The Role of Website Personalization in ABM

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.540 --> 00:00:09.240 welcome back to be to be a growth. I'm Dan Sanchez with sweet fish Media and 2 00:00:09.240 --> 00:00:12.940 I'm continuing the journey and a B M and I'm three weeks in So a b m 3 00:00:12.940 --> 00:00:16.570 starting to become a real reality to me to sinking, and I've read multiple 4 00:00:16.570 --> 00:00:20.900 books on the topic. I still have many to go and about a week's worth of 5 00:00:20.910 --> 00:00:25.840 interview. Still to do before this journey comes to a conclusion when, 6 00:00:25.840 --> 00:00:28.940 while I've learned a lot, I've still found I have unanswered questions. I 7 00:00:28.940 --> 00:00:34.270 have places in the A B M space that I have not on deep into yet. And so today 8 00:00:34.270 --> 00:00:38.990 I'm joined by a guy yell If who is the CEO of Intel? Um, eyes and we're gonna 9 00:00:38.990 --> 00:00:41.560 be talking about website personalization. This is kind of a 10 00:00:41.560 --> 00:00:44.700 category that I found out is in a B M, though I haven't covered in any of the 11 00:00:44.700 --> 00:00:49.650 episode yet, so I was excited to talk to guy about his company. What it does 12 00:00:49.650 --> 00:00:53.280 is well, is just the category of what we do with personalizing a website, 13 00:00:53.280 --> 00:00:56.650 which I think is any any digital marketing plan, any kind of marketing 14 00:00:56.650 --> 00:01:01.710 plan. And in 20 twenties, right is like the main hub of all marketing that we 15 00:01:01.710 --> 00:01:04.440 do. We're all trying to get traffic back to our website where we have more 16 00:01:04.440 --> 00:01:07.850 control over the experience. So it makes sense that we want to talk about 17 00:01:07.860 --> 00:01:13.900 a B M as it relates to your own website. So, guy, I'm so excited to have you on 18 00:01:13.900 --> 00:01:17.380 the show today. How you doing? I'm doing great. Dan. Honored to be here. 19 00:01:17.380 --> 00:01:20.330 I've been listening to the podcast throughout the month. Very excited to 20 00:01:20.330 --> 00:01:25.480 have this conversation. Fantastic. Ready? Dive in. So to get started, I 21 00:01:25.480 --> 00:01:29.950 want to talk about broadly. What is website personalization in case the 22 00:01:29.950 --> 00:01:34.770 audience doesn't know. And why is it important? Website personalization is 23 00:01:34.770 --> 00:01:39.400 giving different visitors different experiences as consumers. We've all 24 00:01:39.400 --> 00:01:44.780 been trained by Yahoo, Amazon, Netflix and a bunch of others to expect our 25 00:01:44.790 --> 00:01:47.640 digital experience. Our journey with the companies with whom we're 26 00:01:47.640 --> 00:01:52.130 interacting to be tailored to us website personalization is an approach 27 00:01:52.130 --> 00:01:56.690 where you can meet in a B two b context each of your prospects where they are 28 00:01:56.690 --> 00:02:00.950 in their funnel with you to recognize that a first time visitor is really 29 00:02:00.950 --> 00:02:03.890 different than somebody has already asked for a demo is really different 30 00:02:03.890 --> 00:02:09.199 than somebody who's already existing customer. The goal of it is more 31 00:02:09.199 --> 00:02:12.970 revenue more leads to sales form or customers. Ultimately, it's about 32 00:02:12.970 --> 00:02:17.090 driving more money. And it's one of many techniques to go do that that, 33 00:02:17.090 --> 00:02:20.610 like the broader umbrella of A B. M or the broader umbrella of conversion rate 34 00:02:20.610 --> 00:02:25.900 optimization. Now I've seen website personalization out there for a while. 35 00:02:25.900 --> 00:02:29.560 I'd probably say the first experience I had with it was probably five years ago, 36 00:02:30.040 --> 00:02:32.680 and I had seen it. And what had happened is there, like, Well, which 37 00:02:32.680 --> 00:02:36.000 one? Which bucket do you fit in? We wanted Taylor, and it was literally 38 00:02:36.000 --> 00:02:38.640 like we wanted Taylor the website to you, and I was like, Okay, I'm like, I 39 00:02:38.640 --> 00:02:40.870 don't really fit in any of these buckets. But I'm curious to see how 40 00:02:40.870 --> 00:02:44.490 this works. Click. And then, of course, the home page changed and customized 41 00:02:44.490 --> 00:02:47.570 the website. I was the first time I realized that it was happening, though 42 00:02:47.570 --> 00:02:51.030 I'm sure it was happening long before that and generally you probably don't 43 00:02:51.030 --> 00:02:54.420 know. But a lot of websites are probably being customized. Do you? 44 00:02:54.420 --> 00:02:57.630 Right now as you're browsing around the Web or when you get back on the Web 45 00:02:57.630 --> 00:03:01.580 sometime today, the web, some websites probably been customized. Guy. What 46 00:03:01.580 --> 00:03:04.520 percentage of websites do you feel like? You're just being customized all the 47 00:03:04.520 --> 00:03:08.290 time now and people just aren't even aware of it. It's a great question. The 48 00:03:08.290 --> 00:03:12.990 last time I looked at data from either built with their data and eyes to the 49 00:03:12.990 --> 00:03:17.890 sources, we tend to look at the top 10,000 websites. It was something like 50 00:03:17.890 --> 00:03:25.280 a 3rd 30 to 40%. Top 100,000 was about half that. It seems