three or four hundred range. He was on 86 00:06:10.139 --> 00:06:13.459 the show. I became friends with him, ended up going out and hanging 87 00:06:13.500 --> 00:06:15.939 out with them in San Francisco. We talked on the phone, I don't 88 00:06:15.939 --> 00:06:19.449 know, once every six, five, six months. So it's not like 89 00:06:19.529 --> 00:06:23.569 we're best friends, but we are friendly. We text back and forth. 90 00:06:23.850 --> 00:06:27.610 Like I see something that reminds me of them, I text him and he 91 00:06:27.810 --> 00:06:30.410 texted me the other day. was like, dude, he's at he's now 92 00:06:30.449 --> 00:06:33.319 at this billion dollar company, publicly traded company, and he's like, dude, 93 00:06:33.319 --> 00:06:35.399 we have a ton of budget to spend, we need to do a 94 00:06:35.480 --> 00:06:41.000 podcast. That would not have happened if he were not my friend, and 95 00:06:41.720 --> 00:06:44.439 he want like he wants me to win, he wants us to win, 96 00:06:44.519 --> 00:06:47.029 and I so many times we're just thinking about what are the activities we can 97 00:06:47.069 --> 00:06:53.230 do at scale, and I just in be to be I just think you 98 00:06:53.389 --> 00:06:56.829 don't always need that. Like there are things, obviously that you need the 99 00:06:56.910 --> 00:06:59.589 scale, you need to figure out how to do a scale, but I 100 00:06:59.790 --> 00:07:03.259 think you can get a lot, a lot of wins by focusing on friendship. 101 00:07:03.379 --> 00:07:06.620 So I wanted to set the set the bar there and set like, 102 00:07:08.019 --> 00:07:11.740 why are we talking about this idea of friendship and business? Because it's literally 103 00:07:11.860 --> 00:07:15.930 what we've built our entire business on the back of. We're completely leave bootstrapped, 104 00:07:15.089 --> 00:07:21.129 seven figure profitable business because we care about friendship. It didn't happen overnight. 105 00:07:21.490 --> 00:07:25.730 We've gone around for half a decade, but it freaking works. Yeah, 106 00:07:25.850 --> 00:07:28.730 what you said just there. You know, I'm so glad you painted 107 00:07:28.850 --> 00:07:30.560 this picture. Dale's a great example, the one you just talked about. 108 00:07:30.680 --> 00:07:33.480 In the friendship you've built, you were just the master of this. Man, 109 00:07:33.800 --> 00:07:38.279 I saw a tweet the other day that said in I'm in a paraphrase 110 00:07:38.319 --> 00:07:42.600 because I can't even quote a tweet, but whatever the in a world of 111 00:07:43.160 --> 00:07:47.189 people looking for quick wins, and Growth Hacks and immediate success. The ultimate 112 00:07:47.269 --> 00:07:51.269 growth hack is playing the long game and I just thought that was so in 113 00:07:51.470 --> 00:07:57.110 line with everything you've talked about and just this conversation it. Okaygan said I 114 00:07:57.589 --> 00:08:00.300 are heard on no OAKAIGAN's podcast, I think there's a few months ago. 115 00:08:00.339 --> 00:08:03.660 He said the best growth hack is staying in business for ten years, and 116 00:08:03.819 --> 00:08:09.379 I just think that perfectly articulates exactly what what you just paraphrase like. The 117 00:08:09.540 --> 00:08:13.170 best growth hack is patients and long term and playing the long game. And 118 00:08:13.449 --> 00:08:18.810 there's nobody who is successful that will tell you that relationships did not help them 119 00:08:18.850 --> 00:08:22.250 get to where they are, and I just I don't think we talked enough 120 00:08:22.290 --> 00:08:26.089 about it. And so this episode we're talking about, okay, how do 121 00:08:26.170 --> 00:08:28.959 we turn these people that we do business with or want to do business with, 122 00:08:30.319 --> 00:08:31.399 how do we turn them into friends? And I think we've got some 123 00:08:31.559 --> 00:08:35.840 really tangible ways to do that. Yeah, so number one, is I 124 00:08:35.879 --> 00:08:37.519 kind of teaed up a second ago, is one that we've been thinking about 125 00:08:37.519 --> 00:08:41.429 a lot and you just mentioned in the example you shared, and that's texting. 126 00:08:41.590 --> 00:08:45.909 You know, one of the things I've done recently is when people go 127 00:08:46.029 --> 00:08:48.549 to book through my hub, spot meeting link to be a guest on BB 128 00:08:48.669 --> 00:08:52.909 growth. You know, some people use Calibli or hup spot meetings or whatever 129 00:08:52.909 --> 00:08:56.500 the case might be. I added a field there to get their phone number. 