The Questions We All Want Answered | Original Research

WEBVTT 1 00:00:08.199 --> 00:00:12.880 Conversations from the front lines of marketing. This is B two B growth. 2 00:00:16.199 --> 00:00:19.679 Hey, friends, Benji here, and James and Dan are joining me for 3 00:00:19.920 --> 00:00:25.320 today's original research episode. And guys, I wanna you to just kind of 4 00:00:25.320 --> 00:00:30.039 maybe close your eyes and imagine something as we start this episode. Imagine you 5 00:00:30.079 --> 00:00:35.520 are with in in a room with a hundred marketing leaders that you admire. 6 00:00:35.920 --> 00:00:39.200 There are all these great individuals we've had the privilege maybe of getting to chat 7 00:00:39.280 --> 00:00:42.759 with even here on B two B growth, and we gather them all in 8 00:00:42.759 --> 00:00:45.960 a room. You're invited, you get to walk up to a mix that's 9 00:00:45.960 --> 00:00:50.719 in the center of the room and you get to pose one question at the 10 00:00:50.840 --> 00:00:54.320 room and they're all gonna give you their advice, they're all going to get 11 00:00:54.359 --> 00:00:59.240 to chime in and help you, but you have one question. What would 12 00:00:59.280 --> 00:01:03.079 the question be? Dan, I'm throwing this to you first. What do 13 00:01:03.079 --> 00:01:07.840 you got? We've done so much original research that I actually have a lot 14 00:01:07.840 --> 00:01:11.319 of great answers to the most important questions. But honestly, there's one question 15 00:01:11.359 --> 00:01:14.840 that I don't think we've asked well enough, and that this would be the 16 00:01:14.840 --> 00:01:18.640 one question I would ask the crowd. Is, what are you the most 17 00:01:18.680 --> 00:01:23.519 excited about when it comes to marketing right now, just to get a sense 18 00:01:23.560 --> 00:01:29.760 of what's captured my peers imaginations, what's giving them hope right now, because 19 00:01:29.760 --> 00:01:33.560 we know their struggles, but what's keeping them in the game, that's got 20 00:01:33.560 --> 00:01:36.359 them the most excited about right now? It would be interesting to hear their 21 00:01:36.400 --> 00:01:40.519 collective responses and group them into a few categories as far as like, what 22 00:01:40.719 --> 00:01:45.560 are they hoping to achieve over the next like year or two at least? 23 00:01:45.599 --> 00:01:48.640 What they'd like to even if they can't do it because their boss thinks it's 24 00:01:48.680 --> 00:01:51.640 done. Like what do they want to do? I like that too, 25 00:01:51.640 --> 00:01:56.640 because excitement gives you fuel. So then you like you get that hope in 26 00:01:56.719 --> 00:01:57.840 you and you're like, Oh yeah, that could be cool, or I 27 00:01:57.840 --> 00:02:02.040 imagine this future now because they said this like that would just be a great 28 00:02:04.079 --> 00:02:07.039 momentum exercise. If you want to leave like ready to run through a wall, 29 00:02:07.360 --> 00:02:09.560 James, what about you? What would be the question you'd ask? 30 00:02:09.840 --> 00:02:14.439 I think it would be a question that we've asked in our original research, 31 00:02:14.759 --> 00:02:17.680 but because the timing for when we did this was was, you know, 32 00:02:17.759 --> 00:02:23.319 back in one and this stuff is always evolving, I just think knowing who 33 00:02:23.439 --> 00:02:30.199 is influencing their work the most. I think that's something that I probably would 34 00:02:30.199 --> 00:02:32.080 want to have a finger on the pulse of. Every six months or so, 35 00:02:32.400 --> 00:02:36.319 we know we're going to hear the Dave gearharts, the Chris Walkers of 36 00:02:36.360 --> 00:02:40.439 the world, you're gonna hear Seth Godin, but figuring out who is actually 37 00:02:40.479 --> 00:02:45.639 influencing our buyer a room full of B two B marketers as we start to 38 00:02:45.639 --> 00:02:50.000 develop, like how can we do? How can we do creative collaborations through 39 00:02:50.039 --> 00:02:53.319 B two B growth with those creators? What can we learn from how they're 40 00:02:53.360 --> 00:02:57.960 creating content? Are there ways for us to to pay them for their time 41 00:02:58.000 --> 00:03:02.479 to create content for how can we partner and collaborate with those folks that who 42 00:03:02.599 --> 00:03:07.879 already have the attention of the folks that we're trying to reach? I think 43 00:03:07.919 --> 00:03:10.759 that's always going to be a really highly leveraged question when we get in scenarios 44 00:03:10.800 --> 00:03:14.800 like that. That's a fun question to ask, as I've been doing original 45 00:03:14.840 --> 00:03:17.159 research even for this next round, and you hear a lot of also like 46 00:03:17.919 --> 00:03:22.400 peer you know, I bounced this off of this person that I met at 47 00:03:22.400 --> 00:03:24.800 this networking event that's become a good friend of mine it's like there's some interesting 48 00:03:24.879 --> 00:03:29.680 angles there and then there's obviously those individuals that are just like incredible thought leaders 49 00:03:29.680 --> 00:03:34.599 and they're doing an amazing creative work. So the question I would ask is 50 00:03:35.479 --> 00:03:38.680 very it's it's just timely to things I've been thinking about lately and it also 