like Look, we, as 51 00:03:25.280 --> 00:03:30.140 marketers have been a marketer for the last decade, spent $120 billion every 52 00:03:30.140 --> 00:03:34.660 year just in the US driving people, the websites. But we failed to turn them 53 00:03:34.660 --> 00:03:40.910 into customers 98% of the time. Like in what world is that? Okay. And so we see 54 00:03:40.920 --> 00:03:44.700 this as something that we all increasingly expect us consumers and in 55 00:03:44.700 --> 00:03:50.010 our business lives. It has a great positive impact, I was gonna say for a 56 00:03:50.010 --> 00:03:54.300 lot of websites, 2% would even be pretty dang good, right? I've heard 57 00:03:54.300 --> 00:03:58.190 anywhere from like if you're if you're in between the 2 to 5% conversion rate 58 00:03:58.190 --> 00:04:02.210 on your website, depending on what industry of course that you're in like 59 00:04:02.210 --> 00:04:05.350 you're usually doing pretty good like even talk, Thio asked Chris Walker and 60 00:04:05.350 --> 00:04:09.450 lengthen recently. He's like we got to get beyond the 0.5% conversion rates. 61 00:04:09.450 --> 00:04:13.190 I'm like So what is good? He's like, Oh, you know, between two and 5%. I'm like, 62 00:04:13.190 --> 00:04:18.370 Okay, it's not like 10 or 15% though its's would be highly uncommon to see 63 00:04:18.370 --> 00:04:22.720 that on, I think, if you're not sure what website personalization as I love 64 00:04:22.720 --> 00:04:27.270 if you go toe intel, um eyes dot com they have this one button that I found 65 00:04:27.270 --> 00:04:31.820 was wonderful because it illustrates what they do and what it is. It's like 66 00:04:31.820 --> 00:04:35.490 a yellow button that kind of hovers over the website. If you click it, it 67 00:04:35.490 --> 00:04:38.900 says, see what is optimized here. You click the button and all of sudden it 68 00:04:38.900 --> 00:04:43.540 throws like these blue dotted boxes around every section of their website 69 00:04:43.550 --> 00:04:48.080 that has been customized for me, the website visitor. So it's very exciting 70 00:04:48.080 --> 00:04:50.560 to see all the things that you can customize, of course, is a marketer. 71 00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:52.830 I'm like Well, it's probably a lot of frickin work because now I have to 72 00:04:52.830 --> 00:04:56.070 figure out, Oh, what would I serve to everybody? And how would I think about 73 00:04:56.070 --> 00:04:59.190 it differently? But that will have to wait for that part of the conversation 74 00:04:59.190 --> 00:05:02.760 a little later in the interview. For now, I want to talk about, Like, what? 75 00:05:02.770 --> 00:05:07.530 How is this related to a B M like, How is this serve somebody who's walking 76 00:05:07.530 --> 00:05:11.740 through an A B M campaign to tailor their website to their audience? We 77 00:05:11.740 --> 00:05:16.220 think they are directly related. So a B M is saying, as you've covered 78 00:05:16.220 --> 00:05:19.840 previously on the podcast, sales and marketing are going to be coordinated. 79 00:05:19.940 --> 00:05:24.490 So the marketings focused their spears that they're sending outbound on the 80 00:05:24.490 --> 00:05:28.040 exact accounts and individuals that those accounts that matter to sales. 81 00:05:28.100 --> 00:05:31.460 Great. Let's say you hook one of them and managed to get them to your website. 82 00:05:32.340 --> 00:05:36.570 You want to speak to them differently than you would speak to others. We 83 00:05:36.580 --> 00:05:41.390 encourage all the folks with whom we work to treat every page, in particular 84 00:05:41.390 --> 00:05:44.260 their home page, like a landing page, or you think about all the landing 85 00:05:44.260 --> 00:05:48.000 pages we've all created over the years for our ads. What if your home page 86 00:05:48.000 --> 00:05:53.250 where that personalized? What if every page was 1 to 2? Then go meet them 87 00:05:53.250 --> 00:05:57.750 where they are in their journey with you, to recognize that you're speaking 88 00:05:57.750 --> 00:06:01.230 to different roles at different sized companies that air in different places 89 00:06:01.230 --> 00:06:05.390 in their journey, and that you can create a mawr bespoke, more relevant 90 00:06:05.390 --> 00:06:08.820 experience that will move them through the funnel more quickly. So Website 91 00:06:08.820 --> 00:06:13.120 personalization helps bring a whole bunch of that toe life, often to your 92 00:06:13.120 --> 00:06:16.540 earlier point about content reusing content you already have. You've 93 00:06:16.540 --> 00:06:19.810 already created the personas you've already created. The case studies. If 94 00:06:19.810 --> 00:06:23.830 you can show that visitor the one that's relevant to them, they're more 95 00:06:23.830 --> 00:06:27.660 likely to engage with you more. Makes a lot of sense, but my question is like, 96 00:06:28.140 --> 00:06:33.330 Let's say I've been interacting with people on Lincoln. I share a link to my 97 00:06:33.340 --> 00:06:37.080 maybe a block post, a case study at published recently, and they're 98 00:06:37.080 --> 00:06:40.770 visiting to it from Lincoln. How does it know that they're in my target 99 00:06:40.770 --> 00:06:43.580 account? Because there's probably a lot of traffic coming from LinkedIn, but 100 00:06:43.580 --> 00:06:47.550 some of them are outside my I C p. Some