#Books 5: 10 Ways To Grow Your Business w/ Douglas Burdett & James Muir

WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:04.519 Are you struggling to come up with original content weekend and week out? Start 2 00:00:04.559 --> 00:00:09.189 a podcast, interview your ideal clients, let them talk about what they care 3 00:00:09.230 --> 00:00:14.589 about most and never run out of content ideas again. Learn more at sweet 4 00:00:14.589 --> 00:00:23.940 fish Mediacom. You're listening to BB growth, a daily podcast for B TOB 5 00:00:24.059 --> 00:00:28.179 leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard before, like Gary Vannerd truck and 6 00:00:28.219 --> 00:00:32.020 Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard from the majority of our guests. 7 00:00:32.659 --> 00:00:37.450 That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors. Most 8 00:00:37.530 --> 00:00:41.570 of our guests are in the trenches leading sales and marketing teams. They're implementing 9 00:00:41.649 --> 00:00:46.649 strategy, they're experimenting with tactics, they're building the fastest growing BB companies in 10 00:00:46.689 --> 00:00:49.969 the world. My name is James Carberry. I'm the founder of sweet fish 11 00:00:50.039 --> 00:00:53.479 media, a podcast agency for BB brands, and I'm also one of the 12 00:00:53.600 --> 00:00:57.439 CO hosts of this show. When we're not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, 13 00:00:57.600 --> 00:01:00.280 you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of our own business. Will share the 14 00:01:00.320 --> 00:01:03.549 ups and downs of our journey as we attempt to take over the world. 15 00:01:04.189 --> 00:01:15.069 Just getting well, maybe let's get into the show. Hello and welcome to 16 00:01:15.109 --> 00:01:18.549 the BB growth show monthly book talk. I'm Douglas for Dad, hosts of 17 00:01:18.549 --> 00:01:22.019 the marketing book podcast, where each week I published an interview with the author 18 00:01:22.060 --> 00:01:26.780 of a new marketing or sales book to help my listeners succeed in the quickly 19 00:01:26.980 --> 00:01:30.980 changing world of marketing and sales. Joining me as my friend James Mure, 20 00:01:32.180 --> 00:01:36.849 author of the perfect close, the secret to closing sales, the best selling 21 00:01:36.969 --> 00:01:42.170 practices and techniques for closing the deal. I read every book featured on the 22 00:01:42.209 --> 00:01:47.359 Marketing Book Podcast, but James Reads even more books than I do and he 23 00:01:47.519 --> 00:01:51.840 listens to every episode of the Marketing Book Podcast, so I'm delighted that he 24 00:01:51.920 --> 00:01:55.519 can join me in this monthly episode of the B Tob Growth Show. We 25 00:01:55.599 --> 00:02:00.239 briefly recap some of the key ideas from the marketing and sales books that were 26 00:02:00.239 --> 00:02:04.670 recently featured on the marketing book podcast. James, welcome to the be tob 27 00:02:04.790 --> 00:02:07.629 growth show book talk. Thank you. I guess in this episode we're going 28 00:02:07.629 --> 00:02:12.110 to talk about for recent books featured on the marketing book podcast, which are 29 00:02:12.430 --> 00:02:15.500 Nincompooperre, my favorite title ever. Yeah, why? Your customers, hey 30 00:02:15.539 --> 00:02:19.860 you, and how to fix it, by John Brandt. Rehumanize your business, 31 00:02:19.900 --> 00:02:23.900 how personal videos accelerate sales and improve customer experience by Ethan Butte. Flip 32 00:02:23.979 --> 00:02:28.419 the script, getting people to think that your idea is their idea, by 33 00:02:28.580 --> 00:02:31.530 or in Claugh and Growth Iq. Get smarter about the choices that will make 34 00:02:31.569 --> 00:02:35.490 or break your business by Tiffany Bova. So let's get it on. First 35 00:02:35.490 --> 00:02:38.250 up we've got nincompoopery. Why your customers hey you and how to fix it 36 00:02:38.370 --> 00:02:42.449 by John Brandt, and you know, it is a rare book that can 37 00:02:42.490 --> 00:02:46.199 deliver valuable insight that's relatable and keep your interests by also making you laugh, 38 00:02:46.360 --> 00:02:50.719 and this book does that. So tell us a little bit about John Brandt's 39 00:02:50.719 --> 00:02:58.319 nincompoopery. It's one the entertaining book, brilliantly written and once again, ex 40 00:02:58.400 --> 00:03:01.629 journalists write some of the best books, and he's he was an industry week 41 00:03:01.710 --> 00:03:07.270 and a number of other places, so he what he talks about is an 42 00:03:07.349 --> 00:03:12.550 incompoopery, and it doesn't mean that employees of companies are an incompost but he 43 00:03:12.590 --> 00:03:20.460 talks about this sort of stupid behavior that personifies itself because bad decisions are made 44 00:03:20.699 --> 00:03:27.210 and he talks in the book about how for success in business or for businesses, 45 00:03:27.289 --> 00:03:30.050 and this is based on a lot of research that his his company did. 46 00:03:30.969 --> 00:03:38.409 Is basically a three legged stool of innovation, talent and process. So, 47 00:03:38.490 --> 00:03:39.810 in other words, there's lots of things you could be focusing on. 48 00:03:40.090 --> 00:03:45.960 Many companies do, and many people and executives are distracted by all the the 49 00:03:46.319 --> 00:03:52.639 noise. But innovation, the talent you have working for you and the processes 50 00:03:52.879 --> 00:03:58.750 in Your Business and the innovation is something that, of course, a lotting 51 00:03:58.830 --> 00:04:04.389 a manufacturers talk about and is a buzzword that everyone loves. But he explains 52 00:04:04.590 --> 00:04:10.819 that too