April 26, 2020

#BehindTheCurtain 22: 3 Benefits of Recreating an Open Office with Zoom

In this episode of the #BehindTheCurtain Series, James & Logan talk about how you can recreate the benefits of an open office environment when working remotely via Zoom (or another conference call tool).

We talk about 3 specific benefits:

1) Reducing feelings of isolation among your team members

2) Allowing leadership to be more connected to your team (and vice versa)

3) Allowing the cross-pollination of ideas that wouldn't happen with only scheduled calls with a specific agenda (hat tip to Ethan Beute on this one)

Some things to keep in mind:

1) Limit the time you use this strategy (not all 40 hours of the work week)

2) You'll have to think about productivity differently

3) Don't schedule really "deep work" during these times.


If you like this episode, you'll probably also love:

At The Table with Patrick Lencioni on Apple Podcasts


Sweet Fish is hiring! Click here to learn more.


Want to get your copy of James' book, Content-Based Networking?

It's available on Amazon now: http://bit.ly/content-basednetworking

If you want it in audiobook format, just search Content-Based Networking or James Carbary on Audible.

Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:02.640 Hey, this is James, the founder of sweet fish media. If you've 2 00:00:02.640 --> 00:00:04.759 listened to me to be growth for a while, you probably have an idea 3 00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:08.750 of what we're passionate about. Loving people really well, a constant pursuit of 4 00:00:08.869 --> 00:00:13.669 learning and inspiring people to own their careers. With all the craziness happening with 5 00:00:13.750 --> 00:00:17.550 this virus, we are incredibly fortunate to be in the business of podcasting. 6 00:00:18.109 --> 00:00:22.219 So many BB brands are looking for alternatives to their inperson events that are being 7 00:00:22.339 --> 00:00:26.780 canceled, and our business is growing as a result. Please don't miss hear 8 00:00:26.859 --> 00:00:30.379 me on this, because I'm not saying this to Brag. It is heartbreaking 9 00:00:30.539 --> 00:00:34.579 the economic impact this is having on so many businesses. But being in the 10 00:00:34.619 --> 00:00:39.130 business of podcasting, the demand for what we do has increased and because of 11 00:00:39.250 --> 00:00:43.130 that we're looking to hire really talented people to help us serve that demand. 12 00:00:43.570 --> 00:00:46.450 So if you like what we're all about it sweet fish and you're looking for 13 00:00:46.490 --> 00:00:49.689 a great career opportunity, hit us up. There's a link in the show 14 00:00:49.729 --> 00:00:52.679 notes where you can apply today. I'm really looking forward to meeting you. 15 00:00:54.719 --> 00:00:58.000 Welcome back to be to be growth. I'm looking lyles with sweet fish media. 16 00:00:58.159 --> 00:01:02.119 Today is another episode in our behind the curtain series. We've been having 17 00:01:02.240 --> 00:01:07.189 more contributors, more folks here on the sweet fish team joining these today it's 18 00:01:07.269 --> 00:01:10.829 me and our founder and CEO, my good Buddy James carberry. James has 19 00:01:10.870 --> 00:01:14.069 it going to day, man, I'm doing well. Madam. I'm excited 20 00:01:14.150 --> 00:01:17.230 to talk about this topic. This is something that actually just I was walking 21 00:01:17.269 --> 00:01:21.019 around the neighborhood last night and was listening to the at the table podcast with 22 00:01:21.060 --> 00:01:23.500 Patrick Sione and they started talking about this idea and I was like, oh 23 00:01:23.500 --> 00:01:27.140 my gosh, this is brilliant. So I instantly put a couple of these 24 00:01:27.260 --> 00:01:32.340 time blocks on my calendar because I think we're going to start, not I 25 00:01:32.459 --> 00:01:34.489 think we're going to start doing this with sweetish. I'm going to start doing 26 00:01:34.530 --> 00:01:38.010 this with sweetish starting next week. So I don't know when this is going 27 00:01:38.049 --> 00:01:41.370 to go live. It may have already happened by the time people are listening 28 00:01:41.409 --> 00:01:45.450 to this, but I'm really excited at about this openoffice concept. Yeah, 29 00:01:45.489 --> 00:01:49.079 man, so we're going to be talking about how you can recreate kind of 30 00:01:49.159 --> 00:01:53.280 the feeling and some of the advantages of an in person open office even while 31 00:01:53.519 --> 00:01:59.840 you're working remotely, and Leverage Zoom or whatever sort of conference call tool that 32 00:01:59.920 --> 00:02:02.189 you're using on a daytoday basis. So tell us a little bit about what 33 00:02:02.349 --> 00:02:05.629 you heard, kind of what it sparked for you when you heard this on 34 00:02:05.790 --> 00:02:08.949 Patrick's podcast. Man. Yeah, so Patrick was talking about the need for 35 00:02:09.229 --> 00:02:15.419 us to use zoom as not restricting the use of zoom just for meetings. 