Transcript
WEBVTT
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Conversations from the front lines of marketing. This is be tob growth. Welcome
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into be to be growth. My
name is Benjie Block. Today I am
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joined by Shani Benzer. She is
the chief growth and marketing officer at Crunch
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Base Chinny. We are so glad
to have you here with us. I'm
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excited to be here. Thanks for
having me. Crunch base is currently strategizing
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and implementing how product blood growth,
selfserve and traditional sales can kind of truly
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play together in this hybrid model that
is hyper effective. I wonder what was
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the origins of this internal conversation in
this drive to want to get the hybrid
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model locked in? It depends on
coming to company. But for crunch based
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specifically the fact that we have this
massive top of funnel. You know,
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were seventy million people are coming to
the website every year. For us,
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it was a very obvious conversation to
have. I would say, you know,
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if you have what almost looks like
a be to be business that has
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consumer ish tendencies, then having product
led growth, thinking about selfserve, is
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a given. I think the challenge
that a lot of be tob companies face
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is that they operate in more of
a like, we'll call it traditional be
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to be method, where the only
way you get prospect is that you're really
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pushing yourself out in front of them. Those prospects have no need of their
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own to kind of be inbound.
For PLG companies, the opposite is true,
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and that's what we have for crunch
base, where tons of people want
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to come to crunch base, they
want to look up their company, they
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want to make sure their company information
is correct. So that lends itself to
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having this this sort of like what
is our self serve strategy? What is
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our product led growth strategy? And
we also had this kind of two pronged
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business. One is we license our
data and the other is we sell software,
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and the data licensing is more of
like a traditional business, but our
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software business is the thing that is
fully fed by our huge top of funnel
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and our product led growth motion.
So that's really where it all started.
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So I imagine there's kind of two
specific groups we need to address that are
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probably listening to this. You have
the first, and those are companies that
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maybe are not pelg right, and
then second there are those that are looking
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in. They they are intrigued by
a true hybrid approach, because they are
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familiar with the things that you're doing. We're going to spend the bulk of
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our time together on that second one, but talk about those in the first
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group, those in that first category
that maybe aren't Pelg, especially because we're
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in a pretty uncertain time right now, and product led growth, I mean
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it's I would say it's of utmost
important. So and I think you would
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probably say that as well. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to
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sound doom and gloom, but it
kind of feels like if you don't have
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a product led growth motion, there
isn't a very certain future for you,
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unless you have like massive investment from
BC, which you know is very possible.
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There's still we're doing a bunch of
research and there's still tons of money
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that's going into early and midstage startups. But the thing about product led growth
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is it's also a commitment to having
like a customer centric model. Product led
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growth forces you to give value to
customers so that customers want to buy your
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product. Traditional like non PLG be
to be enterprise sales. It's really more
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about like the strength of your sales
force. How good is your sales team?
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At convincing somebody that they might need
to buy what you're selling, and
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I think that will there will always
be an element of that that exists,
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but I think we're seeing in almost
every part of the way a person buys
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anything that we're shifting more towards self
serve. I mean you like the quintessential
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direct sales business is like car sales, and even car sales you have these
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new startups that are coming in and
disrupting, like Carvana, like shift,
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who are just saying why bother,
they're going to a physical parking lot and
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entering into the pain that is haggling
when you could just point and click from
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the comfort of your computer. And
I think that desire to point and click
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doesn't end with your consumer buying.
Like I am also a buyer on the
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be to B side. I don't
want to buy differently when I'm at work
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than when I'm not at work,
and now that we work from home,
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I'm always in the same place when
I'm making these purchases. A good point,
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and I definitely think on the be
tob side there's so many advantages to
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allowing self serve as an option and
having all the information ready for people and
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then, like we're about to talk
about in this hybrid motion, having someone
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at the level where you would want
it. Maybe it's a certain dollar amount,
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but for those bigger deals, but
having a person that can come alongside
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and really create forward momentum at a
certain stage. So that's that second group
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that's truly looking for an effective hybrid
approach, and I want to go into
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detail there. You've worked in companies
with self serve options and traditional sales.