many companies think of innovation as hitting some Grand Slam, sorry to 53 00:04:10.860 --> 00:04:15.699 use a American baseball analogy. All the folks overseas don't understand that, but 54 00:04:15.819 --> 00:04:19.899 it's they think about. They've got to had this one breakthrough product and that's 55 00:04:19.980 --> 00:04:24.490 really going to make it all happen. And he explains that that rarely works 56 00:04:24.569 --> 00:04:30.370 that way. Most new products don't work and most new products are not sufficiently 57 00:04:30.850 --> 00:04:36.850 marketed and supported with sales effort. And he explains that for innovation, the 58 00:04:38.009 --> 00:04:43.040 greatest innovation usually has to do with where's the frustration in your customers life? 59 00:04:43.040 --> 00:04:46.160 MMM, how can you make that easier? Yeah, that's one of the 60 00:04:46.199 --> 00:04:49.800 biggest insights I got from this book is the importance of viewing things from the 61 00:04:49.879 --> 00:04:55.430 most important perspective, which is the customers and the employees perspective. Yes, 62 00:04:55.470 --> 00:05:00.149 yes, and so in terms of talent, you know, intellectual capital that 63 00:05:00.230 --> 00:05:04.310 you have at your company, and that's the thing that the most successful companies 64 00:05:04.350 --> 00:05:10.060 are doing, is they are making sure that they are hiring the right kinds 65 00:05:10.100 --> 00:05:15.339 of people for their organization and then training them and inspiring them, basically in 66 00:05:15.819 --> 00:05:21.449 engaging their their minds and also appreciating that in this labor market, they could 67 00:05:21.449 --> 00:05:25.209 leave. So you have to do more than just give them a paycheck. 68 00:05:25.730 --> 00:05:28.250 There's other things you need to do nurse your talent. And now I know 69 00:05:28.449 --> 00:05:31.769 all the human resources executives listening to this will already know that they're they're already 70 00:05:31.810 --> 00:05:34.689 saying, Duh, yeah, of course you have to do that. But 71 00:05:35.040 --> 00:05:40.839 he explains that a lot of companies really get that wrong. and Are you 72 00:05:41.000 --> 00:05:45.079 missing the boat? Maybe it's a generational thing where they may be thinking other 73 00:05:45.199 --> 00:05:48.399 happy to have a job, but the most successful companies are really focused on 74 00:05:49.310 --> 00:05:54.949 improving and cultivating the talent of their workforce and a lot of good examples in 75 00:05:55.029 --> 00:05:59.430 the book. Yeah, yeah, the last thing he's talks about his process 76 00:05:59.509 --> 00:06:03.779 and he says that's sort of like the Broccoli of business where people don't want 77 00:06:03.819 --> 00:06:10.100 to focus on their processes. But the most successful companies they are process oriented 78 00:06:10.180 --> 00:06:15.819 and they create a process and they continuously refine the process and they are very 79 00:06:15.860 --> 00:06:19.689 much engaged with getting their people closest to the process to update and refine the 80 00:06:19.769 --> 00:06:25.850 process. So really very refreshing book, a lot of fun, a lot 81 00:06:25.930 --> 00:06:30.089 of fun to interview him. Really, really very well done. Yeah, 82 00:06:30.089 --> 00:06:32.519 it does a great job of sort of irreverently pointing out all the absurdity that 83 00:06:32.720 --> 00:06:35.879 is just so common in business today. One of my favorites was that customer 84 00:06:35.959 --> 00:06:44.399 free zones, a customer free zone, where he explains that everyone at your 85 00:06:44.560 --> 00:06:50.550 company should be somehow connected to customers or help them understand that they are connected 86 00:06:50.589 --> 00:06:57.069 with customers. And actually the most successful companies are making sure that their employees 87 00:06:57.110 --> 00:07:01.180 are observant of what their customers are doing and are involved in their customers lives 88 00:07:01.220 --> 00:07:06.339 and basically doing everything they can to help those customers get deeper, get those 89 00:07:06.379 --> 00:07:11.100 employees to get deeper insights into their customer because a lot of the great innovative 90 00:07:11.100 --> 00:07:15.930 ideas come from throughout the organization. And he refers to a lot of companies 91 00:07:15.970 --> 00:07:21.050 that have customer free zones where they I don't deal with customers. No, 92 00:07:21.170 --> 00:07:26.209 that's not my problem and that's like a for example in a maybe billing the 93 00:07:26.290 --> 00:07:30.079 thing. I don't deal with customers. Yes, you do, and the 94 00:07:30.240 --> 00:07:34.399 result of what you do in billing has a big impact on that customers experience 95 00:07:34.720 --> 00:07:39.279 with your organization. Yeah, absolutely, it is. It's a very entertaining 96 00:07:39.319 --> 00:07:41.920 and humorous book. Of course you can clean that from the title, and 97 00:07:42.000 --> 00:07:45.870 yet it's just packing a ton of insight. So any last thoughts, favorite 98 00:07:45.870 --> 00:07:47.670 aspects or takeaways? I'd love to see him talk. I think that. 99 00:07:48.709 --> 00:07:53.350 You know, writing is hard, humor is even harder. Yeah, and 100 00:07:53.949 --> 00:07:57.709 this was a very entertaining book and I've heard from listeners who've who've read it, 101 00:07:57.790 --> 00:08:00.819 who really got a lot out of it. Yep, I was one 102 00:08:00.860 --> 00:08:03.459 of them. All right. Well, next up we've got rehumanize your business. 103 00:08:03.779 --> 00:08:09.420 How personal videos accelerate sales and improve customer experience by Ethan buttes and facetofaces. 