of them aren't my target accounts, but 101 00:06:47.560 --> 00:06:52.060 could be, you know, and some are specifically the exact people I want to 102 00:06:52.060 --> 00:06:58.200 build a relationship with. How does it know? Great question. We typically seen 103 00:06:58.200 --> 00:07:05.490 a three ways this will happen. Uh, one. Often you've already put you tm 104 00:07:05.490 --> 00:07:10.430 parameters or other euro parameters in the link for your own analytics. You 105 00:07:10.430 --> 00:07:14.360 can use those to better personalize the experience. We automatically parse all 106 00:07:14.360 --> 00:07:19.620 of them. Andi, use that in machine, learning to find correlations. Or you 107 00:07:19.620 --> 00:07:22.630 can set up rules, right? If if they're in the target account list, I want to 108 00:07:22.630 --> 00:07:28.260 show them this different experience. 12 You can be anonymous. The traffic. All 109 00:07:28.260 --> 00:07:31.550 right. Maybe that maybe you didn't tag the link. Or maybe they came from 110 00:07:31.550 --> 00:07:35.360 somewhere else. You might use one of the D anonymous ation vendors out there 111 00:07:35.360 --> 00:07:40.840 that say, Oh, you know what? Dan showed up from the sweet Fish media office and 112 00:07:40.840 --> 00:07:44.450 we know who he is. We can personalize that way. And three, if they visited 113 00:07:44.450 --> 00:07:48.180 the site before. And maybe they felt that a form you can go match the, you 114 00:07:48.180 --> 00:07:52.760 know, market a munchkin or some other way toe reconnect back to that profile 115 00:07:52.780 --> 00:07:57.420 to that, know who it is. So you can personalize by industry by role, by 116 00:07:57.420 --> 00:08:01.580 size of company by stage and funnel or whatever other lens you would like to 117 00:08:01.580 --> 00:08:05.340 use on that personalization. Does that resonate then? So I think so. I think 118 00:08:05.350 --> 00:08:09.650 so is three different ways. One. I give something like and televised the 119 00:08:09.650 --> 00:08:13.220 information through the link You, Earl, the Perma link that comes to the with 120 00:08:13.220 --> 00:08:18.060 EU tm programs and all that kind of stuff. Eso I can essentially say Hey, 121 00:08:18.070 --> 00:08:21.200 I'm going to send people to my home page But I know in this particular 122 00:08:21.200 --> 00:08:24.410 setting where I'm sharing the link there would be in this particular 123 00:08:24.410 --> 00:08:27.990 industry. So while I'm sending to my home page, it's gonna customize it for 124 00:08:27.990 --> 00:08:30.290 the industry because I have a little bit more control over that. Maybe I 125 00:08:30.290 --> 00:08:34.409 know where I'm sharing the link. Maybe I'm shooting the link than email out to 126 00:08:34.419 --> 00:08:38.520 a group, and I haven't targeted already. So there's that. I think the second one 127 00:08:38.520 --> 00:08:43.440 I heard was just through cookies because they visited. Maybe they 128 00:08:43.440 --> 00:08:47.630 visited particular block post in the past, and because of that, I can tag 129 00:08:47.630 --> 00:08:51.770 them now in the system to know, like, okay, this person's in this camp. So 130 00:08:51.770 --> 00:08:55.990 next time they come back to the home page, maybe through a retargeting ad, I 131 00:08:55.990 --> 00:08:59.470 can customize it, knowing what I know about them because they visited this 132 00:08:59.470 --> 00:09:02.740 one block post. Maybe they found it to search or something. And then the last 133 00:09:02.740 --> 00:09:07.510 one is through the CRM because they fill out a form. At some point, we can 134 00:09:07.510 --> 00:09:10.740 customize it based on what we have in the crm about them, which could start 135 00:09:10.740 --> 00:09:14.580 to customize it based on where they're at in their journey. Is that right? Hey, 136 00:09:14.590 --> 00:09:19.220 almost exactly. I'm totally with you on the first one. And in fact, you can use 137 00:09:19.220 --> 00:09:23.180 those. You tm parameters. Chances are you've done it for yourself. It's not 138 00:09:23.180 --> 00:09:26.860 for in televised. You've already done it for your own analytics will reuse 139 00:09:26.860 --> 00:09:29.590 them. And to your point, Dan, you could do it by industry. You could do it down 140 00:09:29.590 --> 00:09:33.220 to the account. You could say it is JetBlue showing up. And so I want to 141 00:09:33.220 --> 00:09:36.450 personalize this specific. I want to show JetBlue their account rep on the 142 00:09:36.450 --> 00:09:40.680 page. I want to say, Hey, Joe, or Jane is ready to talk to you. The third one 143 00:09:40.680 --> 00:09:45.200 totally with you. The CRM system? Absolutely the second one. That's a 144 00:09:45.200 --> 00:09:51.710 great idea. We've seen that dunmore and B to C, where you'll pay blue kind 145 00:09:51.710 --> 00:09:55.710 experience. They've got, you know, huge cookie pools out there. They're looking 146 00:09:55.710 --> 00:10:00.580 across sites to go identify, you know, demographics or behavior about somebody. 