130 00:08:56.500 --> 00:08:58.899 Now, not everybody gives their cell phone number. Sometimes it's a office 131 00:08:58.940 --> 00:09:01.980 line or direct line of some sort, but a lot of people it's their 132 00:09:03.059 --> 00:09:05.940 cell phone number. So I've taken it to you know, at some point 133 00:09:05.940 --> 00:09:09.179 after we'd just text them something about their episode or I thought of something that 134 00:09:09.299 --> 00:09:13.289 came out of the Preyer Post interview conversation. And what I've found is just 135 00:09:13.490 --> 00:09:16.610 it. It opens that door because we've had that first content collaboration. It 136 00:09:16.690 --> 00:09:20.649 doesn't feel like, Oh, where am I getting this text from? And 137 00:09:20.690 --> 00:09:24.090 it gets, you know, ignored. I get immediate responses. You're not, 138 00:09:24.210 --> 00:09:26.960 I feel like, a fifty percent discount like that. When people think 139 00:09:28.000 --> 00:09:31.679 of text like that's the kind of text message people and be tob think that 140 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:33.679 they have like that. They're that we're talking about. We're not talking about 141 00:09:33.679 --> 00:09:37.200 that. We're talking about like what's the text it you would send your buddy? 142 00:09:37.200 --> 00:09:39.389 Yeah, they're just going to launch one to one. Yeah, but 143 00:09:39.590 --> 00:09:43.470 how can you bake it into the process, like you can set a follow 144 00:09:43.509 --> 00:09:46.830 up task in your sales engagement platform, do you send a text? And 145 00:09:46.870 --> 00:09:50.470 a lot of them have texting built right in, and so I think a 146 00:09:50.509 --> 00:09:52.899 lot of people are like, oh well, texting is the next wave. 147 00:09:52.019 --> 00:09:56.259 It's kind of untapped and they think of this, you know, mass market 148 00:09:56.539 --> 00:09:58.940 blast. Text texting it, you know, just like we've ruined email, 149 00:09:58.940 --> 00:10:03.899 sales people and marketers, we ruin everything. Right, let's not ruin it. 150 00:10:03.139 --> 00:10:07.929 Let's take advantage of the opportunity here in a way that's actually going to 151 00:10:07.169 --> 00:10:11.169 help us and build a relationships. Yes, oh my gosh, man, 152 00:10:11.210 --> 00:10:16.210 I I cannot speak highly enough about texting. I think when you can gift, 153 00:10:16.730 --> 00:10:20.450 what are the kids saying? When you can slide into their DM's, 154 00:10:20.600 --> 00:10:26.440 if you can slide into their text messages, man, you just talk to 155 00:10:26.559 --> 00:10:31.879 people differently. One people pay attention to their texts and they don't open rate. 156 00:10:31.919 --> 00:10:35.679 It's almost a hundred percent exactly, not a hundred percent right exactly, 157 00:10:35.710 --> 00:10:39.269 especially if you're doing it with context. You're not doing some mass message. 158 00:10:39.549 --> 00:10:43.389 You were literally saying Hey, frank you know, thank you so much for 159 00:10:43.710 --> 00:10:46.230 for the value bombs you dropped on the episode today. Stoke to stay connected 160 00:10:46.269 --> 00:10:50.460 with you like you're not asking them for anything, you just texting them and 161 00:10:52.340 --> 00:10:54.980 texting them right before the podcasting of be like hey, frank, we still 162 00:10:54.019 --> 00:11:01.700 get to go like that's it, like it's actual human conversation, not things 163 00:11:01.779 --> 00:11:05.090 that your marketing team is going to automate for you. I think what's interesting 164 00:11:05.289 --> 00:11:07.809 to here, man, is, like I've seen a lot of posts lightly 165 00:11:07.889 --> 00:11:13.730 about like people get too formal. Even experienced be tob salespeople, you know, 166 00:11:13.850 --> 00:11:16.929 are guilty of getting at the keyboard and starting to use more formal language, 167 00:11:16.929 --> 00:11:22.240 even with an email with a potential customer or customer that they've interacted with. 168 00:11:22.480 --> 00:11:26.360 Not even talking about writing cold email, but something about holding that phone 169 00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:28.279 in your hand and texting kind of takes that away. It's kind of like 170 00:11:28.440 --> 00:11:31.799 when you start to like use google docs and your waist tyr. You don't 171 00:11:33.029 --> 00:11:35.629 you're talking, so you're sounding like you talk is opposed to writing and it 172 00:11:35.789 --> 00:11:39.590 creates that barrier. When you're texting your automatically, kind of this is more 173 00:11:39.750 --> 00:11:45.029 informal, it's more personal, and so it's going to actually help you communicate 174 00:11:45.470 --> 00:11:48.259 on a more human level with that other person on the other end. To 175 00:11:48.539 --> 00:11:52.659 It's so funny. You say that, like I write my best copy when 176 00:11:52.700 --> 00:11:56.460 I'm writing it in a note in my phone or when I'm like sending an 177 00:11:56.500 --> 00:12:00.220 email to somebody from my phone, as opposed to by the computer, like 178 00:12:00.580 --> 00:12:03.250 in like I'm the biggest proponent for writing like you talk, but for I 179 00:12:03.450 --> 00:12:05.889 still do it, like when I'm writing. We're going through them. Yeah, 180 00:12:05.929 --> 00:12:09.129 the struggle is real right now. Yeah, writing copy for the website, 181 00:12:09.409 --> 00:12:13.490 because I'm trying to have it on my big screen and I'm looking at 182 00:12:13.529 --> 00:12:16.240 this and like and so I'm at my computer writing cop and I'm like but, 183 00:12:16.440 --> 00:12:18.120 but why? How did that just come off my fingers? Like that's 184 