104 00:08:09.459 --> 00:08:11.899 Where it's at, and video is a great way to accomplish that. 105 00:08:11.939 --> 00:08:15.290 This book covers that and more so. Tell us a little bit about rehumanize 106 00:08:15.290 --> 00:08:18.490 Your Business. So the listeners probably wondering what's a personal video? Well, 107 00:08:18.529 --> 00:08:24.129 it's not a video of the boss standing there in front of a screen, 108 00:08:24.329 --> 00:08:28.720 you know, a camera reading a teleprompter. A personal video is where you've 109 00:08:28.720 --> 00:08:33.960 got a camera on your computer and you can record a quick video to somebody 110 00:08:35.240 --> 00:08:39.919 and then attached to an email. And the author's Ethan Butte and Steven Patch 111 00:08:39.960 --> 00:08:45.470 and Alle they are with a company called Bombomb, which is a marketing and 112 00:08:45.590 --> 00:08:50.830 sales platform, email platform, that where you can attach videos and send it 113 00:08:50.909 --> 00:08:54.110 to people. But they're really clear that you don't have to use their product, 114 00:08:54.110 --> 00:08:56.620 although you can get a free trial of it, you don't have to 115 00:08:56.659 --> 00:08:58.940 use their product to do what's in their book that you know. I don't 116 00:08:58.980 --> 00:09:03.940 use their product and I send personal videos. But they talked about how personal 117 00:09:03.980 --> 00:09:09.649 videos have enormous impact and there's some studies they've done of how much greater the 118 00:09:09.769 --> 00:09:13.090 open rates are on a video than has an email that has a video. 119 00:09:13.529 --> 00:09:18.929 The response rate is greater and it's because of its ability to connect with our 120 00:09:18.970 --> 00:09:26.039 caveman brain. You see that video and it's human and they talk about how 121 00:09:26.320 --> 00:09:30.919 you should just send that first video, no do overs, and by the 122 00:09:30.960 --> 00:09:33.799 time you get to the ten video that you're sending somebody, you're a whole 123 00:09:33.879 --> 00:09:37.000 lot better, and then by the time you send a hundred you're really good 124 00:09:37.080 --> 00:09:39.669 at it and if your flawed, if you make mistakes, it's even better 125 00:09:39.710 --> 00:09:43.389 because you seem more human. But they also go into the book about how 126 00:09:45.110 --> 00:09:48.830 emails are. You're never getting ready of email. So it's a great app 127 00:09:50.309 --> 00:09:54.299 it's the killer APP, but the people actually are spending more time typing out 128 00:09:54.299 --> 00:09:58.460 their their emails and sending them they would to do a video and a lot 129 00:09:58.580 --> 00:10:03.580 of what they're typing out is either not read or is misunderstood and you don't 130 00:10:03.580 --> 00:10:11.289 understand any of the other content text behind it. And I had sent some 131 00:10:11.370 --> 00:10:13.850 personal videos and after reading the book I've been sending a whole lot more, 132 00:10:15.090 --> 00:10:18.970 even just as they say, believe it or not, it's actually faster just 133 00:10:18.049 --> 00:10:24.240 to record a quick video and send it to somebody and they get what you're 134 00:10:24.360 --> 00:10:28.360 what you're trying to say. Agreed and it creates a much better relationship. 135 00:10:28.360 --> 00:10:31.399 Right, and relationships as a whole. Point anything less than that we're leaving 136 00:10:31.440 --> 00:10:33.759 something on the table, and so I think personal video will maybe not as 137 00:10:33.799 --> 00:10:39.350 good as an imperson meeting allows us to create better relationships than any other channel 138 00:10:39.389 --> 00:10:41.629 that are at our disposal. And I'll lets you scale up, because you 139 00:10:41.669 --> 00:10:43.629 don't have to leave. You can just do it on your video and you 140 00:10:43.710 --> 00:10:48.309 can still remain personal while you're doing it. Yes, and you shouldn't go 141 00:10:48.549 --> 00:10:52.779 buy a bunch of equipment to get started with this. He said that most 142 00:10:52.860 --> 00:10:56.700 everybody already has on their computer what they need. And if yeah, or 143 00:10:56.700 --> 00:10:58.740 your phone, yeah, you can send it on your phone. Or you've 144 00:10:58.779 --> 00:11:01.899 got a most of us, like I've got a IMAC here. It's got 145 00:11:01.940 --> 00:11:07.769 a camera on there and there's a people can hear, there's a microphone on 146 00:11:07.809 --> 00:11:11.409 the computer. It's all there. Just try sending it. Sin Send One 147 00:11:11.490 --> 00:11:15.490 to your spouse or your kids or something. It's it's some I'm glad I 148 00:11:15.610 --> 00:11:20.039 read it and it reminded me of the power of sending those videos and also 149 00:11:20.879 --> 00:11:22.679 when you send one of those, you also know that people are going to 150 00:11:22.679 --> 00:11:26.440 appreciate it more. It stands out and that's part of the data that they've 151 00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:30.600 got in terms of the openership and how much of the message gets through the 152 00:11:30.639 --> 00:11:33.389 actual person. So yeah, I rehumanize your business makes it just a air 153 00:11:33.470 --> 00:11:39.190 tight case for why using personal video is critical for everybody. It's very practical, 154 00:11:39.269 --> 00:11:41.830 very step by step, very hands on. I loved it. But 155 00:11:41.990 --> 00:11:46.259 you like best about the humanize Your Business? Oh, probably that it reminded 156 00:11:46.340 --> 00:11:50.539 me that I should be doing it. And it's secret, the secret to 157 00:11:50.580 --> 00:11:52.340 guy. I had been doing some of them, but the secret to get 158 00:11:52.419 --> 00:11:56.500 it has getting started. And sure enough, by the ten one I did 159 00:11:56.700 --> 00:11:58.580 and sent, because I'm using them for prospecting. I'm reaching out to, 160 00:12:00.340 --> 00:12:03.330 you know, companies and organizations to introduce myself and see if we might be 161 00:12:03.370 --> 00:12:07.769 able to help them. And this seems to work well. So Yep. 162 00:12:09.129 --> 00:12:11.330 Well, like Nike says, you just do it right. That's kind of 163 00:12:11.330 --> 00:12:16.600 their there. Yeah, just get started on it and start sending some of 164 00:12:16.679 --> 00:12:20.120 those videos. It's actually faster and it's more effective. So I don't know, 165 00:12:20.279 --> 00:12:24.480 it's and again dog on it. They had all that science, but 166 00:12:24.679 --> 00:12:28.120 yeah, and data and data behind all the information they had there. So 167 00:12:28.559 --> 00:12:31.870 well, great book. Next up we've got flip the script, getting people 168 00:12:31.909 --> 00:12:35.750 to think that your idea is their idea by or in claugh and, holy 169 00:12:35.750 --> 00:12:39.269 smokes, I read this book in one day. It was like, Oh 170 00:12:39.350 --> 00:12:43.350 really, yeah, it's like pure entertainment with just some a few brilliant insights 171 00:12:43.389 --> 00:12:46.019 weaved into these amazing stories that are in the book. So tell us a 172 00:12:46.019 --> 00:12:50.820 little bit about flip the script. Well, so ornclaugh wrote the best seller 173 00:12:52.500 --> 00:12:56.139 pitch anything, which I believe it is sold over a million copies, and 174 00:12:56.700 --> 00:12:58.090 that was about two thousand and eleven. I think you wrote that. So 175 00:12:58.330 --> 00:13:01.610 flip the script. What he does in the book. It's an exciting book 176 00:13:01.610 --> 00:13:05.889 to read, which is why you probably write in one day. What he 177 00:13:05.970 --> 00:13:09.769 does is he takes you around the world on these really interesting stories and each 178 00:13:09.929 --> 00:13:13.840 story he tells he says that they're real stories, but he changed the names 179 00:13:13.840 --> 00:13:18.080 of the companies and he's been involved in it. You know, they're exciting, 180 00:13:18.159 --> 00:13:22.360 they're exciting read and each one of them has an element of the different 181 00:13:22.879 --> 00:13:26.840 ways that you can flip the script and get somebody to think their idea is 182 00:13:26.000 --> 00:13:31.350 yours. And then he ties it all together at the very end. Now, 183 00:13:31.990 --> 00:13:35.350 the stories were, I shouldn't say that they're almost too compelling, because 184 00:13:35.389 --> 00:13:39.149 I got so I got so into the stories. I was worried that I 185 00:13:39.269 --> 00:13:43.460 was missing what. Is there some point he's making here about that that I'm 186 00:13:43.460 --> 00:13:46.740 going to be tested on? But yeah, he buried them in there really 187 00:13:46.779 --> 00:13:50.220 well story and pull out the the insights in each one. He ties it 188 00:13:50.259 --> 00:13:54.929 up at the end. Yeah, yeah, so it was really exciting, 189 00:13:54.970 --> 00:14:00.529 very entertaining and just to make sure that we're providing some value here instead of 190 00:14:00.570 --> 00:14:03.610 saying it was a good bunch of great stories, let me let me mention 191 00:14:03.649 --> 00:14:07.250 a couple of things that he talked about. Where in selling now, as 192 00:14:07.529 --> 00:14:11.759 James Muir would know, you know, the way people buy is changed and 193 00:14:11.879 --> 00:14:16.039 the expectations people have for the control that they want, and that's why it's 194 00:14:16.200 --> 00:14:22.360 so an in such an interesting idea about how you really do need to make 195 00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:26.110 sure that it they feel like it's their idea and there's ways to do it, 196 00:14:26.309 --> 00:14:28.509 you know, ethically, without, you know, deceiving people. But 197 00:14:30.110 --> 00:14:33.110 a couple of things that and also, as I read through it, as 198 00:14:33.149 --> 00:14:35.309 he talked about some of these things, I realized, Oh yeah, I've 199 00:14:35.350 --> 00:14:37.110 been burned by that before. I've had that problem. Like one of them 200 00:14:37.190 --> 00:14:43.340 was called dominance hierarchy or status alignment, where you are not helping yourself by 201 00:14:43.419 --> 00:14:48.779 taking a supplicant role in the buyer seller situation. Right, so you know 202 00:14:48.899 --> 00:14:52.330 that's where your expertise comes in. What did you think about that? Man, 203 00:14:52.409 --> 00:14:54.529 you know I'm talking about you, don't. You start to come off 204 00:14:54.610 --> 00:14:58.769 as begging if you don't stand your ground, and that's a major theme in 205 00:14:58.889 --> 00:15:03.529 pitch anything as well. But he kind of covers it here and then add 206 00:15:03.570 --> 00:15:07.559 some concepts to that, something called status alignment and then a status tipoff, 207 00:15:07.600 --> 00:15:11.159 which is a technique where you, with your dialog you let them know that 208 00:15:11.240 --> 00:15:15.200 you're on the same level as them and that you're not a subservient level. 