36 00:02:15.740 --> 00:02:19.979 So he said, if it was himmors cohost. That said, if you're 37 00:02:20.139 --> 00:02:24.580 just using zoom and at the top of every one of your zoom calls it's 38 00:02:24.659 --> 00:02:30.169 the heading is a specific agenda item or a, you know, measurable result 39 00:02:30.250 --> 00:02:36.050 that you're trying to achieve, then you're probably not getting the most out of 40 00:02:36.169 --> 00:02:40.770 zoom. And then they started talking about this concept of opening up the floor 41 00:02:42.009 --> 00:02:45.199 and, you know, just saying hey, I'm going to be working this 42 00:02:45.400 --> 00:02:49.280 afternoon on a couple projects. Here's my zoom link if anybody wants to hop 43 00:02:49.439 --> 00:02:52.120 on and, you know, and work with me. And I thought, 44 00:02:52.159 --> 00:02:54.919 oh my gosh, this is so brilliant. It's fantastic, I think for 45 00:02:55.280 --> 00:02:59.629 you know, the entire world is working remote right now, but for us, 46 00:02:59.629 --> 00:03:04.270 obviously, we work remote all the time and I love this idea because 47 00:03:04.710 --> 00:03:08.389 there's all of this negative talk around the open office and I, and I 48 00:03:08.669 --> 00:03:13.139 totally get it, like it. It makes perfect sense why in an open 49 00:03:13.259 --> 00:03:21.620 office format productivity plummets because it's just a constant barrage of distractions. But in 50 00:03:21.740 --> 00:03:27.210 a virtual environment we literally have no distractions to the point where we can feel 51 00:03:27.289 --> 00:03:31.009 isolated. Right. So I'm on calls all day, I'm talking to people 52 00:03:31.050 --> 00:03:36.530 all day long, so I don't necessarily feel it as much, but for 53 00:03:36.689 --> 00:03:39.770 our writers, for our producers, for other people on our team, I 54 00:03:39.849 --> 00:03:46.520 mean they're heads down doing heads down focused work for pretty much the entire week 55 00:03:46.120 --> 00:03:52.000 and now that we're all quarantine, we can't get out at all. Opening 56 00:03:52.120 --> 00:03:53.759 something like this up and starting to do this to where, you know, 57 00:03:53.879 --> 00:03:58.789 I've next Thursday. I'm just going to put my zoom link. I'm going 58 00:03:58.830 --> 00:04:00.789 to tell the team on Monday like Hey, Thursday, from one to five 59 00:04:00.949 --> 00:04:06.669 PM Eastern, I'm going to be working and I've got a couple projects that 60 00:04:06.870 --> 00:04:10.580 that aren't necessarily phone calls. I think I've got one phone call in there. 61 00:04:10.620 --> 00:04:13.900 So obviously, like I'll mute myself on zoom and go and take my 62 00:04:14.020 --> 00:04:16.540 phone call during that time. But I'm just going to I'm putting it as 63 00:04:16.579 --> 00:04:21.699 an open so it's in my google calendar, the calendar and by it's just 64 00:04:21.819 --> 00:04:26.970 a four hour time block, but I've left it open so if people who 65 00:04:26.970 --> 00:04:30.370 are using my calendari link, they can still block time during that block. 66 00:04:30.569 --> 00:04:34.170 Other you know, other people are operations assistant can still put time on there 67 00:04:34.529 --> 00:04:39.240 if things need to get put on there. But it's essentially just kind of 68 00:04:39.439 --> 00:04:42.759 creating this feeling of Hey, I'm going to go to the conference room and 69 00:04:43.000 --> 00:04:46.360 work on some stuff if anybody wants to join me in there, and I'm 70 00:04:46.399 --> 00:04:49.680 really excited about that. We've this is something we can we can implement along 71 00:04:49.759 --> 00:04:54.350 after this virus is done, because we don't have any intention of having a 72 00:04:54.470 --> 00:05:00.269 physical office ever. But I think controlling the open office is a powerful idea 73 00:05:00.589 --> 00:05:04.310 because the cross but, like you had mentioned, something that Ethan View from 74 00:05:04.350 --> 00:05:09.420 Bomb Im talks about a lot is the cross pollen nation of ideas. So 75 00:05:09.860 --> 00:05:14.139 when you're in the same room and you're having this is something linconi talked about 76 00:05:14.180 --> 00:05:17.660 in the podcast to there's a difference between having like happy hour conversation where you're 77 00:05:17.699 --> 00:05:23.209 intentionally not talking about work, but we're you're with colleagues, but he said, 78 00:05:23.250 --> 00:05:28.009 I think we should have more conversation around the business. It's not necessarily 79 00:05:28.129 --> 00:05:32.610 focused on a specific topic, but we're talking about work with our coworkers and 80 00:05:32.970 --> 00:05:36.439 so we're maybe we're talking