51 00:03:38.759 --> 00:03:43.280 springs off of a couple of B two B growth episode interviews I've had done 52 00:03:43.280 --> 00:03:49.479 recently. I'm very interested in how product and marketing work together. So the 53 00:03:49.560 --> 00:03:53.840 question that I wrote it down as how have you created alignment and momentum between 54 00:03:53.919 --> 00:04:00.280 product and marketing, because, especially as you scale the mess, do you 55 00:04:00.280 --> 00:04:03.240 want to tell people versus what you're actually offering? All these things like it's 56 00:04:03.360 --> 00:04:10.120 in very interesting relationship and it could be, I think, a massive catalyst 57 00:04:10.120 --> 00:04:13.479 for organizational growth, but it's also one of those things you's just like constantly 58 00:04:13.520 --> 00:04:16.240 managing. What does it look like to have that relationship really survive? And 59 00:04:16.560 --> 00:04:21.560 so that's that's where I I go with it to give quick context to all 60 00:04:21.600 --> 00:04:27.759 of our listeners. In real life we did ask a hundred marketing leaders fifteen 61 00:04:27.879 --> 00:04:30.920 questions and one of them was this exact question. So we're like hey, 62 00:04:30.959 --> 00:04:36.079 what would you want to ask a hundred of your your peers and uh, 63 00:04:36.279 --> 00:04:42.160 we've also asked several other questions and we've done episodes just like this that you 64 00:04:42.160 --> 00:04:45.959 can go back in the feed and find. We asked questions like the marketing 65 00:04:46.040 --> 00:04:49.079 channel. You can't overlook who's the marketing influencer. You're most influenced by. 66 00:04:49.120 --> 00:04:54.879 What's the most overrated trend in B two B marketing? So you can go 67 00:04:54.959 --> 00:04:58.319 back in in the feed and you can find all those episodes and take a 68 00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:00.959 listen. But when we asked question, if you could ask one question to 69 00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:05.040 a hundred of your peers in B Two b marketing leadership, what question would 70 00:05:05.079 --> 00:05:10.720 you ask? Here's what our survey results found. Before I give you the 71 00:05:10.759 --> 00:05:14.360 three most common let me give you just the one off questions that were posed 72 00:05:14.360 --> 00:05:17.720 that I think are excellent and I'd love to hear them discussed more by marketing 73 00:05:17.800 --> 00:05:23.240 leadership. But these are I would say there's some success questions and some internal 74 00:05:23.279 --> 00:05:26.639 marketing and evolution questions. So how do you spend your day? People just 75 00:05:26.680 --> 00:05:30.120 want to know straight up, like how do you spend your time and how 76 00:05:30.160 --> 00:05:32.879 do you define success? Like paint the picture of the wind for me. 77 00:05:33.319 --> 00:05:38.279 How does your CEO define success? In fact, James, we included this 78 00:05:38.319 --> 00:05:41.920 one when we started original research for the second round. You wanted that question 79 00:05:42.240 --> 00:05:47.199 included because knowing what they measure, what the CEO measures, is super important. 80 00:05:47.199 --> 00:05:50.160 How would you how would you answer that, James, like how do 81 00:05:50.279 --> 00:05:57.639 you define marketing success right now? I think I define marketing success by like, 82 00:05:57.680 --> 00:06:01.120 are we building affinity, and so are we seeing things like people post 83 00:06:01.160 --> 00:06:06.040 about the content we're creating on Linkedin? Are there sharing this stuff we're doing 84 00:06:06.519 --> 00:06:11.079 on our self reported attribution? When they come inbound, are they talking about 85 00:06:11.079 --> 00:06:14.680 how much they love are our paid ads or our brand or whatever it is 86 00:06:14.720 --> 00:06:18.199 that brought them in? Those affinity keywords for me. So that's that's a 87 00:06:18.240 --> 00:06:21.480 softer way of looking at it. Ultimately, you know, it's are we 88 00:06:21.560 --> 00:06:25.519 driving pipeline? I mean, we don't have an outbound shop here, we 89 00:06:25.560 --> 00:06:29.680 don't have an outbound motion, so everything that we get is coming to US 90 00:06:29.720 --> 00:06:34.920 inbound, and so is that inbound deal flow accelerating and are those deals moving 91 00:06:34.920 --> 00:06:40.000 through our pipeline in a timely manner that we need them to? So those 92 00:06:40.040 --> 00:06:45.079 are some of the more quantitative things, but qualitatively I'm really looking at signs 93 00:06:45.120 --> 00:06:48.639 from the market that we're building affinity. Yeah, it's interesting because we asked 94 00:06:49.199 --> 00:06:54.439 and the answer to that question was pipeline. So then we had to go 95 00:06:54.519 --> 00:06:57.040 back in the next round of original research and go like, okay, but 96 00:06:57.160 --> 00:07:05.560 how does your organization define qualified pipeline like that conversation has been really interesting and 97 00:07:05.839 --> 00:07:10.680 well I'm sure we'll talk about that in the future original research episode. We 98 00:07:10.720 --> 00:07:14.720 also had a lot of questions come in. Marketers want to know like essentially 99 00:07:14.759 --> 00:07:18.319 internal marketing questions. How do you execute internal marketing? How would you align 100 00:07:18.360 --> 00:07:23.920 the entire organizations to your message? How do you get feedback from customers? 