147 00:10:00.590 --> 00:10:05.250 The thing I was mentioning that I didn't do a good job describing Waas to 148 00:10:05.250 --> 00:10:10.050 pay someone like some of the folks we think about her clear bit or six cents 149 00:10:10.050 --> 00:10:14.390 or demand base, where they've got a big database of this I p address is this 150 00:10:14.390 --> 00:10:17.500 company's office. So it's not about the cookies. It's actually about the I P 151 00:10:17.500 --> 00:10:21.470 address. And so, you know, they showed up from JetBlue's office in wherever 152 00:10:21.470 --> 00:10:24.030 their headquarters is. Let's pretend it's New York, right, that that that's 153 00:10:24.030 --> 00:10:27.880 their office. I know that somebody from JetBlue and I can personalize the site 154 00:10:27.880 --> 00:10:32.430 accordingly, so it's like a reverse I p look up. Actually, it's exactly that. 155 00:10:32.440 --> 00:10:33.660 Does that resonate? 156 00:10:35.240 --> 00:10:38.650 Yep, absolutely. And it makes sense in a lot of a B M. Tech companies are 157 00:10:38.650 --> 00:10:43.300 certainly using the I P address. Quite often, I mentioned that's gotten hard 158 00:10:43.310 --> 00:10:46.450 in a remote work environment where people are working from home a lot. 159 00:10:46.450 --> 00:10:51.770 That tactic quite working as well as these two. But I sure as we go back, 160 00:10:51.780 --> 00:10:54.370 there's many people go back to work that'll that'll probably work a lot 161 00:10:54.370 --> 00:10:57.810 better. The cookie one's interesting. Those I found that that was probably, 162 00:10:57.820 --> 00:11:02.230 at least for me. What I've done with websites before is based on the cookies. 163 00:11:02.240 --> 00:11:04.960 I think one of my favorite plug ins that I've used just for WordPress and 164 00:11:04.960 --> 00:11:09.760 this is like a kind of like $100 or $3200 kind of month thing called Opted 165 00:11:09.760 --> 00:11:14.660 Monster can. Actually, you can customize the CTS, the pop ups or the 166 00:11:15.040 --> 00:11:21.030 Sita forms. Which ones are showing based on previous pages hit or loaded 167 00:11:21.030 --> 00:11:23.980 to it? I'm assuming they're doing it with cookies. That's probably the only 168 00:11:23.980 --> 00:11:28.500 logical explanation I could get Thio because they wouldn't have access to my 169 00:11:28.500 --> 00:11:33.150 CRM. But that's probably the only reason why would think that's possible 170 00:11:33.150 --> 00:11:36.420 is I've seen a few other people like that do it interesting, and it does 171 00:11:36.430 --> 00:11:39.510 seem like there are folks who make a whole business out of it. You know, 172 00:11:39.510 --> 00:11:43.380 looking across sites, we purposely don't. I spent the last 15 years and ad 173 00:11:43.380 --> 00:11:49.960 tech, and we aren't doing that cross site but the matching in any way but 174 00:11:49.960 --> 00:11:54.260 within a site. Dan Dear Point, you can infer an awful lot based on some of 175 00:11:54.260 --> 00:11:59.010 these behavior, right? If they go toe a page with a particular case study, you 176 00:11:59.010 --> 00:12:02.730 can infer size of company and industry. If they go to a particular product, you 177 00:12:02.730 --> 00:12:05.750 can infer what product they're interested in. Often you'll have 178 00:12:05.750 --> 00:12:11.440 personas on your site. You can, you know, infer from their behavior which 179 00:12:11.440 --> 00:12:16.020 persona they are. And remember that and speak to them differently across the 180 00:12:16.020 --> 00:12:20.090 site, using content you already have. But if they went to that case study, 181 00:12:20.100 --> 00:12:22.650 show them another one from the same industry on their home page. The next 182 00:12:22.650 --> 00:12:26.120 time they show up, you don't have to create a whole new one. You can tailor 183 00:12:26.120 --> 00:12:32.010 the experience to create a more personalized account base approach, so 184 00:12:32.010 --> 00:12:36.810 you're using cookies to some degree and changing the site live absolutely 185 00:12:36.820 --> 00:12:40.570 within the site. When I heard Cookie, I was thinking back to add tech days 186 00:12:40.570 --> 00:12:45.810 cross. No, no, no. It's like I've heard some people call on site retargeting. 187 00:12:45.820 --> 00:12:49.420 It's like ads, but they're all on your site, like you have full control over 188 00:12:49.420 --> 00:12:54.050 it, right? And maybe some people caught. Gosh, I've run into a few small 189 00:12:54.050 --> 00:12:57.950 startups that do this now they've tried to position it is on, like on site 190 00:12:57.950 --> 00:13:01.620 retargeting, But really, it's just changing things off based on what pages 191 00:13:01.620 --> 00:13:05.690 people visited before. Okay, that's kind of cool that it's like the site 192 00:13:05.690 --> 00:13:08.640 suggesting to you, even if it knows nothing about you. As soon as you start 193 00:13:08.640 --> 00:13:12.250 clicking on links, it starts suggesting the experience for you. And that's a 194 00:13:12.250 --> 00:13:17.830 different depth that I have not heard or thought about before you spot on. 195 00:13:17.840 --> 00:13:22.900 And if it was nothing about you, it can still do a better than I know nothing 196 00:13:22.900 --> 00:13:27.670 about your job of deciding what to show you. Why? Because even if you show up 197 00:13:27.680 --> 00:13:28.860 and we know nothing about you 198 00:13:30.040 --> 00:13:34.580 through reverse, I p look upto location. We know city, state, country we know 199 00:13:34.580 --> 00:13:39.190 mobile desktop tablet. We know. Is that your first visit? A repeat visit. We 200 00:13:39.190 --> 00:13:42.480 know if you