about that client that we're having a hard time with 81 00:05:36.800 --> 00:05:41.680 or we're talking about a win that we that we got. And I think 82 00:05:41.959 --> 00:05:46.199 by opening up an environment like with an open zoom room where everybody is just 83 00:05:46.360 --> 00:05:50.990 working, I could imagine a setting where maybe our creative director or customer to 84 00:05:51.310 --> 00:05:56.870 Director of customer experience, myself and maybe two of our riders are all in 85 00:05:56.990 --> 00:06:00.149 this room and we've got a writer that's that on your self and she's like, 86 00:06:00.269 --> 00:06:02.670 Hey, I'm writing for this, you know, I'm running for this 87 00:06:02.750 --> 00:06:05.740 client. What are your thoughts on this, this and this? Well, 88 00:06:05.860 --> 00:06:11.899 that could open up a whole slew of like Oh, I never even realize 89 00:06:12.100 --> 00:06:15.379 that that was something that you had to think about in the writing process of 90 00:06:15.500 --> 00:06:19.089 our articles. We need to create a process that alleviates you having to make 91 00:06:19.170 --> 00:06:24.490 that decision or something else, you know, whatever the whatever the issue is. 92 00:06:24.930 --> 00:06:28.370 But by not being around each other, we just we don't we're not 93 00:06:28.610 --> 00:06:34.000 privy to to seeing those kind of things because we're so isolated in the work 94 00:06:34.079 --> 00:06:38.360 that we do outside of meeting things that have a very specific purpose. So 95 00:06:38.680 --> 00:06:41.040 what are your thoughts on this? This is a new idea. Obviously, 96 00:06:41.040 --> 00:06:43.360 I had just heard about it last night. Yeah, you just told me 97 00:06:43.399 --> 00:06:46.000 about it like ten minutes before we hit record and I was like, man, 98 00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:48.149 this is really cool and something that kind of clicked for me as you 99 00:06:48.269 --> 00:06:51.110 were just talking there. And James, you know you and I have a 100 00:06:51.189 --> 00:06:56.189 weekly oneonone right, and I think we've gotten better at structuring those. Hey, 101 00:06:56.389 --> 00:06:59.310 let's add stuff to the list. I've got a list of things that 102 00:06:59.389 --> 00:07:01.699 I need to talk to you that I didn't necessarily need to ping you about 103 00:07:01.699 --> 00:07:05.500 and distract you in the middle of a Tuesday or whatever, but timely. 104 00:07:05.620 --> 00:07:10.660 And so we've created some more structure and rhythm on our team, on the 105 00:07:10.699 --> 00:07:14.699 leadership team and throughout the team for one on ones. But at the same 106 00:07:14.740 --> 00:07:17.329 time, as you were talking about, like the conversations that can come up 107 00:07:17.370 --> 00:07:21.290 naturally. You know, I've mentioned my dog that co offices with me a 108 00:07:21.410 --> 00:07:26.930 lot Mac here on the show as I'm walking him, usually at night after 109 00:07:26.970 --> 00:07:29.769 the kids have gone to bed. You and I have had some of our 110 00:07:29.889 --> 00:07:33.639 most productive conversations where I just called you and it was like hey, let's 111 00:07:33.639 --> 00:07:36.519 just talk about the day a little bit, and we end up talking for 112 00:07:36.600 --> 00:07:41.879 forty five minutes or an hour about how we could shift our service or different 113 00:07:41.920 --> 00:07:45.709 things that we need to address or those sorts of things. And usually those 114 00:07:45.829 --> 00:07:48.550 calls don't start out with a specific agenda of James, let's go through this 115 00:07:48.629 --> 00:07:51.829 checklist. I I'm going to call you at thirty when I'm walking the dog 116 00:07:51.990 --> 00:07:55.589 and we're going to go boom, boom boom through this bullet pointed list. 117 00:07:55.829 --> 00:07:59.939 But it has meandered along with my walk with the dog, me entering along 118 00:08:00.019 --> 00:08:03.339 the Sidebog as me entered into some really great stuff. The other thing that 119 00:08:03.620 --> 00:08:09.220 I think for folks you do a really good job of communicating. You know 120 00:08:09.300 --> 00:08:13.569 where we're going, things that are that need to be the whole team needs 121 00:08:13.610 --> 00:08:16.490 to know about right now. But I imagine there are a lot of teams 122 00:08:16.529 --> 00:08:22.050 right now where leadership and the entire organization is not used to working remotely and 123 00:08:22.170 --> 00:08:26.449 so doing something like this, as well some other things, to proactively communicate 124 00:08:26.730 --> 00:08:31.360 with the entire organization, can help people feel more connected to what's going on, 125 00:08:31.879 --> 00:08:35.120 more informed on what's going on with leadership and therefore feel more safe and 126 00:08:35.200 --> 00:08:39.399 