101 00:07:24.040 --> 00:07:27.519 Where are you spending your money most effectively? That would be a great one. 102 00:07:27.560 --> 00:07:30.959 I love just breakdowns of campaigns that are really working, the the R 103 00:07:30.000 --> 00:07:33.199 O I people are getting from those things. How do you best support your 104 00:07:33.240 --> 00:07:38.639 sales team? So again, there's just like so many questions here that people 105 00:07:38.680 --> 00:07:42.759 have, and then the three most common. This is what I wanted to 106 00:07:42.879 --> 00:07:46.319 ultimately drive us to. I would say, if you're bucketing this, it's 107 00:07:46.399 --> 00:07:50.600 priorities, it's attribution and it's content. That's what people have questions about. 108 00:07:50.759 --> 00:07:57.240 So the most common question was what do you prioritize what's working with regards to 109 00:07:57.319 --> 00:08:01.360 channel strategies and tools, and then we heard a lot of questions around attribution. 110 00:08:01.439 --> 00:08:05.480 What do you actually measure and how do you think about what? You 111 00:08:05.519 --> 00:08:09.800 attribute it to? M Q LS, SQL type stuff, and then several 112 00:08:09.839 --> 00:08:13.839 answers around content. Well, it's funny because they're not answers their questions. 113 00:08:13.839 --> 00:08:20.360 Several questions around content. So when you hear that James Bucketing it into priorities, 114 00:08:20.439 --> 00:08:24.560 attribution, content, anything that really sticks out at you right away. 115 00:08:26.399 --> 00:08:31.680 So I think as I look through these, people love to know what's working. 116 00:08:31.279 --> 00:08:35.639 And so when we've talked before about like what's what's working for us on 117 00:08:35.679 --> 00:08:41.159 Linkedin, Nick Biddett, we just did an episode with him or about him. 118 00:08:41.240 --> 00:08:45.000 We've done one with him recently and then we did one about him a 119 00:08:45.000 --> 00:08:48.200 few days ago that just dropped in our Echo Chamber series where we talked about 120 00:08:48.200 --> 00:08:52.360 how he got roasted on Linkedin for talking about this tactic that he deployed. 121 00:08:52.399 --> 00:08:58.600 But I think people people loved it because he shared something very, very tactical. 122 00:08:58.720 --> 00:09:01.200 He was sharing something that he did to drive a lot of g two 123 00:09:01.279 --> 00:09:07.000 reviews for for their product and some people would say, you know, got 124 00:09:07.000 --> 00:09:09.840 loud and said that it wasn't ethical what he did. We did an episode 125 00:09:09.840 --> 00:09:11.960 about it. I don't think that what he did was unethical at all, 126 00:09:13.360 --> 00:09:18.039 but because he actually shared what he was doing, the post blew up and 127 00:09:18.120 --> 00:09:22.279 people love that kind of tactical what is actually working, and that's supported here 128 00:09:22.759 --> 00:09:24.799 in the research that we did. People want to know what their peers are 129 00:09:24.840 --> 00:09:30.279 doing, what is specifically working and not working, so that they can learn 130 00:09:30.360 --> 00:09:33.240 from those mistakes, because we're all just out here, seemingly on an island, 131 00:09:33.279 --> 00:09:35.559 trying to figure it out for ourselves, and we don't have to be 132 00:09:37.039 --> 00:09:41.279 Yep, even when you take get outside of B two B for a second, 133 00:09:41.320 --> 00:09:46.519 think of like artists that you like, music that you enjoy, someone 134 00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:50.559 like a Charlie Peuth or Seawan Mendez, like they show like behind the scenes 135 00:09:50.559 --> 00:09:54.519 stuff on Tiktok, specifically Charlie puth. He does videos where he's literally like, 136 00:09:54.559 --> 00:09:58.600 Oh, I turned on a light switch and now I'm making a whole 137 00:09:58.639 --> 00:10:01.159 song using the sound from the switch, and people eat up the tiktok video 138 00:10:01.240 --> 00:10:07.080 because it's the behind the scenes content that people really love. So you can 139 00:10:07.200 --> 00:10:13.120 build entire like linked in videos and posts and all these like organic posts that 140 00:10:13.159 --> 00:10:16.679 you want to create around what's working for you right now? What's the problem 141 00:10:16.720 --> 00:10:20.720 you had before that this helped solve? Like bringing that all to the table 142 00:10:20.759 --> 00:10:26.960 and allowing some vulnerability is a really important thing. And I don't even say 143 00:10:26.080 --> 00:10:31.320 as we've done interviews, I often ask like if you were going to start 144 00:10:31.320 --> 00:10:35.200 a show, what would it be about? People want to know what failures 145 00:10:35.600 --> 00:10:43.720 other marketers have experienced, what campaigns totally flopped. Those are the recurring conversations 146 00:10:43.759 --> 00:10:48.399 people want, because marketing can be so shiny that if we never do behind 147 00:10:48.440 --> 00:10:50.600 the scenes type content, we people are like, Oh, all right, 