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Tell me what some of those tensions
are that you've experienced and kind of had
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to deal with. Yeah, so
my background is I've worked in pretty much
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every selling motion from channel to be
Toc, to be, Toc to be,
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to be to be. Some of
those companies include in Vidia, dropbox.
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I was on agency side helping playstation
and obviously now crunch base and then
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sales force as well. See you
have kind of like this broad perspective about
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how different companies sell. One of
the you know, the hard things about
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this plg motion is you are asking
a lot of people to change the way
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they think about selling and those those
things are ingrained within the company. So
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you know, like a sales team
is built to take leads and turn those
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leads into opportunities and turn those opportunities
into revenue. If you all of a
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sudden come in and say, okay, I want you to sell completely differently,
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there's going to be some tension there
because they're their compensation is built on
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that model as well and an appealog
world. But you're essentially saying is okay,
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sales, not every lead is your
lead. Only the qualified leads are
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your lead, and qualified now has
a much more narrower definition than you're used
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to, and so what they might
feel is, oh my gosh, like
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my compensation is threatened, oh my
gosh, I'm not going to be able
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to hit quota because you're going to
be taking customers that I could convert and
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just converting them through self. Served
that's a very like it's a very real
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fear, but it's also an inside
out fear. It's a fear that we
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created as a result of our incentive
structures. So it will require executives that
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the company reassessing those incentive structures and
helping set targets that are more realistic,
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with this idea of a customer who
has a bigger ticket possibility or a customer
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who has a more sophisticated implementation need. Only those prospects will go to the
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sales team because they need to talk
to a human being. They won't be
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able to do it themselves, or
if they do it themselves, they won't
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be successful after they convert. So
it really it requires change across the entire
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organization. Otherwise what ends up happening
is inevitably there's like this feeling that your
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number one competitor in for your business
is your self serf business versus your direct
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sales business. And if that's what
you're experiencing, that means that there's something
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intrinsically wrong with the way the teams
are set up. You should have it
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be more like the ideal state is
sales loves the SELFSERF BUSINESS BECAUSE A it
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creates more qualified leads for them.
Let's say you have a lower price product.
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People convert into that lower price product. That is a signal that people
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understand the value of our product.
Now sales can just kind of start mining
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within the existing customer base for up
cell opportunities or, like selfserve, could
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do a good job of saying,
Oh, I'm not able to convert this
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person through selfserve. They should talk
to a human being. Let me pass
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it on. So they've done what
maybe a traditional str team can do through
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selfserve. So it's kind of like
the fear is there change management is required
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and it could be like a somewhat
help hefty lift. So you've worked in
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companies with selfserve options and traditional sales. What are some of those tensions that
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you've experienced and had to deal with? Yeah, so I've worked at at
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several companies that have both of those. Just as a little background, I've
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worked for in Vidia, which had
more of like a channel sales. I
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work for sales force, which is
traditional bet to be not much self serve.
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I worked for Dropboxx, which you
know, are arguably is one of
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the pioneers of self serf businesses,
and now crunch base, which is kind
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of like an amalgamation of all of
the above. And I think what I've
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observed is that if a company is
not set up to have a hybrid business,
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meaning they're not set up to have
selfserve and direct cells live in symbiosis,
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like in perfect harmony, they will
inevitablely be an internal competition where you
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know, if you ask the sales
team, they'll say our number one competitor
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is our self serve product. If
you ask the selfserve team, they'll say,
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you know, I don't know why
the direct sales team doesn't like us.