secure, and the more secure you can make your team feel right now probably 127 00:08:39.399 --> 00:08:41.320 the better. Do you want to speak to that? You know, kind 128 00:08:41.320 --> 00:08:46.149 of from CEO Perspective Right now? Yeah, so being available is something that 129 00:08:46.470 --> 00:08:52.549 I think I am learning in the last couple months even there's a difference between 130 00:08:52.629 --> 00:08:56.980 saying that you're available. So that's a passive approach for me as a CEO 131 00:08:58.139 --> 00:09:01.580 to say, Oh, I've got an open door, you can come to 132 00:09:01.659 --> 00:09:05.299 me any time. But I was talking with Ryan from our team about this 133 00:09:05.820 --> 00:09:07.500 maybe about a month ago and he was like, James, it's it's really 134 00:09:07.539 --> 00:09:11.169 easy for you to say that. It's easy for you to tell the entire 135 00:09:11.210 --> 00:09:13.610 team. And we don't have a big time. I mean we've got twenty 136 00:09:13.649 --> 00:09:18.409 people, so it's not huge, but it's real easy for you to to 137 00:09:18.610 --> 00:09:22.009 tell these twenty people, Hey, you can reach out to me anytime, 138 00:09:22.090 --> 00:09:22.929 you can call me, you can slack me, you can text me, 139 00:09:24.009 --> 00:09:28.159 you can whatever. But what you've got to understand is the mental work that 140 00:09:28.320 --> 00:09:31.960 it takes for someone to, you know, the equivalent of get up out 141 00:09:31.960 --> 00:09:37.759 of their desk, walk down the Hallway, walk into your office, because 142 00:09:37.200 --> 00:09:41.230 they're probably not coming to talk to you about something that they think you're doing. 143 00:09:41.309 --> 00:09:45.350 Well, I mean they're they're probably got an issue, whether either with 144 00:09:45.429 --> 00:09:50.029 you or with a CO worker or with, you know, something they fundamentally 145 00:09:50.070 --> 00:09:54.059 disagree on with you know, are pricing or a product that we're bringing to 146 00:09:54.139 --> 00:09:58.940 market or whatever. So it's not a comfortable situation for them and there's a 147 00:09:58.980 --> 00:10:03.299 lot of friction for them. So it's easy for me as a CEO to 148 00:10:03.460 --> 00:10:07.570 think, Oh, I'm checking the box, I'm open, you know, 149 00:10:07.649 --> 00:10:09.649 I'm available. I tell our people all the time you know they can, 150 00:10:09.850 --> 00:10:13.809 they can come and talk to me. But we're doing something like this, 151 00:10:13.009 --> 00:10:18.769 actually says, Hey, I'm going to be in this zoom room and if 152 00:10:18.809 --> 00:10:22.879 anybody wants to work with me, cut like, come on in like that's 153 00:10:22.960 --> 00:10:28.480 me taking a step toward them so that they can then take a step toward 154 00:10:28.639 --> 00:10:31.639 me, as opposed to what I've been doing, which is, Hey, 155 00:10:31.679 --> 00:10:35.710 I'm available, and I do you know I do. We do a weekly 156 00:10:35.750 --> 00:10:39.870 video where our entire leadership team. Most weeks our entire leadership team puts up 157 00:10:39.870 --> 00:10:43.190 a video on slack and just updates the team on their department. So I've 158 00:10:43.230 --> 00:10:48.909 been doing a lot of updates throughout this pandemic about how the business is doing, 159 00:10:48.029 --> 00:10:52.740 getting very granular and specific. These are the customers we lost this week. 160 00:10:52.059 --> 00:10:54.980 These are the customers we gained this week. We're still on an upward 161 00:10:54.980 --> 00:10:58.740 trajectory. We're very fortunate, being in the business that we're in, that 162 00:10:58.860 --> 00:11:03.820 the business is still growing. But keeping the team updated and letting them know, 163 00:11:03.940 --> 00:11:05.529 hey, we lost three customers last week, we picked up for new 164 00:11:05.610 --> 00:11:11.809 ones and a big renewal. So we're still on an upward trajectory. Letting 165 00:11:11.850 --> 00:11:15.090 everybody know that as of right now, we are not having to look at 166 00:11:15.090 --> 00:11:18.120 any sort of layoffs or anything like that. Just keeping them at ease. 167 00:11:18.679 --> 00:11:22.440 So I can push that kind of communication to them and try to be as 168 00:11:22.480 --> 00:11:26.519 open as I can. But by doing this kind of open office thing, 169 00:11:26.919 --> 00:11:31.679 it's just that one additional level where I'm now meeting them halfway. Another thing 170 00:11:31.679 --> 00:11:37.629 I'm trying to do more of is just proactively reaching out to individuals on our 171 00:11:37.629 --> 00:11:39.830 team. Like I said, we have twenty people, not two hundred. 