148 00:10:50.639 --> 00:10:52.879 well, it looks like they're doing, you know, great stuff over there 149 00:10:52.879 --> 00:10:56.679 and really working on it. It's just like it's this okay, cool, 150 00:10:56.759 --> 00:11:01.200 you're you're so shiny that I can't relate and I love that. It's like, 151 00:11:01.200 --> 00:11:03.600 Oh yeah, we're gonna share what's working. We're also gonna just share 152 00:11:03.960 --> 00:11:07.480 real life, like behind the scenes content. People will will eat that up. 153 00:11:07.519 --> 00:11:09.799 I think I love going back and looking. I did this exercise a 154 00:11:09.840 --> 00:11:13.679 few weeks ago. I went I went back and I just started looking at 155 00:11:13.679 --> 00:11:16.720 all of Dave Gerhart's linkedin posts because it seemed like everything I saw in my 156 00:11:16.799 --> 00:11:20.879 feed from him had like thousands of engagements and I was like, what the 157 00:11:20.480 --> 00:11:24.519 what is in this guy's water that everything he posts is just going viral? 158 00:11:26.240 --> 00:11:28.919 And I looked back and that was not the story at all. Like when 159 00:11:28.960 --> 00:11:33.000 you actually go back into as activity and he's just posting a lot. He's 160 00:11:33.000 --> 00:11:37.120 put I think at the time that I looked he was posting like two or 161 00:11:37.159 --> 00:11:41.480 three, sometimes four times a day and a lot of his content had little 162 00:11:41.519 --> 00:11:45.919 to no engagement. But the stuff that I obviously saw my feed had a 163 00:11:45.919 --> 00:11:48.080 ton of it. And so he's just throwing a lot of bait into the 164 00:11:48.120 --> 00:11:52.360 water consistently, and when you're putting more bait into the water, you're gonna 165 00:11:52.399 --> 00:11:56.720 catch more fish. And so it's no wonder that he is now a masked 166 00:11:56.759 --> 00:11:58.399 I think I think he's over a hundred and fifty thousand followers on Linkedin. 167 00:11:58.480 --> 00:12:03.240 Now you're just putting a whole lot of bait in the water and some stuff 168 00:12:03.279 --> 00:12:05.159 sticks, some stuff doesn't. But it was actually really encouraging to me to 169 00:12:05.200 --> 00:12:09.240 go and look at that, to go not every single thing that I post 170 00:12:09.840 --> 00:12:11.840 needs to pop off. I just gotta put more out there. Yep, 171 00:12:13.600 --> 00:12:16.000 yeah, and it's it's that being curious and like what you were. You 172 00:12:16.039 --> 00:12:20.519 weren't even doing that, James, by going and researching what worked for him. 173 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:24.879 You know that curiosity. Having a list of questions you're currently asking to 174 00:12:24.919 --> 00:12:28.519 become a better marketer, to be better at your job. That's such a 175 00:12:30.000 --> 00:12:33.559 soft skill of curiosity is vital. That's why I love asking marketers. What 176 00:12:33.759 --> 00:12:39.159 questions are you asking right now? B Two, B growth will be right 177 00:12:39.200 --> 00:12:43.879 back. There are a lot of questions on marketers minds right now, and 178 00:12:43.960 --> 00:12:48.360 analyzing the latest trends can be a full time job in itself. Can an 179 00:12:48.320 --> 00:12:52.399 a R filter really improved brand awareness? Why are streaming ads so allowed? 180 00:12:52.440 --> 00:12:58.200 What do viewers really think about shoppable ads? Marketing Brew Does the hard work 181 00:12:58.279 --> 00:13:01.720 for you, dropping a quick to read need free newsletter in your inbox every 182 00:13:01.879 --> 00:13:07.480 weekday, covering essential topics, from influencers and advertising to social media and more. 183 00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:11.759 Marketing Group never misses a beat. Get The answers you've been looking for, 184 00:13:13.000 --> 00:13:16.320 along with the ones you haven't even thought of yet. Upgrade your game 185 00:13:16.399 --> 00:13:22.360 alongside a growing community of over two hundred and sixty five thousand marketing professionals. 186 00:13:22.559 --> 00:13:24.639 Check it out by clicking the link in our show notes. Right now, 187 00:13:28.480 --> 00:13:33.279 the soft skill of curiosity is vital. That's why I love asking marketers what 188 00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:37.720 questions are you asking right now? Another thing that came up quite a bit 189 00:13:37.200 --> 00:13:41.519 that I thought was interesting is just people want to know about internal dynamics. 190 00:13:41.879 --> 00:13:46.000 There's just like okay, so how do you relate as a marketing leader to 191 00:13:46.039 --> 00:13:50.000 the C suite? What are those conversations like? How do you prove your 192 00:13:50.080 --> 00:13:52.039 value? How do you prove your words like? That's why attribution comes up 193 00:13:52.120 --> 00:13:56.399 quite a bit too, is because it's one of the things that you report 194 00:13:56.480 --> 00:13:58.480 up to the C suite and they want to know what channels are working, 195 00:13:58.480 --> 00:14:03.200 what strateg gs are working with campaigns, how that's being driven by the marketing 196 00:14:03.200 --> 00:14:07.799 department, and so if you can share, whether it's in personal just conversation, 197 00:14:07.399 --> 00:14:09.480 you can do so. I'm just like, Hey, this is some 198 00:14:09.559 --> 00:14:15.000 of the meetings that work best for us, but knowing what other organizations are 199 00:14:15.000 --> 00:14:20.200 doing between marketing in the C suite. People love want to know market other 200 00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:24.879 marketing. UH companies want to want to know. So that was that was 201 00:14:24.919 --> 00:14:26.159 a big, big one that that stood out to me. Dan, how 202 00:14:26.200 --> 00:14:30.440 about you? Another thing people are asking a lot about is what other marketers 203 00:14:30.480 --> 00:14:35.240 doing around attribution, because again it comes back to that theme of what works. 