came from another site, what site where you want just through 201 00:13:42.480 --> 00:13:46.250 the refer. If you were clicked on an ad or an email to your point about the U. 202 00:13:46.250 --> 00:13:50.150 T. M's earlier, we know what messaging you saw. We know what targeting was 203 00:13:50.150 --> 00:13:54.080 used. You can use all of those. Even if we've never seen anybody who looks 204 00:13:54.080 --> 00:13:55.650 exactly like you, 205 00:13:56.740 --> 00:13:59.680 we can use machine learning to infer. Well, okay, I've seen people who share 206 00:13:59.680 --> 00:14:03.980 some of the attributes with Dan. Let me go show Dan something that's more 207 00:14:03.980 --> 00:14:07.320 likely to get him to fill out the form we want him to fill out, to talk to 208 00:14:07.320 --> 00:14:11.360 sales or to do the, you know, free product trial signing. 209 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:16.640 Is that resident Absolutely. So I'm thinking through it's almost like 210 00:14:16.650 --> 00:14:19.820 putting something like this on your website makes sense in any case. But it 211 00:14:19.820 --> 00:14:23.490 certainly makes sense for your A B M campaigns, mainly because of the the I 212 00:14:23.490 --> 00:14:27.600 P. Look up or because you can tap into other data sources that can then change 213 00:14:27.600 --> 00:14:31.810 the site for what you know is your target account. But even if you don't 214 00:14:31.810 --> 00:14:35.890 know it's your target account, it could still start affecting and changing the 215 00:14:35.890 --> 00:14:39.990 conversion rate on your site quite drastically. By customizing the whole 216 00:14:39.990 --> 00:14:45.580 experience, I couldn't agree with you more and often will find, you know, 98% 217 00:14:45.580 --> 00:14:49.790 of the traffic to the site is not the target account list. And so to be able 218 00:14:49.790 --> 00:14:53.470 tohave that spectrum from you know what I'm doing 1 to 1. Marketing. I know 219 00:14:53.470 --> 00:14:59.800 this is Joe or Jane at Agnico, and I'm gonna go name Acme Co on the site. I'm 220 00:14:59.800 --> 00:15:04.370 gonna go show them their competitors logos in the logo farm. I'm going to 221 00:15:04.370 --> 00:15:08.850 show them in industry specific case study all the way through to I have no 222 00:15:08.850 --> 00:15:14.660 idea who this is and being ableto do that one. The 11 too few, one too many, 223 00:15:14.670 --> 00:15:19.580 all in the same experience on the same website we find that helps maximize 224 00:15:19.580 --> 00:15:26.310 revenue for B two B marketers. Hey, everybody, Logan with sweet fish here, 225 00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:29.420 if you've been listening to the show for a while, you know, we're big 226 00:15:29.420 --> 00:15:33.810 proponents of putting out original organic content on LinkedIn. But one 227 00:15:33.810 --> 00:15:37.850 thing that's always been a struggle for a team like ours is too easily track 228 00:15:37.850 --> 00:15:41.570 the reach of that Lincoln content. That's why I was really excited when I 229 00:15:41.570 --> 00:15:45.660 heard about Shield the other day from a connection on you guessed it linked in. 230 00:15:45.670 --> 00:15:50.500 Since our team started using shield, I've loved how it's led us easily track 231 00:15:50.510 --> 00:15:54.470 and analyze the performance of Arlington content without having to 232 00:15:54.470 --> 00:15:58.320 manually log it ourselves. It automatically creates reports and 233 00:15:58.320 --> 00:16:01.940 generate some dashboards that are incredibly useful to see things like 234 00:16:01.950 --> 00:16:05.410 what contents been performing the best and what days of the week are we 235 00:16:05.410 --> 00:16:09.810 getting the most engagement and our average views proposed? I highly 236 00:16:09.810 --> 00:16:12.980 suggest you guys check out this tool. If you're putting out content on 237 00:16:12.980 --> 00:16:17.300 LinkedIn, and if you're not, you should be. It's been a game changer for us. If 238 00:16:17.300 --> 00:16:22.330 you go to shield app dot ai and check out the 10 day free trial. You can even 239 00:16:22.330 --> 00:16:27.660 use our promo code B two B growth to get a 25% discount. Again. That's 240 00:16:27.670 --> 00:16:34.350 shield app dot ai And that promo code is be the number to be growth. All one 241 00:16:34.350 --> 00:16:40.850 word. All right, let's get back to the show. Tell me a little bit more about 242 00:16:40.850 --> 00:16:44.000 the 1 to 1 experience because most of what I'm thinking about when it comes 243 00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:47.790 to work website Personalization is like a one too few type of approach. How 244 00:16:47.790 --> 00:16:54.380 does it become 1 to 1? So if you knew, for example, in that email or add 245 00:16:54.380 --> 00:16:59.020 somebody clicked on that that was targeted specifically to dance Sanchez. 246 00:16:59.030 --> 00:17:05.670 And then I wanted to name your company. I wanted to put your rep on the site. I 247 00:17:05.670 --> 00:17:10.300 want to do push you away. I'll make it up your large enterprise. I don't want 248 00:17:10.300 --> 00:17:13.910 you to go to sell, sir. I want to talk to a human that works for my company. 