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And you know the reason behind that
is because companies were not set up
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to have hybrid go to market motions. They're traditionally set up to have direct
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sales on the B Tob side and
self serve on the consumer side. But
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the world is changing, right you
know, we just talked about how everybody
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really wants to buy in this more
selfserve way. We're used to working alone
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at our own homes or used to
making purchases from our desk. And in
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order for us to be ready for
the future, we're going to be ready
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to we're going to need to be
ready to have these hybrid businesses, and
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I think it comes down to incentives, right. Like if a salesperson has
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quota, they are going to want
to have all the prospects they can in
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order to hit that quota. If
they're looking at SELFSERV and saying, oh
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my gosh, they're taking all of
my leads and closing my leads at like
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a lower price, they're not going
to feel so good about it, because
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it's almost like taking food out of
their mouths. So I think internally there
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needs to be some serious change management
where we think about what are the right
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incentive structures. So rather than closing
as many deals as you possibly can then
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you hit your quota, it's more
close deals that meet the specific criteria that
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we figure it out. Makes you
more in need of talking to a human
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being versus talking, you know,
through a chat bought in the product or
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just doing everything self serve. So
essentially what that would look like is,
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let's say, if your product has
a version that is under tenzero in a
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version that is over tenzero, maybe
that's not how you divide up self serving
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direct cells. You never know,
some people may have super high credit card
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limits. Why would you block them
from making that purchase? M But if
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your product is really complicated and a
person you know, you find through some
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of your own research and your own
experiments that people who are buying that more
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complicated solution, without the help of
maybe white glove on boarding or what an
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ae or a CSM can provide,
you find that their cancelation rates are really
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high, then that's a signal that
that is something should involve. That should
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involve some human interaction, and that's
how I would want to shift the businesses
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in the future. Don't make the
human or interaction be just about deal size.
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Make the human interaction be about where
can I deliver more value to my
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customer, and that means reassessing the
incentive structure for the human beings who are
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on the team's yeah, I mean
incentive structure is huge. You touched on
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segmentation there. So maybe it's not
dollar amount, maybe it's complication, any
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other ways that you see segmenting out
the audience so you don't end up in
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a situation where, internally there's this
conflict between direct sales and self served.
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It's almost like segmentation without decision is
also going to be important, meaning as
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a user enters into the byflow or
the consideration stage, give them the option
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to choose. You know, do
you want to talk to a human being,
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because we find that there are even
some people on the SELFSERF side,
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you know, who have the smaller
ticket items who just want to ask a
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question, like they don't want to
be sent to help center, they don't
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want to interact with a robot,
they want to talk to a human being.
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So by having the option to talk
to human being when someone wants it
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or having the option to not talk
to a human being when they don't.
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That can really be helpful and the
hybrid motion means that you might have a
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little bit of both existing at the
same time, like so, for crunch
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face and example is we're looking at
ways to strategically insert chat into the free
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user experience where we might see somebody
who looks like they're kind of struggling on
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a page to figure out how to
use the right prospecting tools. You know
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we rolled out a bunch of new
prospecting features. Maybe they don't even know
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they exist. By injecting a human
being into the experience we might be able
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to say, Oh hey, you
may not have noticed, but you can
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do this thing. It looks like
you might be trying to do x action.
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Here's how you can do it within
the product. So it's really about
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thinking more again about what the customers
experiences and then selectively offering both the human
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experience and the SELFSERF experience and letting
the customer choose what is right for them.
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I think that's extremely smart to give
the option of say, Hey,
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would you want to talk to somebody
and it almost creates like warm leads every
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time because you actually know that they
wanted human interaction at that point. In
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this model for crunch based specifically,
is self serve meant to be more of
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a lead feeder to direct sales or
how do you view that? Yeah,
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that I mean, I love what
you said. It's a warm lead.
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What I think about selfserve is it
is the ultimate product qualification for for more
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complex or higher price products, meaning
as customers in crunch based come in and
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they either become, you know,
our selfserve skews are starter or pro.
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When they come in a starter or
pro crunch based customers, that tells us
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that they understand the value of crunch
base and we can start to observe.
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You know, are there many different
people at their company who have also become
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pro customers? That tells us,
okay, there's really an opportunity for this
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company to have more of, you
know, a team's based solution, and
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that is a signal that they are
ready for our enterprise product, which does
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require talking to a sales person because
there's a little bit more complexity in the
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setup, there's a little bit more
complexity in the integrations and there's the things
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that you can't just do all on
your own. So for me it absolutely
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is like there are degrees of qualification
and one of the highest levels of qualification
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you can have is being a healthy, engaged self serve customer. That to
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me tells me, okay, you
get value and you might get even more
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value at our more sophisticated, more
advanced skew level. So if you're leaning
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heavy into the PLG selfserve model,
what do you see as the hiccups being
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as you kind look to introduce a
direct sales motion that that assists? Yeah,
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I mean we're pretty lucky in that
we've been hybrid almost from the beginning.