204 00:14:35.519 --> 00:14:37.799 Marketers want to know what's works. So they want to know what other 205 00:14:37.799 --> 00:14:41.720 marketers are doing for marketing attribution. And it's sad, and we cover this 206 00:14:41.759 --> 00:14:43.639 a lot in the last episode, like how I view attribution, because to 207 00:14:43.720 --> 00:14:46.639 me it's kind of like, Oh, yeah, you talk to customers, 208 00:14:46.639 --> 00:14:50.559 you survey customers and you use marketing attribution to tell you kind of all the 209 00:14:50.600 --> 00:14:54.399 pieces of the story for you to inform your your choices. But I think 210 00:14:54.399 --> 00:14:58.799 a lot of people are looking for like how do you craft something to kind 211 00:14:58.799 --> 00:15:03.240 of give you this silver bullet, like how do you know empirically that it's 212 00:15:03.279 --> 00:15:05.679 going to work? I think people are looking for and it's probably because marketers 213 00:15:05.679 --> 00:15:09.679 are being asked that I've known. I've had a CFO stare me in the 214 00:15:09.679 --> 00:15:13.080 face and be like show me with empirical evidence. It's very CFO word right. 215 00:15:13.080 --> 00:15:16.960 It's where I got it from, that this is the thing that's going 216 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:22.879 to work. Marketers are being asked tough questions from C suite officers in order 217 00:15:22.919 --> 00:15:26.480 to know that it's going to drive the results they want. The problem is 218 00:15:26.519 --> 00:15:31.600 it's never a perfect game. To me, a much more interesting question is 219 00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:35.519 what's could be working that we're not even doing. That's much harder to figure 220 00:15:35.559 --> 00:15:41.000 out. Like what's the process other marketers are using in order to test new 221 00:15:41.080 --> 00:15:43.600 things, in order to find where you haven't even dug for oil yet, 222 00:15:43.679 --> 00:15:48.159 you know because what's working? It's it's as simple. That's just going to 223 00:15:48.240 --> 00:15:52.279 talking new customers that sign up and putting out some like where'd you hear about 224 00:15:52.279 --> 00:15:54.559 as fields on your forms? Like that's that's much easier to set up some 225 00:15:54.600 --> 00:15:58.159 systems for them to constantly glean that information. But finding out what could be 226 00:15:58.200 --> 00:16:02.519 working but you're not currently doing. Oh, that's what I like to know 227 00:16:02.559 --> 00:16:06.080 from other marketers. One of the things that I think about, Benji is, 228 00:16:06.320 --> 00:16:08.080 as as we're looking at this, a lot of people I had questions 229 00:16:08.120 --> 00:16:12.960 around. They wanted to know what other marketers were doing to create quality content. 230 00:16:14.159 --> 00:16:17.679 That that qualitative angle of it. It's like we know how to do 231 00:16:17.720 --> 00:16:19.639 it, we know the tools that you know. I think a lot of 232 00:16:19.679 --> 00:16:22.480 people know the tools that they need to be able to create some of the 233 00:16:22.519 --> 00:16:26.240 stuff, but how do you how do you know if it's actually good? 234 00:16:26.879 --> 00:16:29.679 And so some of the responses we got were like, how do you keep 235 00:16:29.679 --> 00:16:33.519 your marketing from being average? How are you ensuring that you're creating empathetic thought 236 00:16:33.559 --> 00:16:38.720 leadership content? What makes great content? What content do you want to watch? 237 00:16:38.759 --> 00:16:41.840 So those are some of the responses that we got to this. This 238 00:16:41.919 --> 00:16:45.240 is something that we have struggled with as well, because we're, you know, 239 00:16:45.320 --> 00:16:49.039 for the longest time you're on this hamster, will have just you gotta 240 00:16:49.080 --> 00:16:52.399 put out more content, more content, more content, more content, and 241 00:16:52.759 --> 00:16:57.440 you lose sight of man, is the stuff we're putting out there actually good? 242 00:16:57.840 --> 00:17:02.080 And so one of the things that kind of a mental shift that I 243 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:06.680 had to make for myself was I need to be more involved in vetting whether 244 00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:10.200 something is good or not, like me as the CEO of the company, 245 00:17:10.200 --> 00:17:12.920 and I think that there's not a lot of organizations, unfortunately, where the 246 00:17:12.960 --> 00:17:18.880 