249 00:17:13.920 --> 00:17:19.470 Right? I can go change each of those experiences now. I can. Most of us. I 250 00:17:19.470 --> 00:17:22.369 think we're used to thinking. Okay, well, that's a B m. I'm gonna do that 251 00:17:22.369 --> 00:17:26.550 with rules I'm gonna do. If this then that statements. We agree completely 252 00:17:26.560 --> 00:17:31.670 And think you could do even better. For example, what's the right way to say 253 00:17:32.140 --> 00:17:38.320 Agnico in the headline of the page. Hi, Agnico. Welcome back. Acne Co. We think 254 00:17:38.320 --> 00:17:40.960 you're great company Agnico. Here's your competitors. Technical, right? I'm 255 00:17:40.960 --> 00:17:45.060 making this up. You can use machine learning to say this is a B M, 256 00:17:46.240 --> 00:17:49.200 but I don't know exactly the right way to do it right and you actually get to 257 00:17:49.210 --> 00:17:52.700 not have this sort of religious debates internally. Like, what's the right way? 258 00:17:52.700 --> 00:17:58.950 Thio say Agnico in the headline You can use ML cared with the rule, right? If 259 00:17:58.950 --> 00:18:01.950 they're on my target list, I want to name them in the headline. But then, 260 00:18:01.950 --> 00:18:05.750 which version of the headline use them all to do that? Use use machine 261 00:18:05.750 --> 00:18:09.750 learning to do a better job of figuring out what version to show each visitor. 262 00:18:09.760 --> 00:18:15.060 You can apply that principle throughout the whole experience. For the elements, 263 00:18:15.440 --> 00:18:19.450 there are a BME and for the elements that aren't like What do you want to 264 00:18:19.450 --> 00:18:24.430 call action to be or what? What what sequence of things do I want on the 265 00:18:24.430 --> 00:18:27.020 page? You know, do I wanna talk about the product first, or about the 266 00:18:27.020 --> 00:18:31.630 customers first? Or about the industry? First, you can then use ML to 267 00:18:31.640 --> 00:18:36.350 personalize those other elements in parallel to the A bme sort of wonder 268 00:18:36.350 --> 00:18:41.010 One elements. Does that reasoning? Gosh, it's like you put two things together 269 00:18:41.010 --> 00:18:44.790 that I normally don't put together in personalization and almost like this 270 00:18:44.790 --> 00:18:48.470 multi variant testing that the machine learning is doing, I always kind of 271 00:18:48.470 --> 00:18:50.890 figured that those was kind of like you're either doing one or the other 272 00:18:50.890 --> 00:18:53.780 because they're really difficult to do together. Unless I guess you have 273 00:18:53.780 --> 00:18:57.080 machine learning driving the whole experience and could do more than just 274 00:18:57.090 --> 00:19:02.800 plug in insert name and can actually fiddle with the actual copy around the 275 00:19:02.810 --> 00:19:08.880 personalization. So had opens up a whole world and must be interesting to 276 00:19:08.880 --> 00:19:11.880 see how many different variations of what Beijing can load if you have that 277 00:19:11.880 --> 00:19:15.910 kind of thing going on almost like your websites of leaving living, breathing 278 00:19:15.920 --> 00:19:19.680 thing. Um, but still, you have to put parameters on it, right? You have to 279 00:19:19.690 --> 00:19:22.710 give it like a character limit what it could do for a headline before it 280 00:19:22.710 --> 00:19:27.090 starts to throw off the site design. Right then what you said resonates so 281 00:19:27.090 --> 00:19:32.060 strongly. And we so often hear these air two strategies to budgets two teams 282 00:19:32.060 --> 00:19:34.990 and ultimately they're both in service of making more money. And so I'm 283 00:19:34.990 --> 00:19:39.900 totally with you on sort of the mindset shift and on the variations you can 284 00:19:39.900 --> 00:19:44.300 load, I'm with you fact. Our average customer over the last two years tried 285 00:19:44.310 --> 00:19:49.990 177 different ideas had they done that with traditional split testing that 286 00:19:49.990 --> 00:19:51.450 would have taken him a quarter century. 287 00:19:52.840 --> 00:19:58.790 But using ML, they didn't do 177. They optimized across the 78 million 288 00:19:58.790 --> 00:20:03.960 possible combinations out of those 177 which us mere mortal humans can't do 289 00:20:03.960 --> 00:20:06.870 what it would take too long and the things themselves to your point about 290 00:20:06.870 --> 00:20:12.400 character limits totally with you. We ultimately these air humans coming up 291 00:20:12.400 --> 00:20:17.600 with ideas. Humans getting mawr time Thio do the stuff we're uniquely good 292 00:20:17.600 --> 00:20:20.950 at doing were uniquely great and empathizing with our perspective. 