00:12:18.159 --> 00:12:22.200 not how I talk and your spot on. I'd never really thought about it 185 00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:26.879 that way. But by moving to that, by actually sending the text message 186 00:12:26.519 --> 00:12:30.629 on your phone, like, because in the same thread you're like, Oh, 187 00:12:30.669 --> 00:12:33.429 I just texted my wife, I just text. You're in that mode 188 00:12:33.509 --> 00:12:35.950 as soon as you pick up your phone and open the text APP. Yeah, 189 00:12:35.190 --> 00:12:39.230 and it's so it makes so much more sense that you're going to write 190 00:12:39.230 --> 00:12:41.710 in a more human way. Yeah, I mean I literally had kind of 191 00:12:41.750 --> 00:12:46.460 been thinking about this and I was I was actually writing and email template for 192 00:12:46.740 --> 00:12:50.700 a sequence. I'm going to send out to some current customers and I typed 193 00:12:50.860 --> 00:12:52.899 want to and I was like wait, I could just change that to want 194 00:12:52.940 --> 00:12:56.860 to. You know it, because I had been texting and I was like, 195 00:12:56.340 --> 00:12:58.330 you know, no one's going to look at that and be like Oh, 196 00:12:58.610 --> 00:13:01.289 this is so informal, are you kidding me? I mean most of 197 00:13:01.330 --> 00:13:05.450 the people we we work with, like they're just going to know that that 198 00:13:05.610 --> 00:13:07.049 you type that way. I mean, yea, so many emails I get 199 00:13:07.169 --> 00:13:11.690 say, you know, please excuse any typos and apologies for the brevity, 200 00:13:11.690 --> 00:13:13.759 sent from my iphone or whatever. I think we can go too far to 201 00:13:13.840 --> 00:13:16.519 where it's just like Oh, this is unreadable. Yeah, but I think 202 00:13:16.559 --> 00:13:20.840 we're so far away a nudge in that direction. We're not going to go 203 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:22.879 too far. Most often I think you're exactly right. All right, so 204 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:28.669 texting obviously huge. What do we got next? Second content collaborations. So 205 00:13:28.990 --> 00:13:31.950 this is something that we've been trying to do more intentionally. Yeah, you're 206 00:13:31.950 --> 00:13:35.509 find you have these, man. Yeah, you you have always encouraged me 207 00:13:35.590 --> 00:13:39.429 on this. Like the second content collaboration you do with someone, whether that's 208 00:13:39.429 --> 00:13:45.419 a podcast or a virtual summit or an interview for your blog series or videos. 209 00:13:45.500 --> 00:13:48.820 Age, whatever it is. It can even be shorter, but you 210 00:13:48.980 --> 00:13:52.179 just like you start in and you might have something in your mind of like, 211 00:13:52.340 --> 00:13:54.779 oh, they were buying a house or oh, they were moving or, 212 00:13:54.100 --> 00:13:58.490 you know, they were celebrating their dogs birthday, like whatever, and 213 00:13:58.649 --> 00:14:01.570 you can start out that conversation with that. I think we're going to we're 214 00:14:01.570 --> 00:14:03.529 going to come back to that in a sect talking about, you know, 215 00:14:03.649 --> 00:14:07.250 conversational sparks. But what are your thoughts on second content collaborations? I've said 216 00:14:07.289 --> 00:14:11.600 it for a while and we haven't really operationalized it and started suggesting it to 217 00:14:11.679 --> 00:14:16.320 our customers until recently because I've I've been a little bit fearful of like how, 218 00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:18.799 like, are they going to want to do a second collaboration with somebody? 219 00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:22.720 Surprisingly, we haven't got any pushback to it, because it makes sense. 220 00:14:24.159 --> 00:14:26.470 Common Sense tells you that the more time you spend with somebody, the 221 00:14:26.629 --> 00:14:31.830 closer you're going to ultimately get with them. And if you do, like 222 00:14:31.990 --> 00:14:35.149 we all meet people at conferences on a one off basis, like you meet 223 00:14:35.190 --> 00:14:39.220 somebody one di I like, we would be shocked at how many. Would 224 00:14:39.220 --> 00:14:41.860 be interesting if there's any data on this, like how many people over the 225 00:14:41.940 --> 00:14:45.620 course of your life do you meet one time? You don't remember those people, 226 00:14:45.820 --> 00:14:48.419 like the number is too big for you to remember those. Yeah, 227 00:14:48.419 --> 00:14:52.019 that's really interesting, man. So, so by taking and going to those 228 00:14:52.019 --> 00:14:54.929 people that you've already done the work of vetting and making sure, like hey, 229 00:14:56.009 --> 00:14:58.730 is this a strategic relationship that I want to create before you know, 230 00:14:58.730 --> 00:15:01.690 obviously you don't know whether or not they have a need for what you do, 231 00:15:01.929 --> 00:15:05.049 but like, is this the type of person that I would want to 232 00:15:05.090 --> 00:15:09.519 connect with? And because they could