CEO is willing to prioritize that. But it doesn't necessarily have to be the 247 00:17:18.920 --> 00:17:22.440 CEO. It can be the subject matter expert that in your organization is kind 248 00:17:22.480 --> 00:17:26.720 of the persona for the person that you're wanting your content to resonate with. 249 00:17:26.119 --> 00:17:30.920 So for us, we take Dan's opinion very seriously. At sweet fish on. 250 00:17:32.279 --> 00:17:36.119 Hey, is this going to actually resonate with marketers? Because Dan was 251 00:17:36.200 --> 00:17:41.119 our buyer at another at another organization prior to joining Sweet Fish. So his 252 00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:47.200 subject matter expertise is huge in determining whether something is good enough for us to 253 00:17:47.279 --> 00:17:49.519 post it. But it's a matter of building. For us, it was 254 00:17:49.559 --> 00:17:55.240 a matter of building a system that allowed the person that you're trying to connect 255 00:17:55.319 --> 00:17:57.440 with, who is that person in your orger, get their eyes on it, 256 00:17:57.480 --> 00:18:00.599 get their ears on it and let them vet whether it's going to be 257 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:04.880 good or not and then give them make it okay for them to say no. 258 00:18:06.519 --> 00:18:08.400 So this is easy for me, is the CEO, but like it 259 00:18:08.440 --> 00:18:11.759 was, it was still easier, I guess I should say, because it 260 00:18:11.799 --> 00:18:15.680 was still tough. I mean, the first time we really started getting into 261 00:18:15.680 --> 00:18:18.519 the rhythm of making a lot of these micro videos, I did one or 262 00:18:18.559 --> 00:18:22.960 two episodes. We had a flurry of new micro clips come in for me 263 00:18:22.000 --> 00:18:26.880 to approve and at first I just approved all of them and I was posting 264 00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:27.680 all of them and I was like more and more and more and more and 265 00:18:27.720 --> 00:18:32.599 more, and then I just started realizing, like man, I'm I'm watering 266 00:18:32.640 --> 00:18:36.000 down, like I'm putting out stuff that I'm not proud to put out, 267 00:18:36.440 --> 00:18:38.799 and so I had to go back and get a lot more serious about saying 268 00:18:38.799 --> 00:18:41.119 no to stuff. And it's not the end of the world. Like I 269 00:18:41.400 --> 00:18:45.839 just heard Gary v Actually yesterday talking about how he goes through and and it's, 270 00:18:47.079 --> 00:18:49.680 I think, the majority of the stuff that comes across his plate he 271 00:18:49.720 --> 00:18:52.640 says no to. He's like, Nope, the post production team missed the 272 00:18:52.680 --> 00:18:57.599 context there, they didn't emphasize the right point in that video, and he 273 00:18:57.640 --> 00:19:03.519 throws out the lions share of what his massive post production team is producing for 274 00:19:03.599 --> 00:19:06.799 him. And that that was really affirming for me, because we're just now 275 00:19:06.839 --> 00:19:11.079 starting to do that, to be okay with saying nope, that clip didn't 276 00:19:11.119 --> 00:19:12.559 nail it, so we're not going to share it. But because we're posting, 277 00:19:14.160 --> 00:19:18.799 because we have rhythms and systems for creating a lot of content, we 278 00:19:18.839 --> 00:19:25.240 can still we're still able to post daily from multiple people's profiles because of the 279 00:19:25.319 --> 00:19:27.960 volume of we we can still say no to a lot and still post daily, 280 00:19:29.319 --> 00:19:32.880 and so I think for us that's that's what's worked for us and I 281 00:19:32.920 --> 00:19:36.000 think can work for a lot of other organizations as well. I'm glad that 282 00:19:36.039 --> 00:19:38.480 you said that, because I think that the rat race can feel very real 283 00:19:40.000 --> 00:19:44.720 in content creation, where it's just like, okay, we gotta figure out 284 00:19:44.799 --> 00:19:47.960 the next video that we have to like, and it's just endless. If 285 00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:52.240 you have rhythms where pillar content is going to be created, something is gonna 286 00:19:52.279 --> 00:19:55.960 come from that, that's good. But like trying to make a content calendar 287 00:19:55.960 --> 00:19:59.839 where it's like we're definitely gonna get six clips from this that will be shared 288 00:19:59.839 --> 00:20:03.720 on these days, I really think that's what leads to commodity content. You 289 00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:06.799 will end up in a space where you're like, well, I guess I 290 00:20:06.839 --> 00:20:08.519 just have to share this because this is what we pulled from it, and 291 00:20:08.559 --> 00:20:12.319 that's just not a great feeling, because you're not gonna hit all home runs. 292 00:20:14.200 --> 00:20:18.839 There's no way that you're batting a thousand in content, especially in video 293 00:20:18.279 --> 00:20:22.200 and in podcasting. What's Nice is it's a conversation, so the three of 294 00:20:22.240 --> 00:20:26.119 us are on a long form, you know, conversation right now, and 295 00:20:26.440 --> 00:20:29.680 that's why people are engaging with the podcast. They want some of this back 296 