293 00:20:20.950 --> 00:20:25.950 Customers were uniquely great at creatively, coming up with ideas to 294 00:20:25.950 --> 00:20:28.930 cajole them further through the funnel to get them to become customers 295 00:20:28.940 --> 00:20:33.980 machines. They're particularly good acting at 1 to 1 level of precision 296 00:20:33.990 --> 00:20:38.140 listening and responding 24 7. Effectively auto. Updating these rules 297 00:20:38.140 --> 00:20:42.160 all the time every few minutes. And so yes, the human puts the character limit 298 00:20:42.160 --> 00:20:45.410 by saying, this is a brand safe thing. I want to put on my site machine, 299 00:20:45.410 --> 00:20:48.240 learning to do a better job than we can of figuring out what do I show to whom 300 00:20:48.250 --> 00:20:52.760 and then to your last point. You can overlay rules with the machine learning 301 00:20:52.770 --> 00:20:57.290 right, you can say these five headlines. I show them in my best customers these 302 00:20:57.290 --> 00:21:00.200 five headlines, I show them to the folks. I really don't want to talk to 303 00:21:00.200 --> 00:21:02.740 my sales team. I want them to go to Self, sir and then let the machine 304 00:21:02.740 --> 00:21:07.810 learning pick within those man. Now it's a part of the conversation that 305 00:21:07.810 --> 00:21:11.640 was really looking forward to Let's dive into machine learning. And just 306 00:21:11.640 --> 00:21:15.370 because I've always had a hesitancy with machine learning, knowing that 307 00:21:15.370 --> 00:21:18.330 like, oh, machine, I would always think that like machine learning was for the 308 00:21:18.330 --> 00:21:23.650 big guys the Amazons, the Expedia's that people with millions, hundreds of 309 00:21:23.650 --> 00:21:26.880 millions of page views that can split test. I mean, the machine could take 310 00:21:26.880 --> 00:21:30.050 over because it has so much data to play with. And maybe that's something 311 00:21:30.050 --> 00:21:34.940 I've been told, maybe incorrectly, that it takes a lot of data for machines to 312 00:21:34.940 --> 00:21:38.580 learn. But you were telling me just on this pre call that might not be the 313 00:21:38.580 --> 00:21:42.910 case. So tell me why Why doesn't it takes so much data? Or is that is that 314 00:21:42.910 --> 00:21:45.960 total misconception? Where does that misconception come out of And how much 315 00:21:45.960 --> 00:21:49.940 data does it actually take for a machine toe? Learn Uh, even in a split 316 00:21:49.940 --> 00:21:56.100 test combination where you have 150 headlines to test Dan I I think the 317 00:21:56.100 --> 00:21:59.970 question is spot on. I think we've all been trained on that. You read about 318 00:21:59.970 --> 00:22:05.240 deep learning in the press that particular approach to machine learning 319 00:22:05.240 --> 00:22:10.040 was built for Google level data to go figure out. How do you understand? You 320 00:22:10.040 --> 00:22:14.200 know things like what's in an image? And to take that approach you need that 321 00:22:14.210 --> 00:22:18.640 Amazon Expedia level of data. You can take a bunch of very experienced 322 00:22:18.650 --> 00:22:21.790 machine learning folks and create a different approach. I'm very fortunate 323 00:22:21.790 --> 00:22:25.770 to work with two co founders who were the two most senior engineers that lead 324 00:22:25.840 --> 00:22:30.360 a several 100 person team that used ML to personalize the Yahoo home page for 325 00:22:30.360 --> 00:22:33.890 more than half a decade when it was the most popular page on the Internet. That 326 00:22:33.890 --> 00:22:38.560 led to some insights on how to do this with very little data. So those 78 327 00:22:38.560 --> 00:22:43.080 million possible combinations versions of the page. We tell our customers hey, 328 00:22:43.090 --> 00:22:49.050 in every scenario using MLB faster than split testing, but a good rule of thumb 329 00:22:49.640 --> 00:22:53.730 1000 a day if you're getting 1000 a day, that's a good balance between trying 330 00:22:53.740 --> 00:22:57.830 all of your ideas at the same time and getting answers quickly. And that's 331 00:22:57.840 --> 00:23:01.520 limitations for us, mere mortal marketers, not the limitations of the M 332 00:23:01.520 --> 00:23:05.620 L. It will be faster. And how do you do that? It truly is a different approach. 333 00:23:05.630 --> 00:23:08.460 Like there, you know, 30 or 40 people in the world that are really good at 334 00:23:08.460 --> 00:23:12.660 this kind of ml. We feel very fortunate to work with a bunch of them and it, 335 00:23:12.840 --> 00:23:15.360 Yeah, I'm with you. That is a hard science problem to solve. It is 336 00:23:15.360 --> 00:23:21.510 counterintuitive, um, part of being able to solve that is actually choosing 337 00:23:21.510 --> 00:23:24.230 to solve a different problem recognizing ultimately this about money, 338 00:23:24.240 --> 00:23:26.400 right? We're trying to make more money. We're trying to drive more leads to 339 00:23:26.400 --> 00:23:30.280 sales to get more customers. We're used to split testing where you say I need a 340 00:23:30.280 --> 00:23:34.240 big pile of data. I'm gonna try to things, and I'm gonna wait until 341 00:23:34.240 --> 00:23:37.600 there's a statistically significant difference between the two of them. So 342 00:23:37.610 --> 00:23:42.520 you know more data I get to learn faster. I gotta wait if instead you say 343 00:23:42.530 --> 00:23:46.050 that's the wrong problem to solve, to make more money. I'm gonna instead, 344 00:23:46.540 --> 00:23:50.590 every few minutes trying to get better at predicting human behavior every few 345 00:23:50.590 --> 00:23:53.160 minutes, I'm gonna try to be better than I was a few minutes ago at 346 00:23:53.160 --> 00:23:57.250 predicting human behavior. If you framed the problem that way, you 347 00:23:57.250 --> 00:24:01.630 actually take a totally different approach and drive a whole lot of lift 348 00:24:01.630 --> 00:24:05.660 a whole bunch sooner because you're not making a decision forever. If you're 349 00:24:05.660 --> 00:24:09.630 making a decision forever, like with split