209 00:15:15.240 --> 00:15:18.759 Yes, yes, and that's where he said don't try and beat you should 210 00:15:18.759 --> 00:15:22.110 never try and be as someone. But he even gave an example that in 211 00:15:22.149 --> 00:15:26.909 the interview I did with him where we started talking about motorcycles and he asked 212 00:15:26.909 --> 00:15:30.110 me about what kind of motorcycle I have and I told him and then he 213 00:15:30.269 --> 00:15:35.389 started using the wrong number. He got a very minor detail wrong, and 214 00:15:35.509 --> 00:15:37.820 then afterwards he said now, what did you think when I said that? 215 00:15:37.860 --> 00:15:39.779 I said I think you didn't know what you were talking about, but you 216 00:15:39.860 --> 00:15:43.259 were trying to act like you did. He said, that's exactly that's exactly 217 00:15:43.340 --> 00:15:46.059 what it is where you you clearly have to show that you know the inside 218 00:15:46.059 --> 00:15:50.009 baseball term and have the expertise when you're talking to these folks. And a 219 00:15:50.049 --> 00:15:54.769 key mistake that people make is that they use the wrong level of rapport a 220 00:15:54.090 --> 00:15:58.049 rediculously simple level of report, and they think that that's improving their status with 221 00:15:58.169 --> 00:16:00.850 the client and that's that they doesn't work. Right. Oh wait, you 222 00:16:00.929 --> 00:16:03.759 live in Florida. I've been to Florida before. That is a lame level 223 00:16:03.799 --> 00:16:07.960 of rapport yeah, yeah, you're from Jersey. I'm from Jersey. Right, 224 00:16:08.159 --> 00:16:11.279 amazing. Right. Yeah. So he's got some other concepts in there, 225 00:16:11.360 --> 00:16:15.080 the certainty flash roll, which is again another set of dialog to let 226 00:16:15.120 --> 00:16:18.870 them know right away that you know exactly what you're talking about and you're completely 227 00:16:18.870 --> 00:16:23.149 qualified and you've dealt with this problem that they have before exactly so well that 228 00:16:23.350 --> 00:16:26.789 they don't want to they don't want to shake you down about it. And 229 00:16:26.029 --> 00:16:30.029 so that's the very key thing to set because it's beats up the entire process 230 00:16:30.149 --> 00:16:34.100 and let's a move on to the other parts of the sort of presentation as 231 00:16:34.100 --> 00:16:37.860 a conversation. Yeah, and he's got this one point in the book he 232 00:16:37.980 --> 00:16:42.580 reminds you under the part about a prewired idea. Right, you have to 233 00:16:42.659 --> 00:16:47.809 remind them. You're keep in mind. They are asking themselves, why do 234 00:16:47.929 --> 00:16:52.090 I care? What's in it for me and why you? And too often 235 00:16:52.610 --> 00:16:57.210 in a presentation or sale situation that's not at the forefront of the presenter or 236 00:16:57.250 --> 00:17:03.680 the seller's mind. And another idea is this concept he has, of which 237 00:17:03.759 --> 00:17:07.039 is one of many, was winter is coming. In other words, you 238 00:17:07.240 --> 00:17:12.359 have got to help them understand that they are is a big proud they're standing 239 00:17:12.359 --> 00:17:15.390 on an an hill and they don't know it. Winter is coming. There 240 00:17:15.549 --> 00:17:21.269 is something that you have expertise about that you need to help them understand that. 241 00:17:21.390 --> 00:17:22.789 This is a ticking I bomb, and this of course, comes up 242 00:17:22.910 --> 00:17:26.190 and eat their lunch. By Anthony and Areno, sorry to go off script 243 00:17:26.230 --> 00:17:29.869 and talk about about book for a while back, but you know him well. 244 00:17:30.420 --> 00:17:32.539 Where he says, you know, you don't call up a company and 245 00:17:32.579 --> 00:17:34.579 say, I'd like to talk to you find out about your business so see 246 00:17:34.579 --> 00:17:38.779 if you have any problems. No, you come to them now and say, 247 00:17:40.460 --> 00:17:44.410 based on my experience with similar companies like yours, these are the four 248 00:17:44.490 --> 00:17:48.170 things you should be concerned about for the next eighteen months. Right, that's 249 00:17:48.250 --> 00:17:51.690 winter. Yeah, that's winner is coming. You didn't know that, did 250 00:17:51.730 --> 00:17:55.250 you? Right? So that. Yeah, he calls these idea receptors, 251 00:17:55.329 --> 00:17:59.599 you know, where you're already pre wired to accept certain ideas, and the 252 00:17:59.759 --> 00:18:02.039 the idea that winner is comings one of those. That the other one was 253 00:18:02.079 --> 00:18:04.359 to x the amount of value. And then skin in the game. was 254 00:18:04.440 --> 00:18:07.240 another concept that he added in there, which is they need to know you're 255 00:18:07.240 --> 00:18:10.599 all in. Yes, you're going to you're gonna go, you're going to 256 00:18:10.640 --> 00:18:11.720 go and tell it's done. Not until you're tired. You're going to go 257 00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:15.470 and tell us done. And that's an important concept, he says, as 258 00:18:15.509 --> 00:18:18.670 part of the message that you're supposed to be delivering. Yeah, two other 259 00:18:18.829 --> 00:18:21.789 things from the book that were interesting. Was One is he talks about leveraging 260 00:18:22.230 --> 00:18:27.140 pessimism and you need to go negative. He talks about how sales people there 261 00:18:27.140 --> 00:18:30.740 they're so optimistic, whereas you've got to say you've got to say look, 262 00:18:30.740 --> 00:18:36.779 there's some downsides here and you've got to help them understand that. See, 263 00:18:36.819 --> 00:18:40.380 they're already thinking pessimistically. What you're trying to do is show them the four 264 00:18:40.460 --> 00:18:42.970 corners of the pessimism room. Right, and do it preemptively. Yes, 265 00:18:44.009 --> 00:18:45.329 right away, them to bring it up. You're going to bring it up. 266 00:18:45.369 --> 00:18:48.529 Yeah, and also he talks about how you you got to teach him 267 00:18:48.529 --> 00:18:52.450 how to buy whatever you're selling. They don't know