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Last year we more officially rolled out
the higher level software skew. Previously
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it was only like a licensing that
had direct Celles motion. The last year
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we we shifted from self serve only
on software to selfserve and direct sales on
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software, and what's great is that
I think there has always been an awareness
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for the value of Plog also for
direct sales, meaning the way we look
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at our funnel isn't everybody has to
become self serve first before they ever get
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to talk to a salesperson. It's
more that every single free anonymous visitor to
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crunch bascom IE, these are the
free users of our product, are fremium
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product. Every single one of those
people is a prospect and the question is
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just which solution is right for them. So it's more about that, like
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product qualification out on the free side, and we work really closely with our
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sales team to funnel the right leads
to them and then if they start talking
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to a lead who's not qualified for
enterprise, they funnel those people back into
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selfserve. So we've created this really
virtuous cycle where people who aren't ready for
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enterprise get disqualified and put back into
selfserve. Anonymous visitors who come to the
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website but meet all the criteria for
our enterprise product automatically get funneled over to
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our direct sales team. It's kind
of like we're just creating this really efficient
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what is a good metaphor? It's
like a really fial Librarian's pointing you to
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the rights back at the right time. That's what we want to have happened
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and we want every person to leave
the library happy with the book that they
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wanted, and that's what we're really
trying to do and I think you know,
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I feel very luckily so. I'm
the chief marketing a growth officer.
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I have a really close relationship with
our chief revenue officer. He is a
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believer in the value of pelg as
a lead generation engine for the direct sales
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team and I think that belief and
that partnership is really important because then he
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enables us to kind of test some
of these things which in the short term
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might look like are reducing the lead
volume but in the long term are leading
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to higher ACV deals, faster deal
times, more qualified leads. All of
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it kind of gets better when you
embrace the pelog motion. So you touched
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on and I want to circle back
to this. One of the things you
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got to think through in this model
is who, and I want to break
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down who that person is in your
mind, because there are some specific things
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that would be nice to either hire
four or look for in a in somebody
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that's going to take on a role
like this. But if you're kind of
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dreaming up your ideal candidate for this
assist motion, who are they in your
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mind? Yeah, so you're touching
on this like the gray area that sits
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between pure self serve and pure direct
sales. We've like, you know,
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a dropbox. We called it selfservicest, that crunch base. We're calling it
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self servicest and it really is almost
like a scaled he human frontline worker force
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that is a hybrid of a support
person, a sales person and that sort
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of you know library and traffic cop
as well. It's not a traditional salesperson
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in the sense that they don't only
have one goal. Their goal isn't just
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to create revenue. The purpose of
this human skilled force is to help a
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user find value faster than they might
have otherwise, not as not have done
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on their own. So it's kind
of like really this space in between.
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If you have one island that is
self serving one island that is direct sales,
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it's the ocean in between the two. That's what the Self Service syst
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is. Then the people that I
would look for there, I mean,
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because this is a brand new space
that people are comfortable with. I think
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the first thing is it has to
be somebody who is creative, like they're
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adaptable to an unusual circumstance where their
compensation might be some combination of you know,
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revenue quota, as well as things
like net promoter score or customer or
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sea sat score. So they have
to be comfortable with the sort of like
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new world. They're forging a new
path. They have to be extremely customer
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centric. Right they want to see
a smile on the other person's face.
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I mean they're usually going to be
interacting for something like chat or a quick
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phone call, so they might not
see that face, but they have to
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feel the joy in the other person
and that joy has to be their number
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one motivator. And then they also
have to understand, you know, when
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is the right time to pass this
person off. They might be, you
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know, they're trying to deeply understand
the other person, deeply understand their use
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case and either funnel them back to
self serve or funnel them over to the
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direct sales team. So it's really
about finding like people who have the tenacity
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of sales, who have the empathy
of CX and who have the kind of
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experimentation mindedness of a growth person.
And and that's going to be difficult to
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find. I'm I'm not saying that's
going to be yeah, but if you
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can find those people, this is
like, in my mind, this is
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the future of be to be business. Is being able to create optimal go
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to market motions that have the best
of self, serve the best of direct
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sales and then this assist in middle
ground so that you keep your CAC low.