172 00:11:39.230 --> 00:11:43.590 So right now I can make notes to myself to say hey, I just 173 00:11:43.669 --> 00:11:46.110 need to be checking in with people via text message. Hey, how you 174 00:11:46.190 --> 00:11:48.539 doing? Like, how is it, you know, being cooped up? 175 00:11:48.539 --> 00:11:50.379 I know you've got two kids. How are your kids doing with all this? 176 00:11:50.779 --> 00:11:54.779 And so I'm taking a motion toward them, as opposed to what I 177 00:11:56.059 --> 00:12:00.220 think a lot of CEOS, and this was me a month ago, you 178 00:12:00.419 --> 00:12:03.529 can check the box of thinking you're being a good leader just by communicating to 179 00:12:03.570 --> 00:12:07.570 the team that you're available, when you're not actually taking action toward them. 180 00:12:09.129 --> 00:12:13.570 It's a pretty passive to say hey, I'm available and it's not empathetic to 181 00:12:13.809 --> 00:12:16.759 how difficult it is for the person on the other end of that to go 182 00:12:16.960 --> 00:12:20.600 have a conversation with the CEO. Because to me I'm just me, I'm 183 00:12:20.679 --> 00:12:24.159 just a dude. I'm just a guy that decided to start a business half 184 00:12:24.200 --> 00:12:30.110 a decade ago and fortunately have brought a lot of really smart people along the 185 00:12:30.190 --> 00:12:33.269 way with me and it's grown. But to other people, to people that 186 00:12:33.509 --> 00:12:35.950 have, you know, just joined the business in the last six months, 187 00:12:35.950 --> 00:12:41.350 a year, like it's intimidating because we are fully remote. They don't interact 188 00:12:41.389 --> 00:12:43.230 with me a lot. They don't know that if I ever see them in 189 00:12:43.340 --> 00:12:48.419 person, my first instinct is going to be to hug him. I'm glad 190 00:12:48.460 --> 00:12:50.100 you went there because that's exactly what I was going to say it. They 191 00:12:50.139 --> 00:12:54.500 haven't gotten at James Carberry hug yet. Yeah, so that's just a part 192 00:12:54.539 --> 00:12:56.820 of my personality. Like I'm very open and very inviting. I mean we 193 00:12:56.899 --> 00:13:00.370 have a guest room at our house and before this virus, like, we 194 00:13:00.490 --> 00:13:05.090 basically had somebody in that guest room every weekend since we've had the house for 195 00:13:05.169 --> 00:13:07.730 the last year and a half. But that's me assuming that they know things 196 00:13:07.769 --> 00:13:11.850 about me that they just can't know because in the nature of how we work. 197 00:13:11.009 --> 00:13:16.279 so by doing things like texting them, by doing things like this open 198 00:13:16.399 --> 00:13:18.480 office idea, putting up as Zoom Lincoln, saying Hey, I'm going to 199 00:13:18.519 --> 00:13:22.000 be working from from this, you know, on from this link, on 200 00:13:22.120 --> 00:13:26.789 some different projects, from one to five on Thursday. Anybody's welcome to join 201 00:13:26.830 --> 00:13:31.029 me. Would love to jam. And then the conversations that are going to 202 00:13:31.110 --> 00:13:33.590 come out of that, I'm going to learn things about how our people are 203 00:13:33.789 --> 00:13:37.870 working, like what are people are working on, what different projects are doing. 204 00:13:37.389 --> 00:13:41.580 It's going to give me insight as a as a CEO, that I 205 00:13:41.779 --> 00:13:46.259 otherwise would not get apart from doing something like this. So that's what I'm 206 00:13:46.259 --> 00:13:48.539 really excited about to do. You said it so well and I love the 207 00:13:48.620 --> 00:13:54.139 advice that you're given for other CEOS, founders and just anyone who's leading a 208 00:13:54.259 --> 00:13:58.210 team. Like you said, you can think that hey, just tactically, 209 00:13:58.570 --> 00:14:01.169 logistically, I'm available. They have they have me on slack, they have 210 00:14:01.330 --> 00:14:03.850 my phone number, they have this, this, this, but it's not 211 00:14:05.090 --> 00:14:09.730 just about the logistics, it's about the emotions and and the motion. I 212 00:14:09.850 --> 00:14:13.360 like the way you said it, taking emotion toward them so they don't have 213 00:14:13.480 --> 00:14:16.440 to go as far to get to you. So you know, kind of 214 00:14:16.480 --> 00:14:22.080 the way I summarize that this idea of tactically using a zoom or Uber Conference 215 00:14:22.120 --> 00:14:26.029 or whatever conference and call system you use, creating a block on your calendar, 216 00:14:26.110 --> 00:14:28.470 having a zoom link, sharing that with your team and saying Hey, 217 00:14:28.509 --> 00:14:31.909 I'm going to be working here, kind of like like you said, like 218 00:14:31.990 --> 00:14:33.990 Hey, I'm taking my laptop into the conference room. Anybody that wants to 219 00:14:35.629 --> 00:14:39.179 work in there so we can hang out together and maybe talk about what we're 220 00:14:39.220 --> 00:14:41.379 working on. There's really kind of three key benefits, as we've been talking 221 