potentially want what we have. You've already 233 00:15:09.519 --> 00:15:13.240 done that work, so why not go back to the well and nurture that 234 00:15:13.320 --> 00:15:20.000 relationship by doing another collaboration? Like things change, budgets change after you know, 235 00:15:20.120 --> 00:15:22.830 maybe you had them on one time and six months later you're like hey, 236 00:15:22.830 --> 00:15:24.309 I want to I want to go back. They might be at a 237 00:15:24.350 --> 00:15:28.870 whole. What I'm finding recently, man, like people don't stay at companies 238 00:15:28.909 --> 00:15:33.110 very long, like they're bad. Culture is rampant, and so people are 239 00:15:33.149 --> 00:15:35.779 bouncing from company to company. I was just talking to a friend of mine 240 00:15:35.820 --> 00:15:41.100 who's a customer that became a friend after he was a customer and he left 241 00:15:41.139 --> 00:15:43.940 the company that he originally was working with us at went to another company. 242 00:15:43.179 --> 00:15:48.940 Now he's at another company and he's a great dude, but most cultures suck 243 00:15:48.500 --> 00:15:52.370 and you just like that short term of like, oh well, if they 244 00:15:52.370 --> 00:15:56.090 didn't, if they weren't ready to buy the first time I talked to him, 245 00:15:56.129 --> 00:15:58.490 then good. It on to the next one and it's like that's just 246 00:15:58.769 --> 00:16:03.450 stupid. Like again it's yeah, if you buy into the relationships, you 247 00:16:03.610 --> 00:16:06.960 have to have this mindset of the long game. I can think of another, 248 00:16:07.320 --> 00:16:11.000 you know, customer of ours who left the company he was at where 249 00:16:11.039 --> 00:16:15.159 we had built a relationship and and he became a customer and then he left 250 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:18.590 and now he's add another customer of ours, and so that relationship, we 251 00:16:18.750 --> 00:16:22.230 actually brokered that front. We brokeer that relationship and the yeah, like to 252 00:16:22.350 --> 00:16:26.669 me, like I don't know, when you're playing in the world of relationships. 253 00:16:26.710 --> 00:16:29.029 I was just not called before we jumped on the slogan, when you're 254 00:16:29.029 --> 00:16:33.779 playing in the world of building meaningful Jainuan relationships with the specific type of person. 255 00:16:34.179 --> 00:16:37.340 So it's not disingenuine because you're targeted and who you want to be friends 256 00:16:37.379 --> 00:16:41.500 with. Like I could see how people could take it that way and like 257 00:16:41.820 --> 00:16:44.980 Oh, that you know, if you're even to use the word targeting, 258 00:16:45.500 --> 00:16:52.129 but it's just smart. Like I know that the more marketers, specifically VP's 259 00:16:52.129 --> 00:16:56.009 of marketing, that I know and am friends with, the better our business 260 00:16:56.049 --> 00:16:57.769 is going to do, even if they don't buy from us. Like, 261 00:16:59.049 --> 00:17:03.120 my intent is not just to sell them something, and that's why I actually 262 00:17:03.240 --> 00:17:07.119 can become friends with them, because you and I is intent is very clear 263 00:17:07.559 --> 00:17:10.599 that if you don't buy from us, we still want to know you, 264 00:17:11.119 --> 00:17:12.599 like, we still want to add value in ways that we can add value. 265 00:17:12.640 --> 00:17:15.549 We still want to learn from you, like, and when that is 266 00:17:15.589 --> 00:17:19.789 your intent, people actually want to work with you, they want to refer 267 00:17:19.910 --> 00:17:22.150 people to you. Yeah, and I think I gonna go for this, 268 00:17:22.309 --> 00:17:26.470 but you stuck to these guys. Yeah, and I think a way tactically, 269 00:17:26.630 --> 00:17:30.460 like if you are in sales and you're building relationships with content collaboration, 270 00:17:30.579 --> 00:17:34.059 the way that we talked about with content based networking. Let's say there is 271 00:17:34.140 --> 00:17:37.660 a point in the conversation, even like you just did a podcast episode, 272 00:17:37.660 --> 00:17:41.500 are you just did something with someone or you just highlighted them and the conversation 273 00:17:41.660 --> 00:17:45.009 feels right, to go ahead and ask, like, Hey, is there 274 00:17:45.049 --> 00:17:48.170 an opportunity to work together here. Don't let that, don't hold that to 275 00:17:48.210 --> 00:17:52.049 the very end of that conversation. Just ask it when it feels right and 276 00:17:52.289 --> 00:17:56.809 make sure that you continue the conversation with still giving, because what that does 277 00:17:56.890 --> 00:18:00.200 is like flipping the email. If I send you an email out of the 278 00:18:00.240 --> 00:18:03.839 blue, James, and say like hey, James, how's it going? 