00:20:29.720 --> 00:20:33.920 and forth. But when you're editing it into like small clips, only going 297 00:20:33.960 --> 00:20:40.079 with what actually adds value is absolutely important. So I'm glad you said that. 298 00:20:40.839 --> 00:20:42.920 And it's tough for us man, I mean as a service provider, 299 00:20:44.240 --> 00:20:47.960 a podcast agency. We're having to really look at like how do we re 300 00:20:48.240 --> 00:20:52.079 Orient our packages are service offering, because if we say hey, you're gonna 301 00:20:52.119 --> 00:20:57.400 get five micro videos and you're paying for those five micro videos, but the 302 00:20:57.480 --> 00:21:02.799 long form episode that we got, there's not enough good content to make up 303 00:21:02.920 --> 00:21:07.160 five micro videos. So we're really starting to examine, like how do we 304 00:21:07.240 --> 00:21:11.599 package up what we do for our clients to keep us from putting out commodity 305 00:21:11.599 --> 00:21:15.839 content on their behalf? Because so that's a challenge that I'm intimately aware of 306 00:21:15.880 --> 00:21:19.359 on two different fronts, for for our own stuff, as we market sweet 307 00:21:19.400 --> 00:21:22.480 fish, but then also for the work that we're doing for clients. And 308 00:21:22.519 --> 00:21:27.279 you had posed that question previously of like pick a subject matter expert. You 309 00:21:27.279 --> 00:21:33.000 know in your space that you want to admire your content, like how would 310 00:21:33.000 --> 00:21:34.839 they think of this right, like how would they interact with it? Would 311 00:21:34.839 --> 00:21:38.279 they talk about it at lunch because your content you're putting out is that kind 312 00:21:38.279 --> 00:21:41.960 of quality, like they want to go share it with their peers? When 313 00:21:41.000 --> 00:21:45.480 you think that way, it really does change like Oh, should we just 314 00:21:45.480 --> 00:21:48.480 put out a blog again this Friday, like, like how you think about 315 00:21:48.480 --> 00:21:52.880 it, how you're educating the market, what the use of that content pieces? 316 00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:56.799 And again it's that curiosity asking the questions and going to people that you 317 00:21:56.839 --> 00:22:00.880 really admiring content and like what's working for you guys right now, like how 318 00:22:00.920 --> 00:22:03.559 can we learn from that? That's why I think this question was great, 319 00:22:03.599 --> 00:22:06.599 because a lot of people are asking that exact thing. Dan, anything else 320 00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:07.720 here that that stands out to you? As we start to wrap up, 321 00:22:08.160 --> 00:22:12.079 and I've almost become a collector of good questions, I have a whole ever 322 00:22:12.160 --> 00:22:17.920 note section, sorry, not ever note section of notion, where I categorize 323 00:22:18.079 --> 00:22:22.039 and collect fantastic questions. But the best, some of the best questions, 324 00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:26.680 I'm starting to find actually, are the questions your ideal buyers are asking themselves, 325 00:22:27.319 --> 00:22:30.799 because with those questions you can form answers for it over and over again. 326 00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:36.680 And one way I found out recently that you can go even deeper because 327 00:22:36.799 --> 00:22:40.559 after a while you'll find a core group of questions and kind of have your 328 00:22:40.559 --> 00:22:42.359 point of view on answering them and you can turn that point of view into 329 00:22:42.400 --> 00:22:45.359 a bunch of different say a bunch of different ways. So that it sinks 330 00:22:45.400 --> 00:22:49.160 in, some people still won't take your advice even if they agree with it. 331 00:22:49.640 --> 00:22:52.559 So what I'm starting to think about now is, even though we have 332 00:22:52.640 --> 00:22:56.920 our strong points of view and we're communicating them frequently and often and people are 333 00:22:56.920 --> 00:23:00.480 agreeing, and yet it's still not taking action. Why? It's like a 334 00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:06.079 whole another set of questions that's beyond what's working for you or what's what's causing 335 00:23:06.119 --> 00:23:08.480 you the most pain in your job right now. If they know the answer 336 00:23:08.519 --> 00:23:11.640 and are still not executing on it, why aren't they executing on it? 337 00:23:11.680 --> 00:23:15.400 Is it a fear? Is it insecurity? Is there something that's causing them 338 00:23:15.440 --> 00:23:21.440 to hold back finding the answer? Using those questions to go one level deeper 339 00:23:21.880 --> 00:23:25.519 and then addressing those, even though it probably at that point will sound a 340 00:23:25.519 --> 00:23:30.440 little bit more motivational speechie at the end of the day is probably one of 341 00:23:30.440 --> 00:23:33.680 the best ways you can serve your ideal buyers is to get to the root 342 00:23:33.720 --> 00:23:37.599 of the issue why they're not successful. I think that's that's why Gary V 343 00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:41.839 is blowing up continues to blow up, is because he's pressing harder