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Hmm, I love the breakdown of
what this person's kind of personality is.
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In a sense, I wonder,
is this someone you hire from within
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typically, or are you posting and
trying to attract that type of talent?
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Like, what do you imagine their
work background being? I approach everything that
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I do with like an experimentation mindset, where I don't go all in on
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something until I have some pretty strong
signal that it's worth doubling down. I
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think specifically within marketing there's like,
you know, I've been talking a lot
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about traditional drect sales versus this new
sales motion, but within marketing there's like
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traditional marketing where you just you know, you've got the mad men experience where
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they come into a room, they
come up with an idea and then they
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put millions of dollars behind it.
Like those days are over. It's more
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about now I have a hypothesis.
If I do x, then why will
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happen? I have a test in
which I can validate or invalidate that hypothesis
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and then once they prove that a
hypothesis is true or see that a hypothesis
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is true, then I double down. I think the same thing is true
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for this self services motion. It
may not be the right thing for every
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single company. So I think the
way that people should approach it is from
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an experiment standpoint. I definitely would
start with internal people. I would look
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within like the CX team, anybody
who's eager to, you know, move
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up and out of the CX team. Maybe within the sales organization, any
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sales managers who are, you know, seeing what's happening of the selfserfside and
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or kind of interested in the speed. They want to try something new,
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and I would bring those people over
and say hey, we want to have
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almost like a start up within a
startup. Are you interested in building this
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new thing and help have help them
set up these experiments to see does having
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an assisted motion either shorten the time
to close? Does it increase the rate
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of trial starts or the increase the
volume of leads that are generated? Does
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it increase the ACV? Does it
improve the conversion rate? Like like you
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pick a stage and you see if
the assisted motion improves that stage, and
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what's confirm whether it does or doesn't. Then you decide whether you want to
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scale the team. So yes,
I would absolutely start internally if you see
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that it can't help you the scaling
of that team. I think because you
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need so many people, you might
find that having, you know, being
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able to recruit from with in is
a little challenging. I've seen it work
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where you partner with a third party, like outsourced team folks who are comfortable
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dealing with a high volume of chats, let's say, and they can help
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you achieve that more expansive frontline workforce. But again, you probably want to
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have people internally who validate and come
up with best practices that you then train
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the external team zone. Yeah,
you just touch on something I want to
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ask a follow up on, because, let's say you run this test great
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self servicest it works for us,
we want to expand the team. Now
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you have this training and education that's
needed and sort of required. So what
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have you guys implemented to to train
up this team and what do you think
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it's important there? So, at
crunch face, we're in the phase of
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experimenting whether the Self Services Motion can
help to capture revenue from disqualified under put
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prize leads that otherwise might not have
turned into anything. HMM. And we
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validated it right, like we took
what would have been zero dollars and we've
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turned it into tens of thousands of
dollars, and those leads are now also
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pre qualified for future enterprise expansion.
So we validated that part of our funnel.
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The next step is to now validate
the Presale, like the almost more
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traditional self serve part of the funnel, and we're doing that in combination with
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like expanding where we offer chat and
increasing the amount of time that we're sort
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of borrowing time from our Stur team
of an incredible SDR manager who's just so,
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so great to partner with and he's
been really generous and letting US carve
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sometime from the strs to test these
different stages of the funnel. I think
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we are seeing, though, that, like, the needs of experimentation are
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so great, while the SDR teams
quotas for their traditional selling are also high.
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So I think we're butting up against
the limit of how much the internal
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team can handle as so we're beginning
to think about where we might scale from
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there. At drop box, you
know, there's a more sophisticated program at
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dropbox we had a very large external
scaled sales force. Internal teams acted as
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kind of like the sales managers to
those teams. I on the marketing side
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acted as the lead generation engine for
those SSA teams of self services teams.