279 00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:07.559 You know, I know Lisa's birthday was recently. How is that? I 280 00:18:07.680 --> 00:18:10.960 need to ask you this, then all of that pleasantry feels like it was 281 00:18:11.079 --> 00:18:14.990 just a build up for the ASS. If you ask and you go back 282 00:18:15.150 --> 00:18:19.549 to giving, then you show very tactically that that's not the only thing that 283 00:18:19.630 --> 00:18:22.910 you're after. No matter the answer to that question, you're going back to 284 00:18:22.990 --> 00:18:26.980 the relationship. So sometimes that can be just kind of unconscious, but that 285 00:18:27.220 --> 00:18:32.140 has been a huge unlock for me because even if your intentions are right, 286 00:18:32.619 --> 00:18:34.940 you can send the wrong message if you just kind of do it the wrong 287 00:18:34.980 --> 00:18:40.619 way and again, you can be strategic, you can be targeted and you 288 00:18:40.740 --> 00:18:44.809 can still be genuine, but you've got to be careful that you're still coming 289 00:18:44.890 --> 00:18:48.809 off that way, because the perception is what matters, not necessarily the intent, 290 00:18:48.130 --> 00:18:51.809 but the more that you actually believe it, the more the intent will 291 00:18:51.849 --> 00:18:53.769 shine through. So that's my soapbox there. Man, no, man, 292 00:18:55.250 --> 00:18:59.839 you're so, so right, and I think that little tactic could literally that 293 00:19:00.079 --> 00:19:02.640 alone, like hey, like, bring it up when it cook when it 294 00:19:02.680 --> 00:19:06.200 feels natural, but make sure that that's not how you're closing, like you're 295 00:19:06.200 --> 00:19:08.559 always closing with. How can I help this person? One idea that I 296 00:19:08.799 --> 00:19:11.869 the just popped in my head that we should even think about doing it free 297 00:19:11.910 --> 00:19:15.950 fish like if you just have it baked into your to your plan, that 298 00:19:17.630 --> 00:19:22.990 marketing is constantly working every quarter on a big, like round up piece of 299 00:19:22.109 --> 00:19:25.819 content. Care if it's an ebook and a care if it's a virtual some 300 00:19:25.940 --> 00:19:27.059 that, I don't care. If it's just a massive blog post that you're 301 00:19:27.099 --> 00:19:32.099 where you're trying to rank for a competitive keyword. If you have something like 302 00:19:32.420 --> 00:19:37.980 big every quarter that you know that you're you come up with what that thing 303 00:19:37.059 --> 00:19:40.930 is based on the fact that you know the people that you're having on your 304 00:19:40.930 --> 00:19:45.450 podcast or whatever your initial content collaboration mechanism is, that they can also contribute 305 00:19:45.490 --> 00:19:49.450 to that thing, and it can be for monster blog posts or an Ebook, 306 00:19:49.450 --> 00:19:52.319 a virtual sum at, a blog post, and you know a video 307 00:19:52.480 --> 00:19:56.759 series, having those things already baked in and knowing this is what we're working 308 00:19:56.759 --> 00:20:02.119 on. That way you can literally x but ie the process and at the 309 00:20:02.160 --> 00:20:03.759 end of your podcast interview or whatever the tip of the spear is for you, 310 00:20:04.160 --> 00:20:07.109 when you're when you're talking to them for that first collaboration, saying like, 311 00:20:07.230 --> 00:20:10.910 Hey, we're also working on this other thing, and I think you'd 312 00:20:10.910 --> 00:20:11.750 be able to add a lot of value to that too, based on the 313 00:20:11.789 --> 00:20:15.630 conversation we had now, like that stuff. If their content wasn't actually that 314 00:20:15.750 --> 00:20:19.150 good, then I don't know, like it's hard for me to say that. 315 00:20:19.349 --> 00:20:22.579 You know, I just want people to be genuine and authentic and I 316 00:20:22.619 --> 00:20:26.380 don't want you lying to people. But having something like that, like a 317 00:20:26.420 --> 00:20:30.220 stable like project that you know, this is something we're working on in q 318 00:20:30.420 --> 00:20:33.259 one, this is the content project in Qt in addition to the podcast. 319 00:20:33.339 --> 00:20:36.890 For us, for me to be growth, I just think that would be 320 00:20:36.930 --> 00:20:40.930 Ninja, like you've done it with the five things series here, because that's 321 00:20:40.930 --> 00:20:44.690 an ongoing series, and so you getting people on bb growth and then saying 322 00:20:45.049 --> 00:20:45.970 and for the people that you really connect with and think, man, we 323 00:20:47.009 --> 00:20:49.039 could really work well these folks. Hey, come back on the five things 324 00:20:49.119 --> 00:20:55.039 series. That's a second opportunity for you to build relationship and I bet you 325 00:20:55.119 --> 00:20:56.880 can even speak to the fact that, like those people that you've talked to 326 00:20:57.000 --> 00:21:02.240 the second time, it's different, like you have a different level of connection 327 00:21:02.279 --> 00:21:04.390 with him. Yeah, you just have one comment. Yeah, and it's 328 00:21:04.430 --> 00:21:08.190 been cool. I mean I always talk about this double edged sort of content 329 00:21:08.269 --> 00:21:11.349 based networking. Is You get the relationships and you get the content that you're 330 00:21:11.430 --> 00:21:15.829 trying to create. Any way, like you know, the five things