how to buy what you're 268 00:18:52.450 --> 00:18:55.839 selling, and then we seem to appreciate that. Agreed. Well, this 269 00:18:55.920 --> 00:18:59.880 is I mean, I enjoyed the book just because the stories were so engaging 270 00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:03.119 and then in weaved inside those little stories for these little points, and I 271 00:19:03.359 --> 00:19:06.200 did have to have a pencil to pull those out that he did come and 272 00:19:06.240 --> 00:19:07.799 cover them at the end. But I really enjoyed the book. But what 273 00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:11.390 was your your favorite part of flip the script? Well, it was like 274 00:19:11.990 --> 00:19:17.190 eating food that's really good for you, but it tastes even better than it 275 00:19:17.309 --> 00:19:21.549 is for you. You know what I mean? Yes, it's like that. 276 00:19:21.789 --> 00:19:25.460 That can't be good for me. So that it was just it was 277 00:19:25.500 --> 00:19:30.539 very entertaining and it was you had some some things that had me think differently 278 00:19:30.579 --> 00:19:33.380 from some of the other books that I've read about sales. Truly, there 279 00:19:33.460 --> 00:19:37.059 was some paradigm shifting things in there. All right. So well, last 280 00:19:37.099 --> 00:19:41.250 up we've got growth IQ getting smarter about the choices that will make or break 281 00:19:41.250 --> 00:19:45.970 our business, by Tiffany Bova, and this book is organized and written in 282 00:19:45.089 --> 00:19:49.289 a way that talks about some big and difficult challenges for companies, but but 283 00:19:49.809 --> 00:19:52.960 has a conversation about that in a very simple way, which I liked. 284 00:19:53.039 --> 00:19:57.279 So top was a little bit about Growth Iq. So this book it covers 285 00:19:57.920 --> 00:20:03.240 the ten ways that companies can grow. So in some of them are not 286 00:20:03.519 --> 00:20:07.589 new, but she updates them and she added a few extra ones. But 287 00:20:07.670 --> 00:20:11.630 she said basically, in this new age there's there's really ten ways the companies 288 00:20:11.630 --> 00:20:14.750 can grow and they can do a combination of a few of them. Of 289 00:20:14.829 --> 00:20:17.549 course they have to do them at the right time and some of them don't 290 00:20:17.549 --> 00:20:21.269 work. But the reason I was so interested in having this book on the 291 00:20:21.309 --> 00:20:26.660 Marketing Book podcast is because there are a lot of CEOS who are, I 292 00:20:26.779 --> 00:20:30.339 know this because I worked at this kind of company once, slamming their fists 293 00:20:30.619 --> 00:20:36.970 on the Conference Room Table saying go, go, make more money, go, 294 00:20:37.809 --> 00:20:40.769 go, go the business it, go, go, make more cold 295 00:20:40.849 --> 00:20:45.130 calls, Go, do more ads, you know. And this is where 296 00:20:45.130 --> 00:20:49.559 a salesperson or a marketing person could quietly guide their company towards one of the 297 00:20:49.759 --> 00:20:52.839 one or more of these ten ways to grow. In other words, it's 298 00:20:52.839 --> 00:20:56.359 like saying go, make it rain. Well, okay, there's a few 299 00:20:56.359 --> 00:21:00.720 things that you have to do from a strategic standpoint, and so let me 300 00:21:00.799 --> 00:21:04.509 just mention that. The real quickly, what the ten growth paths are for 301 00:21:04.630 --> 00:21:10.150 the listener. One of them is customer experience. Basically give your customers a 302 00:21:10.269 --> 00:21:15.309 better experience it would, which then makes them buy more and and and actually 303 00:21:15.309 --> 00:21:18.900 advocate for you. And every chapter in the book or every section the book, 304 00:21:18.980 --> 00:21:22.180 she's got an example of companies that did it well and companies did it 305 00:21:22.339 --> 00:21:26.140 badly. And some of the ones that did it badly are those darlings of 306 00:21:26.259 --> 00:21:30.660 marketing books, like Smart Bucks or Amazon. Surprised? Yeah, they've screwed 307 00:21:30.700 --> 00:21:33.890 up some certain things, and so it's, you know, it's very credible. 308 00:21:34.049 --> 00:21:38.529 The second one is selling more existing products to existing customers. I mean, 309 00:21:38.529 --> 00:21:42.089 you already know these people. Just sell more to them. Third is 310 00:21:42.089 --> 00:21:47.720 expand into new markets with the products you already have. So you can see 311 00:21:47.759 --> 00:21:49.759 how that's a little more difficult than the second one I mentioned. The the 312 00:21:49.920 --> 00:21:56.200 fourth one is sell new products to existing markets and the fifth one is sell 313 00:21:56.319 --> 00:22:00.400 new products to new customers, which is really difficult. It's it's generally a 314 00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:03.829 riskier but it's done. It's done. The sixth one is the one that 315 00:22:03.869 --> 00:22:07.029 I'm sure James we were like, and I secretly was my favorite. It 316 00:22:07.190 --> 00:22:11.029 was my favorite. It was called optimized sales, streamline sales, efforts to 317 00:22:11.109 --> 00:22:18.779 increase productivity. My goodness, in that section the inefficiency of certain sales processes 318 00:22:18.819 --> 00:22:22.539 at companies. If it were in any other aspect of the business, the 319 00:22:22.700 --> 00:22:27.539 CEO and whoever's responsible for that department have been fired long ago, and she 320 00:22:27.740 --> 00:22:33.730 has. Tiffany has a real expertise in optimizing sales and that's just an enormous 321 00:22:34.490 --> 00:22:38.809 opportunity for so