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They acted as the the kind of
quick turnaround and or lead qualification for higher
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order skews. It was a super
successful model and I think the challenge that
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dropbox had was it was such a
successful model that they had not even anticipated
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how much they would get from it
and I think that kind of set off
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some of those red flags we talked
about earlier for the direct sales teams who
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handled more of the large named account
sizes, and so you know, we
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had to work through some of those
tensions to identify what are the mutual exclusive
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swim lanes so that we're not fighting
each other. HMM. Okay, so
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last follow up question on this and
getting a little bit more specific on compensation,
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because I think of the WHO here
and depending on what their background is,
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if they come from traditional sales,
you're going to have a different conversation
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than maybe someone that comes from customer
experience or customer service. So how do
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you compensate for a role like this? The self surfacest roll, anything that
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we should watch out for when we
when we think about that, I think
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it depends on where you are in
the like level of sophistication of your self
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services program. So while you're in
the experiment phase, I would not use
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a quota based compensation because the quota
like people will always optimize their behavior for
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the quota because they're trying to get
paid, whereas in experiment the optimization should
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be do I trust the outcome of
the experiment that I just ran? Like,
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do I believe the outcome, because
that outcome is going to inform what
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my next steps are, and so
I don't want to gain the system,
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as it were, with something like
quota. So I think to start you
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probably want more of like a non
quota based compensation, but you know,
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like in our case, if we're
borrowing time from SDRs, that that might
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not be possible. So it just
depends on where you're pulling. If you're
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pulling from CX, it's a little
bit easier. When you get more sophisticated.
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At that point my assumption is you
kind of know what self servicest is
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good at, so you can start
to put some quotas in place. But
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your quote is may not be all
revenue related. So, for example,
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if you're putting self servicest early on
in the life cycle, so let's say
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people who are just landing on your
website for the first time and they're giving
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something a try, your quotea there
might be successful completions of specific high value
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actions in the product. Like have
you helped more people tried that one feature
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that you know is highly correlated with
customer satisfaction? And then middle life cycle
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it might be more correlated. Are
you getting more people to start a trial
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or after that, are you getting
more people to convert their trial? Convert
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the trial with more seats in their
checkout, convert with more add ons?
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Are you getting more of the new
customers to activate on the high value actions?
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You see what I'm saying? So
like it really the the incentive depends
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on where you're putting the SSA motion
and I think that incentive also depends on
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what your experiments have told you are
like the ideal outcomes. I love the
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explanation. I think there's so many
potential ways you could utilize a self servicest
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motion. I wonder for you,
now that you've run these experiments, you've
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seen it in a couple different contexts, if we were to drop you in
385
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a new company somewhere else and they
have a plg motion but they haven't built
386
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this out yet, where do you
start? What are those first conversations you're
387
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having and maybe where are you?
What are you looking for? You know,
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I think I approach my internal change
management the same way I approach go
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to market, which is I would
do a top down and a bottoms up
390
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the campaign. The top down is
I would need the CEO and the crow
391
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and the C foe to all understand
the opportunity and also the missed opportunity if
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you don't try this. So you
know, this would be about showing the
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impact on LTV TO CAC. It
would show the impact on the a TV,
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the also again, the LTV of
the customer. So this would be
395
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more about showing them, Hey,
if we were to do this and it
396
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would be successful, here's what we
could gain if we don't do this.
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As we continue scaling and you have
to, you know, keep adding more
398
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and more sales people in order to
grow. This is what you're missing,
399
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these are the efficiency losses that you're
going to have. So I'd be the
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first thing, like you, get
the executives to understand the business impact,
401
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the value of it to the business, because once they see that there and
402
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again, it's all typed incentives,
they're incentivized to say, okay, I
403
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:22.200
want to help see this happen,
because if we improve the overall uneconomics of
404
00:29:22.200 --> 00:29:25.799
our company a it might make us
look more attractive to investors, be and
405
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might get us to profitability faster.
You know, all the things that executives
406
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care about. Bottoms up, it
would be more about, you know,
407
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understanding how are the reps being compensated
today, understanding what the growth team looks
408
00:29:41.359 --> 00:29:45.680
like today, seeing if any of
those tensions exist already or if they like
409
00:29:45.839 --> 00:29:51.400
completely operate in Stilo. So we're
really duplicating efforts for them. It would
410
00:29:51.440 --> 00:29:55.839
be more about like how can I
get you to your target outcome faster?