series 331 00:21:15.910 --> 00:21:18.859 have gotten feedback from folks. Like we're talking marketing, strategy and tactics, 332 00:21:18.900 --> 00:21:22.500 a little bit of sales every day on bb growth and then we just pause 333 00:21:22.539 --> 00:21:26.859 and say, let's do some five to ten minute episodes on about the time. 334 00:21:26.940 --> 00:21:30.019 What's your what's your favorite APP like, how do you use your pellets 335 00:21:30.140 --> 00:21:32.579 on? What's you know, what's key for your to do list? And 336 00:21:32.970 --> 00:21:36.650 like people have been sharing those episodes more and so it's not just like this, 337 00:21:37.130 --> 00:21:38.650 you know, sneaky thing to try and get people back on the show. 338 00:21:38.970 --> 00:21:44.170 I'm doing it in a way that is still creating content. That one 339 00:21:44.289 --> 00:21:47.759 is fun to create and it's engaging people. So you know, you've got 340 00:21:47.799 --> 00:21:51.279 to think about how does it fit for both, and I think that's where 341 00:21:51.319 --> 00:21:55.359 larger teams really need to look at. How can sales and marketing sit down 342 00:21:55.400 --> 00:21:57.920 together and figure out, you know, how do we build these relationships and 343 00:21:59.039 --> 00:22:02.509 how do we create interesting content? But, you know, I just think 344 00:22:02.670 --> 00:22:04.829 the world's your oyster when you got pick her teams. I just think how 345 00:22:04.869 --> 00:22:07.670 much we're doing with a small team, that that bigger teams could be doing 346 00:22:07.710 --> 00:22:11.869 so much more. Lantash like the the five things, like I legitimately get 347 00:22:11.910 --> 00:22:17.099 giddy every Saturday morning whenever I see that five. You text it me when 348 00:22:17.180 --> 00:22:19.539 one didn't drop on time. Yeah, so where's the five things today? 349 00:22:19.700 --> 00:22:22.500 Like I don't listen to every BB growth interview, like I'd be lying if 350 00:22:22.539 --> 00:22:25.859 I told you I like to listen to every single one of our interviews. 351 00:22:25.940 --> 00:22:29.299 I don't. Some of them seem interesting to me and I listen and others 352 00:22:29.339 --> 00:22:33.609 I don't. The five things like it's different and I listen to it every 353 00:22:33.650 --> 00:22:37.769 single Saturday because they know it's different and it's it's just different style, and 354 00:22:37.930 --> 00:22:41.690 so I think there are tons of opportunities if you start thinking creatively about how 355 00:22:41.730 --> 00:22:44.720 to do this stuff. Yeah, absolutely, Man. So let's round out, 356 00:22:44.880 --> 00:22:47.400 because we like to do lists here. So we got one thinking about 357 00:22:47.400 --> 00:22:52.440 texting and building relationships, to a second content collaboration, and three, I 358 00:22:52.559 --> 00:22:56.039 think we want to lump these two ideas together, especially because, you know, 359 00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:59.230 with everything that's going on right now, there are events being canceled, 360 00:22:59.269 --> 00:23:03.269 people are rethinking their their events strategy. But third for us has always been 361 00:23:03.589 --> 00:23:08.509 in person events coupled with some sort of digital community. We've tried and experimented 362 00:23:08.589 --> 00:23:11.750 with slack channels, I've seen things. Are Folks doing some thing like that, 363 00:23:11.900 --> 00:23:15.539 facebook groups, which we've neglected for a long time, unfortunately. But 364 00:23:15.740 --> 00:23:21.779 talk about this last point of building friendships, James, between in person and 365 00:23:22.019 --> 00:23:25.420 online communities and how you can foster those. Yeah, so I think this 366 00:23:25.579 --> 00:23:30.930 is something, this is probably our biggest opportunity for growth. It's sweet fish. 367 00:23:30.170 --> 00:23:33.170 This is something we don't do well. We do it in spurts, 368 00:23:33.329 --> 00:23:37.289 in large part because my personality isn't a lot in spurts, until we have 369 00:23:37.529 --> 00:23:41.000 enough bandwidth to have somebody on the team that can run and make my spurt 370 00:23:41.079 --> 00:23:45.359 a sustaining effort. But it like two years ago I went and I think 371 00:23:45.359 --> 00:23:49.599 I did like twelve different be to be growth dinners in different cities and by 372 00:23:49.839 --> 00:23:55.910 by bringing people together over a meal, it just expedites friendship like you would 373 00:23:55.910 --> 00:24:00.349 not believe. We've tried doing this digitally and honestly, we just sucked at 374 00:24:00.390 --> 00:24:02.910 it. We didn't we didn't have the horse power behind it. We didn't 375 00:24:02.910 --> 00:24:08.109 have the bandwidth on our team to really like spark interesting conversations on a regular 376 00:24:08.150 --> 00:24:14.339 basis, either in slack or in Facebook, against very short spurts and we 377 00:24:14.460 --> 00:24:17.740 just haven't maintained those. At some point, you know, on our audience 378 00:24:17.819 --> 00:24:21.420 growth team I hope to bring