many companies. The seventh one is minimized affection, you know, 322 00:22:40.529 --> 00:22:45.440 reducing your churn basically retain more customers. And, James Muir, do 323 00:22:45.480 --> 00:22:47.839 you see how that might actually be connected to the first one, which was 324 00:22:48.319 --> 00:22:52.559 improving your customer experience? Yeah, that's why we got we have sequences that 325 00:22:52.680 --> 00:22:56.440 she offers. Yes, yes, and so reducing your churn. You know, 326 00:22:56.519 --> 00:23:00.670 there's some companies that are all about chasing after the new customer. Yeah, 327 00:23:00.710 --> 00:23:03.390 don't worry about the existing ones. They have very leaky buckets and from 328 00:23:03.430 --> 00:23:08.549 a revenue speed and revenue increase standpoint, if you could just keep the customers 329 00:23:08.549 --> 00:23:14.180 you have and sell more to them, it does more than than generating additional 330 00:23:14.259 --> 00:23:15.700 net new customers. All that. You should try and do that as well. 331 00:23:17.180 --> 00:23:22.740 Eight was partnerships, which is a third party alliances, channels, ECOS 332 00:23:22.819 --> 00:23:25.779 systems. You're starting to see a lot more of that. It makes a 333 00:23:25.819 --> 00:23:30.490 lot more sense. There's a lot of expertise. have their coopetition. That's 334 00:23:30.490 --> 00:23:34.450 where you cooperate with a what traditionally would have been a competitor, but the 335 00:23:34.569 --> 00:23:40.009 truth is that within this world of specialization, there may not be any overlap 336 00:23:40.049 --> 00:23:44.240 at all and it makes all kinds of sense to cooperate with what you may 337 00:23:44.279 --> 00:23:47.960 have thought of as a as a competitor. And the last one is called 338 00:23:48.000 --> 00:23:55.990 unconventional strategies, which was like purpose driven businesses, where it's achieving a higher 339 00:23:56.069 --> 00:24:00.269 good or some sort of social benefit, like, I could give an example, 340 00:24:00.390 --> 00:24:06.470 like Tom Shoes or, I guess warby Parker some of the others, 341 00:24:06.549 --> 00:24:11.539 where you buy something and then a lot of their profits go into some mission 342 00:24:11.619 --> 00:24:15.420 that they have. Yeah, I think at the beginning she says there's no 343 00:24:15.500 --> 00:24:19.539 one, there's no silver bullet and that the right growth path is actually contextual. 344 00:24:19.779 --> 00:24:23.369 Right. Yes, it depends on the circumstances in the events for the 345 00:24:23.450 --> 00:24:27.250 organization. That that's what determines which of these strategies is going to be most 346 00:24:27.250 --> 00:24:32.130 appropriate for each organization. So there's not it's not like number five and number 347 00:24:32.170 --> 00:24:34.970 eight of the best for everyone. They depends on the organization. Right. 348 00:24:36.089 --> 00:24:37.250 And I again, like I said before, you have to get it at 349 00:24:37.289 --> 00:24:41.160 the right time. But in the interview, you know, back to my 350 00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:45.039 CEO slamming their fist on the conference room table, she said, you know, 351 00:24:45.119 --> 00:24:48.039 in the past companies would say, oh, we got to grow, 352 00:24:48.079 --> 00:24:55.390 all right, hire more salespeople, do more marketing, cut prices. Right, 353 00:24:55.430 --> 00:24:59.789 it's not necessarily you know, all three of those might not actually work. 354 00:24:59.869 --> 00:25:03.910 You could be pursuing these other things which a generate proven growth. I 355 00:25:04.029 --> 00:25:08.900 do get a sense that her favorite of all the strategies of competitive differentiation is 356 00:25:10.180 --> 00:25:12.420 customer experience. I think that's probably why she included it as number one. 357 00:25:14.140 --> 00:25:15.900 That's just my sense. Well, no, it's true, James, and 358 00:25:17.059 --> 00:25:18.700 and that was one of the big threads of the book, is that through 359 00:25:19.140 --> 00:25:25.329 almost every one of those ten sections. The ones that succeed at whatever path 360 00:25:25.450 --> 00:25:30.569 they take are the ones that had the deepest understanding of their customers. Agreed 361 00:25:30.809 --> 00:25:36.359 in and again she explain just like back to Nim campoopery, where if you 362 00:25:36.480 --> 00:25:40.880 just understand your customers and find the friction in their life, you're going to 363 00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:45.039 be that much closer to being more successful and definitely more competitive. So yeah, 364 00:25:45.039 --> 00:25:49.000 that was that probably was my biggest takeaway, where she explains that getting 365 00:25:49.029 --> 00:25:53.589 close to your customers, really understanding them, you're just going to be more 366 00:25:53.630 --> 00:25:57.869 successful than you still have to pick the right what makes sense for your business, 367 00:25:57.950 --> 00:26:03.589 but she gave example after example where companies had, I'm almost embarrassed to 368 00:26:03.630 --> 00:26:07.660 say, no clue about their customers. Yeah, in fact, I think 369 00:26:07.700 --> 00:26:11.940 for the listener it's good they know that this book is replete with examples. 370 00:26:11.059 --> 00:26:15.980 There's never an there's never a common or a statement or a strategy that's not 371 00:26:15.059 --> 00:26:19.690 backed up with multiple examples. And then every chapter actually starts with a bunch 372 00:26:19.690 --> 00:26:25.289 of metrics that explains why that particular strategy is important. And so that's very 373 00:26:25.329 --> 00:26:27.450 guy. I'm being a being numbers guy. I really enjoyed that piece of 374 00:26:27.490 --> 00:26:30.809 it. You too. There's a reason it's a Wall Street Journal best seller. 