411
00:29:55.880 --> 00:29:57.440
Like you know, you kind of
see the theme here, and everything I'm
412
00:29:57.480 --> 00:30:00.720
doing is understand what value is to
the person I'm speaking to, Yep,
413
00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:04.599
and then help them see how what
what we want to try is valuable to
414
00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:11.880
them. Spoken like a true marketer, you know, like in my mind
415
00:30:11.000 --> 00:30:15.160
I am about a vessel right,
like it's no skin off my back if
416
00:30:15.160 --> 00:30:18.599
you choose one way or the other. But for you, you the executive,
417
00:30:18.720 --> 00:30:23.319
or you the individual rep you could
be making more money. It just
418
00:30:23.440 --> 00:30:27.440
means that you have to be comfortable
changing from the old way of doing things
419
00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:32.400
and embracing a potentially new way of
doing things. HMM. Yeah, think
420
00:30:32.440 --> 00:30:33.880
about it, like how much money
are you leaving on the table between where
421
00:30:33.960 --> 00:30:37.799
self serve drops off and sales picks
up? Like that's a big question.
422
00:30:38.319 --> 00:30:44.480
It's valuable to those that are in
the sea suite and having these conversations about
423
00:30:44.519 --> 00:30:48.480
lifetime value and the gain that's there. What are we missing? I mean
424
00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:51.559
those are the the crucial conversations that, I think lead you to a place
425
00:30:51.599 --> 00:30:56.200
where man self services could really be
a game changer for your business. Anything
426
00:30:56.240 --> 00:31:00.319
you want to add here as we
start to wrap up? Love this conversation.
427
00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:03.079
Yeah, I mean I think you
kind of touched on the the metrics
428
00:31:03.079 --> 00:31:06.440
that are valuable to a business.
I think if you talk to any investor,
429
00:31:06.480 --> 00:31:10.559
so let's say like your target audiences
is startups, they care about what
430
00:31:10.599 --> 00:31:15.640
investors care about one of the number
one key performance indicators that investors care about
431
00:31:15.799 --> 00:31:19.839
is net dollar attention. The kind
of like ingredients of net dollar attention are
432
00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:23.720
one. What is your rate of
upsell of existing customers to? What is
433
00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:29.559
your rate of revenue retention of existing
customers, like how many people are turning
434
00:31:29.640 --> 00:31:33.480
versus not? When you think about
what self services can do, let's say
435
00:31:33.519 --> 00:31:37.799
you have a super high dollar product
and people are ready to turn. Well,
436
00:31:37.920 --> 00:31:41.880
rather than the logo leaving completely,
what if you just downgrade at them
437
00:31:41.880 --> 00:31:45.400
to a lower a lower cost product? This is what self services can do.
438
00:31:45.440 --> 00:31:48.759
It can be part of your off
boarding process. So, rather than
439
00:31:48.799 --> 00:31:52.279
a full on see you later,
we'll never work together again, I'll say,
440
00:31:52.279 --> 00:31:55.119
okay, I understand you're not getting
as much value as you would see
441
00:31:55.119 --> 00:31:57.319
for this price on the high value
product. Let me introduce you to this
442
00:31:57.319 --> 00:32:00.759
lower value product that you can actually
check out with your credit card. That
443
00:32:00.839 --> 00:32:06.039
logo stays a part of your portfolio, so you have no logo laws.
444
00:32:06.079 --> 00:32:09.319
That helps with the net dollar attention. Going the more optimistic route, let's
445
00:32:09.319 --> 00:32:14.279
say you have a bunch of self
serve customers. If you could get even
446
00:32:14.319 --> 00:32:19.880
one ten of those selfserf customers to
upgrade into your enterprise product with the help
447
00:32:20.039 --> 00:32:23.440
of, you know, these self
services, people almost being like temperature checks
448
00:32:23.480 --> 00:32:28.759
or thermometers to see where there's hot
spots. You could, you know,
449
00:32:28.960 --> 00:32:31.880
double your net dollar attention, because
you're seeing these customers go from a hundred
450
00:32:31.880 --> 00:32:37.680
dollar product to a thousand to Tenzero
to twentyzero product. There's a ton of
451
00:32:37.799 --> 00:32:40.359
value. And then, I think, to your point, there's the well,
452
00:32:40.359 --> 00:32:44.119
what about the people who were never
going to be any money and we
453
00:32:44.119 --> 00:32:46.200
turn them into some money. So
it's either like don't leave money on the
454
00:32:46.200 --> 00:32:50.640
table that could be more and don't
leave money on the table that could have
455
00:32:50.680 --> 00:32:53.440
been zero, but you turn it
into at least one. So it's really
456
00:32:53.559 --> 00:32:59.480
like just think about where people are
falling out of your funnel and how a
457
00:32:59.559 --> 00:33:04.160
person who has the profile of this
hybrid cx and sales could help you not
458
00:33:04.279 --> 00:33:07.559
lose those people in your funnel.