00:14:41.379 --> 00:14:46.179 about it, especially right now. You reduce isolation, but I love the 222 00:14:46.220 --> 00:14:50.500 way that it it does it in just in general for fully remote teams like 223 00:14:50.580 --> 00:14:54.250 ourselves, because I have noticed, if as we've gotten together more with out 224 00:14:54.490 --> 00:14:58.769 at work agenda, that you've got, you know, happy hours. We 225 00:14:58.850 --> 00:15:01.529 did a baby shower remotely here recently. That's kind of on one end of 226 00:15:01.610 --> 00:15:05.289 the spectrum. And then you have your typical hey let's show up for a 227 00:15:05.370 --> 00:15:09.519 thirty minute call, we have an agenda, something in between there to reduce 228 00:15:09.559 --> 00:15:13.960 the isolation and have that feeling of community. So that's one. Two, 229 00:15:13.200 --> 00:15:16.639 as you said, it can be a tool for leadership to get more connected 230 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:22.990 and therefore get more feedback and help the team feel more secure. And then 231 00:15:22.029 --> 00:15:26.549 the great conversation, as we quoted Ethan. I'm sure he's okay with US 232 00:15:26.549 --> 00:15:31.429 quoting his offline comment there, the cross pollination of ideas. He was sharing 233 00:15:31.950 --> 00:15:35.820 that with us, I think, when they were talking about kind of their 234 00:15:35.220 --> 00:15:41.299 semi remote but mostly in office culture at bomb, you know, obviously prepandemic. 235 00:15:41.419 --> 00:15:46.659 So reducing isolation, getting leadership more connected and people more connected to leadership, 236 00:15:46.899 --> 00:15:50.850 and then the great conversations that can improve the business. Those are my 237 00:15:50.049 --> 00:15:52.049 three. Do you have anything else to add to that? Yes, so 238 00:15:52.250 --> 00:15:58.610 rap around the connectedness piece. I think what that connectedness does is it builds 239 00:15:58.730 --> 00:16:03.250 trust, and I'm a big proponent because of all that I've learned from Patrick 240 00:16:03.289 --> 00:16:07.559 Lyncione and all of his books, is that if you can have trust amongst 241 00:16:07.600 --> 00:16:11.559 your team, you're going to grow. Like trust is the foundation for everything, 242 00:16:11.919 --> 00:16:15.799 and so I think by you taking motion as a leader or toward your 243 00:16:15.840 --> 00:16:19.509 people, proactively texting them, doing, you know, an open office zoom 244 00:16:19.549 --> 00:16:22.830 call like this, you know, one or two times a week, I 245 00:16:22.950 --> 00:16:27.190 think that that's going to be what leads to their being trust and when people 246 00:16:27.350 --> 00:16:30.789 trust you they can feel like they can come to you with hard things, 247 00:16:32.590 --> 00:16:37.059 that you, as a leader, can take that and make the decision that 248 00:16:37.100 --> 00:16:41.100 you need to make. But the fact that you have more data points now. 249 00:16:41.139 --> 00:16:44.700 So the more the more people that trust you on your team, the 250 00:16:44.899 --> 00:16:48.850 more available data you're going to have for how you're moving the business for forward. 251 00:16:49.009 --> 00:16:52.250 So that was that was one piece. They're the other thing that I 252 00:16:52.330 --> 00:16:59.690 wanted to to note here was I want to acknowledge that open office, the 253 00:16:59.850 --> 00:17:03.240 open office thing, can be a distraction. So what we're not prescribing is, 254 00:17:03.640 --> 00:17:07.839 hey, you should recreate an open office all the time and just have 255 00:17:07.920 --> 00:17:12.279 a constant zoom room that everyone can access forty hours a week, all throughout 256 00:17:12.279 --> 00:17:15.670 the week, and that way it just is all come by all and that 257 00:17:15.829 --> 00:17:19.670 you guys are all in the same room. This is going to be these 258 00:17:19.869 --> 00:17:23.349 four hours or five hours or ten hours or whatever you decide to do. 259 00:17:25.150 --> 00:17:30.380 Expect less, quote unquote, productivity. Like I know that the projects. 260 00:17:30.460 --> 00:17:33.700 I've got to carefully select the projects that I'm working on during that block of 261 00:17:33.819 --> 00:17:38.339 time because I've just got to expect that I'm not going to be as productive 262 00:17:38.420 --> 00:17:44.329 with that time in the way that I typically think about productivity. But having 263 00:17:44.369 --> 00:17:47.970 these kind of side conversations like what you and I have whenever you're walking your 264 00:17:47.970 --> 00:17:52.609 dog around the neighborhood at night, those are incredibly productive. We've made significant 265 00:17:52.609 --> 00:17:56.890 change just to the business. We've changed our pricing because of those calls. 