and harder 344 00:23:41.319 --> 00:23:45.319 into those things. And you had mentioned it before we started recording. But 345 00:23:45.400 --> 00:23:48.519 it's like that's why he's starting to sound more and more like a motivational speaker, 346 00:23:48.559 --> 00:23:52.640 because he's pressing more into why is someone not taking the advice that I'm 347 00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:56.359 saying, like, why are they not putting out seventy two pieces of content 348 00:23:56.359 --> 00:24:00.839 a day? Oh, it's because they're insecure because of the way they were 349 00:24:00.920 --> 00:24:03.279 raised, or that they got told that they were fat until they were twelve 350 00:24:03.359 --> 00:24:07.319 years old, and so that, like he's starting to press into like the 351 00:24:07.440 --> 00:24:12.039 real emotional stuff which comes across very much motivation, e. But it's because 352 00:24:12.039 --> 00:24:15.440 he's figured out that, like, I can give you all the right answers 353 00:24:15.680 --> 00:24:18.720 and if you're not going to do it, then why am I continuing to 354 00:24:18.720 --> 00:24:21.039 give you all the right answers? I need to get to the core and 355 00:24:21.079 --> 00:24:23.640 help solve some of those core things so that you can actually do themself. 356 00:24:23.920 --> 00:24:27.240 And then he develops his own points of view and things around it. Right 357 00:24:27.799 --> 00:24:30.359 is and like I can hear it in my eyes, like I'm going to 358 00:24:30.480 --> 00:24:36.680 suffocate your excuses. It's the language he's developed around those, those talking points, 359 00:24:36.680 --> 00:24:38.400 which I think is smart and I think we can all do that for 360 00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:45.079 individual and industries. Yeah, that's kind of where I was gonna wrap us 361 00:24:45.160 --> 00:24:48.359 up, is because I do think when I was looking over all these questions, 362 00:24:48.799 --> 00:24:53.640 like man, all of these are great content pieces, great episode premises 363 00:24:53.680 --> 00:24:59.200 for Podcasts, like and not because you want one of these questions to just 364 00:24:59.240 --> 00:25:02.079 stay at the surf this level and go like, all right, Dann, 365 00:25:02.079 --> 00:25:04.720 how do you spend your day? But like when you dive a layer deeper, 366 00:25:04.759 --> 00:25:07.440 like you guys are saying, that's when you start to get to the 367 00:25:07.480 --> 00:25:11.359 good stuff of like, okay, when it comes to content, when it 368 00:25:11.359 --> 00:25:14.720 comes to attribution, what's like, the underlying fear you're experiencing? What? 369 00:25:15.079 --> 00:25:17.599 And we can do that and B Two b. But again, like that's 370 00:25:17.640 --> 00:25:19.680 why emotional marketing comes up even in B two B, is because I think 371 00:25:19.720 --> 00:25:25.359 there is a general fear there of how you will come off. I respect 372 00:25:25.400 --> 00:25:30.160 Gary v's approach because he gave us very good marketing advice, first because he's 373 00:25:30.160 --> 00:25:33.319 showing he's an expert, and then now he's going, okay, if you 374 00:25:33.319 --> 00:25:37.519 want to be like this, here's also the soft skills that are necessary in 375 00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:40.559 order to get there. So when you can tie them together, the felt 376 00:25:40.640 --> 00:25:44.599 need and then what's underlying, that's when you start to hit some gold, 377 00:25:44.680 --> 00:25:47.519 and I think that that's a big deal for me when I look at all 378 00:25:47.519 --> 00:25:49.880 these questions like this. Is Great for content and it's great for going a 379 00:25:49.960 --> 00:25:55.960 layer deeper with people and and exposing some things and working on something so fun 380 00:25:55.960 --> 00:25:59.599 episode. Stay curious. That's the main takeaway from me from this is. 381 00:25:59.640 --> 00:26:02.400 Like Dan, I'm glad you said keep a list of questions. I do 382 00:26:02.440 --> 00:26:06.359 the exact same thing. I I love having questions that you can refer back 383 00:26:06.400 --> 00:26:08.599 to ask yourself, even like a you know, for me I have weekly 384 00:26:08.960 --> 00:26:14.160 questions I go back to and, uh, just ways of stay on top 385 00:26:14.160 --> 00:26:17.359 of things by asking good questions staying curious. So again, you can connect 386 00:26:17.400 --> 00:26:22.559 with James, with Dan, with myself over on Linkedin. Talk about marketing, 387 00:26:22.599 --> 00:26:25.680 business life over there, and I would love to hear from you. 388 00:26:25.960 --> 00:26:29.720 Keep doing work that matters. We'll be back real soon with another episode of 389 00:26:29.759 --> 00:26:45.000 B Two B growth. If you enjoy today's show, hit subscribe for more 390 00:26:45.119 --> 00:26:48.960 marketing goodness and if you really enjoy today's show, take a second to rate 391 00:26:48.000 --> 00:26:52.799 and review the podcast on the platform you're listening to it on right now. 392 00:26:52.960 --> 00:26:56.079 If you really really enjoyed this episode, share the love by texting it to 393 00:26:56.079 --> 00:27:00.720 a friend who would find it insightful. Thanks for listening and thanks for sharing. m