I love how we've described this role in
459
00:33:07.599 --> 00:33:13.759
this episode. Well, you've described
support, sales, traffic cop thermometer and
460
00:33:13.799 --> 00:33:16.599
now I love I love all of
those descriptions. I think it fits it
461
00:33:16.720 --> 00:33:21.680
so well. In Library and library, a library and of the list.
462
00:33:21.960 --> 00:33:24.680
Fantastic. Thank you for breaking this
down for us. Tell us a little
463
00:33:24.680 --> 00:33:28.440
bit about crunch based here as we
closed. And then also, where can
464
00:33:28.440 --> 00:33:32.680
people stay connected with you? Yeah, so crunchbace is really a prospecting solution.
465
00:33:32.720 --> 00:33:37.000
If you're a deal maker, whether
that's a salesperson, a recruiter and
466
00:33:37.079 --> 00:33:40.759
investor, a startup founder, if
you're looking to connect with other companies that
467
00:33:40.880 --> 00:33:45.440
have, you know, buying power
and are growing, you really want to
468
00:33:45.440 --> 00:33:49.279
start with crunch based. It's an
account based prospecting tool. We've got all
469
00:33:49.279 --> 00:33:53.160
the best data about high growth SMB's, tons of signals like traffic growth,
470
00:33:53.160 --> 00:33:58.240
employee growth, by our readiness.
It's a great place to start. We've
471
00:33:58.240 --> 00:34:00.559
got an incredible free product at crunch
bascom. And then, like we've talked
472
00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:04.200
about, we've got solutions all the
way from the low end up to the
473
00:34:04.200 --> 00:34:07.039
super high end. So you can
find what you're looking for there. In
474
00:34:07.159 --> 00:34:12.079
terms of staying in touch with me, I'm on Linkedin Shinny Benzer, I
475
00:34:12.079 --> 00:34:15.320
believe it's in spenser. I'm also
on twitter, though I mainly talk about
476
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:21.599
TV on twitter and I'm happy to
stay connected with whoever's interested. Well,
477
00:34:21.639 --> 00:34:24.800
Shenny, we're so glad to have
you on this episode. And there's some
478
00:34:25.000 --> 00:34:30.559
really practical things coming out of this
one that I think people can walk away
479
00:34:30.559 --> 00:34:34.360
with, and I love the breakdown
of this self servicest. Thank you for
480
00:34:34.519 --> 00:34:37.079
spending time with us here on B
tob growth today. Thanks for having me,
481
00:34:37.559 --> 00:34:42.480
thanks for checking out another episode of
B Tob Growth, and I want
482
00:34:42.480 --> 00:34:45.559
to just say if you haven't subscribed
to the show yet, be sure to
483
00:34:45.639 --> 00:34:50.719
do that on your favorite podcast player. We're always grateful for a rating review
484
00:34:50.760 --> 00:34:54.079
over there as well, and I
will be back real soon with another episode.
485
00:34:54.199 --> 00:35:09.280
Keep doing work that matters. If
you enjoyed a day show, hit
486
00:35:09.360 --> 00:35:14.360
subscribe for more marketing goodness, and
if you really enjoyed today show, take
487
00:35:14.400 --> 00:35:17.280
a second to rate and review the
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488
00:35:17.360 --> 00:35:22.480
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489
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by texting it to a friend who
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490
00:35:25.119 --> 00:35:29.679
and thanks for sharing.