on somebody that just focuses on community for all 379 00:24:21.460 --> 00:24:22.779 the different shows, be to be growth, to be sales, craft and 380 00:24:22.819 --> 00:24:26.210 culture, manufacturing show, all these shows were building. I want to have 381 00:24:26.329 --> 00:24:30.369 somebody that's focused on community for those shows. We're just not at the at 382 00:24:30.410 --> 00:24:33.170 the point in the business where we can just FY having somebody in that role 383 00:24:33.690 --> 00:24:36.849 yet. But I do think if you do have a lot, if you 384 00:24:36.930 --> 00:24:38.680 do have some budget, if you're if you've got some venture money, like 385 00:24:40.119 --> 00:24:42.279 if you've got the if you've got budget to do it, investing in building 386 00:24:42.359 --> 00:24:47.279 community in person and digitally, I think is a really smart way to go 387 00:24:47.880 --> 00:24:51.440 when you're connecting other we've done this at a my growscale, like doing a 388 00:24:51.559 --> 00:24:55.509 customer of it. That's how we connected one of our old customers to are 389 00:24:55.630 --> 00:24:59.549 another customer and now that other than that guy works at this o other company 390 00:24:59.589 --> 00:25:02.670 because of ultimately meeting there. Who knows if that, you know, they 391 00:25:02.710 --> 00:25:06.069 might have happened apart from that connection, but that's really the first time they 392 00:25:06.109 --> 00:25:08.420 met. And so being able to do that kind of stuff and broker those 393 00:25:08.460 --> 00:25:12.420 kind of connections makes you someone that a lot of people like. Yeah, 394 00:25:12.859 --> 00:25:17.660 absolutely, just a couple of tactical things to throw out, you know from 395 00:25:17.859 --> 00:25:22.529 one of those lunches. I know you know jk sparks at bombomb recently told 396 00:25:22.529 --> 00:25:26.650 me. I didn't even really realize the impact of that be tob growth lunch 397 00:25:26.769 --> 00:25:30.210 that we did. It was shortly before that, before we started working with 398 00:25:30.329 --> 00:25:33.609 bombomb. We had done content collaboration with Ethan over there tons and tons of 399 00:25:33.690 --> 00:25:37.599 times. But I know he mentioned like that value of like Oh, Hey, 400 00:25:37.640 --> 00:25:41.839 I got invited to this and there were some people with more experience and 401 00:25:41.160 --> 00:25:45.759 a little bit more seniority and their marketing department and and he was excited about 402 00:25:45.759 --> 00:25:49.109 it. And you know, we didn't even really see the impact and the 403 00:25:49.190 --> 00:25:52.549 value that he felt he got out of that small in person lunch. That 404 00:25:52.670 --> 00:25:56.910 was like six people, maybe a little bit more, but that's including you 405 00:25:56.029 --> 00:26:00.069 and me, and so you don't know what that's going to do. Also, 406 00:26:00.190 --> 00:26:02.309 if you're going to start a slack channel, one of the things we 407 00:26:02.509 --> 00:26:04.099 started to do, I think you can do if you have someone dedicated to 408 00:26:04.180 --> 00:26:07.579 it, like you were saying, is come up with questions of the day 409 00:26:07.579 --> 00:26:11.259 or questions of the week that you can ask to feel facilitate conversation. That 410 00:26:11.420 --> 00:26:17.259 part has been a big way that we've driven engagement within our culture on a 411 00:26:17.339 --> 00:26:21.650 fully distributed team here at sweetfish. So think about that another way. You 412 00:26:21.769 --> 00:26:26.849 know, we've been big proponents of building linkedin engagement groups to help people get 413 00:26:26.970 --> 00:26:30.450 more organic reach on their content. I've also seen I'm part of a linkedin 414 00:26:30.529 --> 00:26:36.079 engagement group with the l dupre and it's actually split into two, one four 415 00:26:36.160 --> 00:26:40.440 posts and one for chat, because so many people likeminded people are just like 416 00:26:40.519 --> 00:26:42.839 chatting back and forth. And so think about that too. We've been big 417 00:26:42.920 --> 00:26:47.589 proponents of building an engagement groups so that you can use, not use, 418 00:26:47.670 --> 00:26:49.950 but you can leverage. You know, your team to get early engagement on 419 00:26:51.029 --> 00:26:53.910 your post and further organic reach. But it can also bring together those people 420 00:26:53.990 --> 00:26:57.670 that you want to build relationships with, help them see other content that that 421 00:26:57.789 --> 00:27:02.220 they would like to see and you can build relationships that way. So yes, 422 00:27:02.460 --> 00:27:04.420 those are a couple of tactical things. We talked about texting, we 423 00:27:04.500 --> 00:27:10.140 talked about second content collaborations and we talked about community. I wanted to get 424 00:27:10.140 --> 00:27:12.500 into conversational sparks, but I think we're we should do that in a separate 425 00:27:12.539 --> 00:27:17.890 episode and I'm kind of going deeper on how do you start relationships? How 426 00:27:17.930 --> 00:27:21.410 do you, you know, go deeper? And this idea of conversational sparks 427 00:27:21.450 --> 00:27:25.210 from a book you and I are both reading, captivate, from Vanessa van 428 00:27:25.329 --> 00:27:27.529 Edwards, who was on the customer experience podcast recently, is a way to 429 00:27:27.569 --> 00:27:30.119 go deeper. So we'll come back to that in a follow up episode. 