375 00:26:32.210 --> 00:26:34.759 Yeah, no doubt, no doubt it's awesome book and my favorite, 376 00:26:34.759 --> 00:26:40.279 obviously, was the sales part about optimizing sales efficiency. And there's a couple 377 00:26:40.279 --> 00:26:42.000 of metrics in there that are just mind blowing, and they've been around for 378 00:26:42.079 --> 00:26:45.440 years, so it's not like it's the first time it's been published. But 379 00:26:45.200 --> 00:26:48.069 when you think about it, it's just a mind blowing stat that, you 380 00:26:48.150 --> 00:26:52.910 know, sixty six percent of all s sales professionals time is wasted on non 381 00:26:52.430 --> 00:26:56.630 selling activities. And then only about half sales people ever hit quota. And 382 00:26:56.789 --> 00:27:00.349 so if you were just to get your middle performers operating two to three percent 383 00:27:00.390 --> 00:27:04.099 better, that's going to make a huge difference. And so what optimizing is? 384 00:27:04.700 --> 00:27:10.940 It mostly boils down to just maximizing individual contributors time with customers, right, 385 00:27:10.980 --> 00:27:12.619 and if you think about that, just, you know, reducing non 386 00:27:12.700 --> 00:27:17.730 selling time by maybe fifty percent, that's that's the equivalent of doubling your sales 387 00:27:17.809 --> 00:27:21.369 force if they're really spending sixty six percent of their time on non selling ex 388 00:27:22.210 --> 00:27:26.210 so I mean, and yet we see just ridiculous administrative burdens put on sales 389 00:27:26.250 --> 00:27:29.289 people and sells professionals all across the board. It's a it's a tragedy. 390 00:27:29.329 --> 00:27:32.559 Yes, and you know what else? That reminds me of a book called 391 00:27:32.559 --> 00:27:37.119 an incompoopery where he talked about process, process, just keep following that process 392 00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:41.240 and it starts to get better and better. And in the interview with tiffany 393 00:27:41.279 --> 00:27:45.069 she talked about how we're not talking about the top performing salespeople here. We're 394 00:27:45.069 --> 00:27:48.750 not talking about the James Mures of your sales force. Okay, these are 395 00:27:48.750 --> 00:27:52.230 the ones sort of in the middle where, if they just get a little 396 00:27:52.230 --> 00:27:56.670 bit better, dramatic increase exactly, exactly. Well, I mean there's so 397 00:27:56.710 --> 00:28:00.500 much this is a good sized book and there is a lot of excellent insights 398 00:28:00.579 --> 00:28:03.539 in this book. Your favorite parts and take aways from this one? Well, 399 00:28:03.619 --> 00:28:07.380 like I said, the sales optimization, but also the part about the 400 00:28:07.500 --> 00:28:15.369 customer experience and engineering the experience that the customers have and the fact that what 401 00:28:15.490 --> 00:28:19.089 it takes to succeed at customer experience is going to make you successful in the 402 00:28:19.289 --> 00:28:25.049 other nine different routes to growth. Yep, agreed. Well, I got 403 00:28:25.170 --> 00:28:26.880 to say this is a smoking collection of books that we had this time. 404 00:28:26.920 --> 00:28:30.759 So tell us a little bit about what's coming up next on the marketing book 405 00:28:30.799 --> 00:28:36.160 podcast. So next time we are going to talk about the science of customer 406 00:28:36.240 --> 00:28:41.470 connections. Manage your message to Grow Your Business by Jim Carr. The innovation 407 00:28:41.630 --> 00:28:45.589 mandate. The growth secrets of the best organizations in the world by Nicholas Webb. 408 00:28:47.390 --> 00:28:52.190 indistractable, how to control your attention and choose your life by near a, 409 00:28:52.430 --> 00:28:59.619 all marketing to the entitled consumer. How to turn an unreasonable expectations into 410 00:28:59.660 --> 00:29:04.940 lasting relationships by nick worth, Dave Franklin and Josh burnoff. And finally, 411 00:29:06.619 --> 00:29:11.930 the invisible brand. Marketing in the age of automation, big data and machine 412 00:29:11.009 --> 00:29:17.809 learning by William Amerman. And that's it for this month's BB grows show book 413 00:29:17.849 --> 00:29:22.170 talk. To learn more about the marketing book podcast, Visit Marketing Book podcastcom. 414 00:29:22.410 --> 00:29:25.839 And to learn more about James and his excellent book the perfect close, 415 00:29:25.880 --> 00:29:33.039 visit pure mirrorcom. That's spelled pure muirecom. And if either of US can 416 00:29:33.079 --> 00:29:37.750 recommend a specific sales or marketing book or other resource for whatever situation you find 417 00:29:37.789 --> 00:29:41.869 yourself in, connect with us on Linkedin, where we can chat and we 418 00:29:41.029 --> 00:29:45.109 will do our level headed best to get you pointed in the right direction and 419 00:29:45.230 --> 00:29:48.910 maybe save you some time. And remember, keep learning, because these days 420 00:29:49.230 --> 00:29:57.140 the big learners are the big earners. We totally get it. We publish 421 00:29:57.220 --> 00:30:00.700 a ton of content on this podcast and it can be a lot to keep 422 00:30:00.700 --> 00:30:04.579 up with. That's why we've started the B tob growth big three, a 423 00:30:04.740 --> 00:30:10.130 no fluff email that boils down our three biggest takeaways from an entire week of 424 00:30:10.250 --> 00:30:15.009 episodes. Sign up today at Sweet Phish Mediacom Big Three. 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