266 00:17:56.930 --> 00:18:00.960 We've gone after you know, we've developed new products because of those calls. 267 00:18:00.440 --> 00:18:03.519 We've done a lot of things because of the calls. They've been extremely effective 268 00:18:03.680 --> 00:18:08.279 and productive, but it's been productive in a different type of it's a different 269 00:18:08.319 --> 00:18:12.630 type of productive, one that's not expected, it's not necessarily planned, and 270 00:18:12.829 --> 00:18:17.390 so go into that knowing, Hey, you know, we're not jumping in 271 00:18:17.829 --> 00:18:19.750 head first and doing this all of the time. But we're going to do 272 00:18:19.829 --> 00:18:22.750 it. We're going to start doing it once a week. We might open 273 00:18:22.789 --> 00:18:26.460 up a couple blocks, you know, throughout the week. We might start 274 00:18:26.500 --> 00:18:30.819 doing it with teams. So we say hey, Friday afternoons, all of 275 00:18:30.900 --> 00:18:34.180 our producers work together. We might integrated into on boarding. So we might 276 00:18:34.220 --> 00:18:38.339 say hey, we've so we just we just hired a new writer. We 277 00:18:38.380 --> 00:18:42.970 might say hey, for your first months, we want you to be working 278 00:18:44.049 --> 00:18:48.730 alongside another writer on our team. So you're going to be working with emily, 279 00:18:49.289 --> 00:18:52.289 you know, Monday, Wednesday and Friday, and you're going to work 280 00:18:52.329 --> 00:18:56.039 with Tim on Tuesday and Thursday. And then the next week you're going to 281 00:18:56.079 --> 00:19:00.279 flip it so your entire eighth hour day you and another writer are going to 282 00:19:00.359 --> 00:19:02.559 be on the same zoom call. You're not going to be talking the entire 283 00:19:02.599 --> 00:19:07.359 time, obviously you're writing, but any questions you have you're just one mute 284 00:19:07.400 --> 00:19:10.390 button away from saying Hamilee. Sorry, you know I don't want to bug 285 00:19:10.470 --> 00:19:11.789 you, but I've got a quick question here. What how do you guys 286 00:19:11.789 --> 00:19:15.950 typically do this? Now again, you've got to account for the fact that 287 00:19:15.190 --> 00:19:18.829 in that on boarding scenario, emily is going to be less productive. So 288 00:19:19.029 --> 00:19:23.150 we cannot expect emily to produce the same amount of work, work that she 289 00:19:23.299 --> 00:19:29.539 produced, apart from, you know, working next to our new writer or 290 00:19:29.700 --> 00:19:32.900 producer, whatever the role is. So you have to account for that and 291 00:19:33.140 --> 00:19:36.859 I want to make sure that I say that because my my instinct is to 292 00:19:36.900 --> 00:19:38.690 be like, oh, yeah, everybody can work together and we expect the 293 00:19:38.730 --> 00:19:42.329 same level level of productivity. That's not the case. But there are lots 294 00:19:42.369 --> 00:19:47.049 of different ways you can do this. Doing it amongst teams, doing it 295 00:19:47.210 --> 00:19:51.329 where leadership team invites everybody else on the team to work together, like you 296 00:19:51.410 --> 00:19:53.400 can sis and ice in a lot of ways. But I think just thinking 297 00:19:53.440 --> 00:20:00.200 about zoom just as a meeting tool and not a tool like this, where 298 00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:03.839 you can have this type of collaboration and this kind of cross pollination of your 299 00:20:03.920 --> 00:20:07.630 team, I think is a miss. I think we've got to be looking 300 00:20:07.109 --> 00:20:12.109 at zoom bigger and more of a human interaction platform and less of a meeting 301 00:20:12.109 --> 00:20:15.509 platform. Dune, I love the way that you said that. They're a 302 00:20:15.589 --> 00:20:18.589 couple of things that you said. Make sure that you limit the time. 303 00:20:18.670 --> 00:20:23.420 We're not saying flip it on for all forty hours. Think about productivity differently 304 00:20:23.579 --> 00:20:26.539 and then kind of what you are alluding to their you know, if you 305 00:20:26.740 --> 00:20:30.380 are setting up one of these inviting people to come work with you, maybe 306 00:20:30.460 --> 00:20:34.420 you've got some some heads down work that you're not on calls, but not 307 00:20:34.619 --> 00:20:40.569 necessarily super deep work where you've got to be really concentrated and you're going to 308 00:20:40.609 --> 00:20:45.289 get frustrated by kind of zooming in and out right like if I'm doing work, 309 00:20:45.490 --> 00:20:48.170 you know, at my kitchen island and I, you know, tell 310 00:20:48.250 --> 00:20:49.319 my family and till the kids like, Hey, I'm going to do a 311 00:20:49.400 --> 00:20:52.519 little work. It might be some light email or something like that, but 312 00:20:52.559 --> 00:20:56.279 I'm not like trying to focus on like solving a real deep problem, because 313 00:20:56.319 --> 00:21:00.480 that's just not going to work in and same thing goes for this application. 