430 00:27:30.720 --> 00:27:34.039 Here in the behind the curtain series is James as always. Man, thank 431 00:27:34.039 --> 00:27:37.640 you so much for Riffin with me. It's always fun. We do it 432 00:27:37.720 --> 00:27:40.039 every day, but we don't record it every day. We got to record 433 00:27:40.079 --> 00:27:42.720 these more often. If people aren't connected with you, it's the easiest way. 434 00:27:44.309 --> 00:27:48.910 Yeah, so James at sweetish Mediacom is my email Linkedin, James carberry. 435 00:27:49.309 --> 00:27:53.670 But we're hiring, we're growing and we're looking for we're looking for people 436 00:27:53.789 --> 00:27:57.660 that own the result. We're looking for people that are proactive, we're looking 437 00:27:57.660 --> 00:28:02.619 for people that that are hungry and and we're looking for people that are really 438 00:28:02.779 --> 00:28:06.940 in it and are committed and that that type of personality. So, whether 439 00:28:07.019 --> 00:28:10.420 you're looking or you know somebody that's looking, you know some different roles that 440 00:28:10.460 --> 00:28:11.420 we're looking for. We've got. You know, we're a media company, 441 00:28:11.500 --> 00:28:17.130 so writers and video of folks and producers and I'm just really just trying to 442 00:28:17.329 --> 00:28:18.970 spend that's where a lot of my brain is right now, is trying to 443 00:28:19.009 --> 00:28:22.970 think how can we build a war chest of incredible people as we need certain 444 00:28:23.009 --> 00:28:27.640 roles. So shoot myself or or Ryan on our team, Ryan at Sweetish 445 00:28:27.680 --> 00:28:33.200 Mediacom. He's our director of culture and people opps. We'd love to connect 446 00:28:33.240 --> 00:28:34.880 with you. We might not have a role for you right now, but 447 00:28:36.079 --> 00:28:41.190 we are hiring for for some stuff immediately. So looking would love to for 448 00:28:41.309 --> 00:28:45.230 anybody to you know, I talked earlier in this episode about how most culture 449 00:28:45.309 --> 00:28:48.910 suck. Very, very fortunate that ours doesn't? We have all the time 450 00:28:49.390 --> 00:28:52.430 hearing from our team how much they love working here. So if you know 451 00:28:52.509 --> 00:28:56.220 anybody that's looking, if you are looking yourself or in a booming industry right 452 00:28:56.259 --> 00:29:00.779 now, everybody knows podcasts or doing nothing but going up in to the right 453 00:29:00.299 --> 00:29:03.900 and we're really at the episode of it in the B Tob World and so 454 00:29:04.420 --> 00:29:08.380 super exciting. So we don't talk about that much here now, but I 455 00:29:08.500 --> 00:29:11.730 mean I think it's appropriate though, especially if you like these episodes where we're 456 00:29:11.730 --> 00:29:15.329 going behind the curtain and and you like what we're doing and and how we're 457 00:29:15.369 --> 00:29:18.890 doing it, because we're trying to give that peak so that you can you 458 00:29:18.009 --> 00:29:21.329 can learn. But if it, you know, makes sense, you know 459 00:29:21.450 --> 00:29:22.809 we would love to hear from you. So I love that call out. 460 00:29:22.849 --> 00:29:26.400 Man, we don't necessarily do that a lot, as much as we have 461 00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:29.440 been talking about, you know what's going on behind the curtain, so to 462 00:29:29.480 --> 00:29:32.200 speak, here at sweet fish. So that's a good call out. If 463 00:29:32.240 --> 00:29:36.680 anybody listening to this isn't connected with me Linkedin as the best way Logan Lyles 464 00:29:36.720 --> 00:29:40.829 l ylies, that's not miles as I get every customer service called that. 465 00:29:40.869 --> 00:29:44.390 I'm that I'm on or people calling me lyle, as my first name. 466 00:29:44.589 --> 00:29:47.029 Anyway, I won't go off on that. Connect with James and I you 467 00:29:47.109 --> 00:29:49.349 can email me as well, logan at sweet fish Mediacom. As always, 468 00:29:49.470 --> 00:29:56.460 thank you so much for listening. I hate it when podcasts incessantly ask their 469 00:29:56.500 --> 00:30:00.900 listeners for reviews, but I get why they do it, because reviews are 470 00:30:00.940 --> 00:30:03.660 enormously helpful when you're trying to grow a podcast audience. So here's what we 471 00:30:03.740 --> 00:30:07.609 decided to do. If you leave a review for me to be growth in 472 00:30:07.609 --> 00:30:11.890 apple podcasts and email me a screenshot of the review to James At sweetfish Mediacom, 473 00:30:12.210 --> 00:30:15.569 I'll send you assigned copy of my new book, content based networking, 474 00:30:15.849 --> 00:30:19.210 how to instantly connect with anyone you want to know. We get a review, 475 00:30:19.250 --> 00:30:22.400 you get a free book. We both win.