314 00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:03.920 Man. Well, this is really cool. I am excited to start implementing 315 00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:07.710 this here with our Tam and I hope folks get some value out of this. 316 00:21:07.910 --> 00:21:11.430 I think it's a different idea. I think it's obviously very timely with 317 00:21:11.670 --> 00:21:15.990 more folks who are not used to working remote right now. James, if 318 00:21:15.029 --> 00:21:18.339 anybody listening to this, if they're new to the show, they're not connected 319 00:21:18.380 --> 00:21:22.140 with you. What's the best way for them to stay connected with you or 320 00:21:22.220 --> 00:21:25.380 reach out, talking about availability and all that sort of stuff. Man. 321 00:21:25.579 --> 00:21:29.140 Yeah, so superactive on Linkedin, just James Carver and Linkedin. I'm on 322 00:21:29.220 --> 00:21:32.299 Instagram to don't do as much there. We're doing a lot more as a 323 00:21:32.339 --> 00:21:34.769 company on instagram. So check us out sweet fish media there. And then 324 00:21:34.809 --> 00:21:37.130 I don't know that we've talked about it yet. We probably need to do 325 00:21:37.130 --> 00:21:41.210 an entire episode about it, but we just revamped our entire website, so 326 00:21:41.329 --> 00:21:45.609 we're out of the stone ages now. We had we had the same website 327 00:21:45.609 --> 00:21:49.319 for going on half a decade and we finally overhauled it. So I'm really 328 00:21:49.359 --> 00:21:52.200 excited about that. So if you have not been to sweet fish mediacom in 329 00:21:52.279 --> 00:21:56.559 a while, go go check it out there. They you'll see the direction 330 00:21:56.640 --> 00:22:02.069 that the business is going and really becoming a meet a company as opposed to 331 00:22:02.150 --> 00:22:04.269 just to service provider. So really excited about that. But would love to 332 00:22:04.309 --> 00:22:07.109 connect with anybody and everybody, and if you haven't already read the book, 333 00:22:07.269 --> 00:22:11.150 make sure to check out the book. Content based networking on audible or Amazon 334 00:22:11.750 --> 00:22:15.630 of it. Man, for anybody listening to this, I'm not yet connected 335 00:22:15.670 --> 00:22:18.460 with. Just look me up on Linkedin, just like James, is where 336 00:22:18.460 --> 00:22:22.420 I'm most active. My last name is L Y elies. Pretty easy, 337 00:22:22.460 --> 00:22:26.500 easy to find if you just search linked in for Logan Lyles. As always, 338 00:22:26.700 --> 00:22:29.579 thank you so much for listening, everybody. James, this has been 339 00:22:29.619 --> 00:22:32.609 a great conversation. Thanks for bringing this up. I'm glad we shared it 340 00:22:32.730 --> 00:22:36.970 with with everybody today and excited to dive in with our team with this new 341 00:22:37.009 --> 00:22:38.609 application, a zoom man. Yeah, and a lot of this, I 342 00:22:38.690 --> 00:22:42.049 mean this is literally came straight from Patrick Glenconi and at the table. So 343 00:22:42.130 --> 00:22:45.119 if you're not already listening to the at the table PODCAST, make sure to 344 00:22:45.200 --> 00:22:49.440 subscribe to that. It's Patrick and he brings in different co workers, mostly 345 00:22:49.599 --> 00:22:55.200 cody from his team, but just phenomenal conversations around work. We have very, 346 00:22:55.400 --> 00:23:00.789 very similar wise and like are both at the table, the table group, 347 00:23:00.430 --> 00:23:03.589 Patrick's company, and our company has very similar mission. So if you 348 00:23:03.710 --> 00:23:07.789 like this content, you're going to love at the table absolutely. Man, 349 00:23:07.869 --> 00:23:11.789 will make sure to link to Patrick Glencyony's podcast in the show notes for folks, 350 00:23:11.269 --> 00:23:15.059 so definitely go check that out and, as always, everybody, thank 351 00:23:15.099 --> 00:23:22.420 you so much for listening. I hate it when podcasts incessantly ask their listeners 352 00:23:22.460 --> 00:23:26.140 for reviews, but I get why they do it, because reviews are enormously 353 00:23:26.220 --> 00:23:29.650 helpful when you're trying to grow a podcast audience. So here's what we decided 354 00:23:29.690 --> 00:23:32.410 to do. If you leave a review for be to be growth in apple 355 00:23:32.490 --> 00:23:37.410 podcasts and email me a screenshot of the review to James At sweetfish Mediacom, 356 00:23:37.769 --> 00:23:41.089 I'll send you a signed copy of my new book, content based networking, 357 00:23:41.369 --> 00:23:44.720 how to instantly connect with anyone you want to know. We get a review, 358 00:23:44.759 --> 00:23:45.920 you get a free book. We both win.