testing, you got to get really 350 00:24:09.630 --> 00:24:13.010 good at making sure it's not the wrong answer, right you need. You use 351 00:24:13.010 --> 00:24:15.970 statistical significance for that. If instead you're saying, I just need to 352 00:24:15.970 --> 00:24:20.160 be better than it was a few minutes ago. It's a very different problem to solve, 353 00:24:20.170 --> 00:24:24.590 and that allows you to learn every step of the way. It allows you to learn off 354 00:24:24.590 --> 00:24:28.420 a whole lot less traffic because your goal again is not to be perfect to be 355 00:24:28.420 --> 00:24:32.910 better than we were a few minutes ago. The net result. You actually get 356 00:24:32.920 --> 00:24:35.750 results sooner. You make more money along the way and you personalize for 357 00:24:35.750 --> 00:24:36.460 each visitor. 358 00:24:37.740 --> 00:24:41.280 That's interesting. So essentially it's it's just making choices faster. You're 359 00:24:41.280 --> 00:24:48.630 lowering the threshold from 95 96% or whatever accuracy to a lower threshold 360 00:24:48.640 --> 00:24:51.260 in order for it to start making decisions sooner. So it's taking groups, 361 00:24:51.270 --> 00:24:55.520 maybe a little cohorts of 20 or 30 watching it being like, Okay, Based on 362 00:24:55.520 --> 00:24:58.990 just this small test, we're thinking it's gonna be more like this, which 363 00:24:58.990 --> 00:25:02.510 means it can start test ruling in different factors a lot sooner. Is that 364 00:25:02.510 --> 00:25:07.090 about right? It is very much the right mentality. It is taking small groups 365 00:25:07.100 --> 00:25:11.970 every few minutes. It's updating itself. The counter intuitive thing. Static is 366 00:25:11.970 --> 00:25:17.780 actually not the goal. It's not that it raised or lowered stat C, it said. I 367 00:25:17.780 --> 00:25:22.070 need to do I need to refine my prediction every few minutes. Static is 368 00:25:22.070 --> 00:25:26.060 important for us. To marketers. It's an important mile marker along the way to 369 00:25:26.060 --> 00:25:31.250 be able to say, Do I wanna bank this? Do I want to use this in my email 370 00:25:31.260 --> 00:25:34.170 because I learned something new? Do I want to use this in my ads? You want to 371 00:25:34.170 --> 00:25:39.190 use this in direct mail? Do I want to use this in redesigning my website. But 372 00:25:39.190 --> 00:25:43.930 for the machine learning it actually doesn't care. Its goal is not to reach 373 00:25:43.930 --> 00:25:47.430 that, say its goal is to continuously improve. And it turns out that if you 374 00:25:47.430 --> 00:25:51.130 do that, you actually reach that six sooner. So it's not that it lowered the 375 00:25:51.130 --> 00:25:55.650 bar. It solve the different problem. It's interesting. I don't quite 376 00:25:55.650 --> 00:25:59.560 understand the math behind it, but that's why I'm not a computer 377 00:25:59.560 --> 00:26:02.390 scientists dealing with these kinds of things. So I'd like to take more into 378 00:26:02.390 --> 00:26:06.560 and understand the, uh, kind of the math behind what it's doing because I'm 379 00:26:06.560 --> 00:26:09.710 still it's still using some kind of calculations in order to get the 380 00:26:09.710 --> 00:26:14.030 learning right has to use has toe. It's a computer. So it has to use some kind 381 00:26:14.030 --> 00:26:19.870 of statistical variance to know you are totally right and the differences it's 382 00:26:19.880 --> 00:26:24.330 incrementally getting better rather than like. Here's our final answer. Um, 383 00:26:24.340 --> 00:26:29.760 happily that's produced on average across all of our customers, 46% lift 384 00:26:30.140 --> 00:26:35.310 across everybody over the last two years, Looker used us to drive 44% more 385 00:26:35.310 --> 00:26:42.890 downstream. Stage two qualified leads drift 300% 322% more, sq Els tableau, 386 00:26:42.890 --> 00:26:47.870 40% more digital transactions using this approach, these air well known 387 00:26:47.870 --> 00:26:53.280 brands not only get a huge amount of traffic to be able to do that is 388 00:26:53.290 --> 00:26:58.840 enabled, in part by framing the problem differently this way. Wow. So if you're 389 00:26:58.840 --> 00:27:02.100 a small player and not one of these huge brands, how do you get started? 390 00:27:02.110 --> 00:27:05.360 What do you even know? Do you just have to wait until you're a huge brand to be 391 00:27:05.360 --> 00:27:10.460 able to test this out? It's a great question. Two parts of the answer. One. 392 00:27:11.540 --> 00:27:16.500 If you have the resources to devote to it, I humbly submit. Go do this right 393 00:27:16.500 --> 00:27:20.990 away because you get to skip learning a whole bunch about stacks, checking this 394 00:27:20.990 --> 00:27:23.330 thing every day, bugging engineering Every time you find a winner, right? 395 00:27:23.340 --> 00:27:26.720 All the things you have to do with split testing, you get to focus more 396 00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:31.570 time on empathizing with your customers and coming up with creative ideas to 397 00:27:31.580 --> 00:27:36.420 turn prospects into customers. That's great if you don't have the resources 398 00:27:36.420 --> 00:27:41.600 to go after it, then humbly submitted the way we normally think about a B M 399 00:27:41.600 --> 00:27:47.550 with rules. Great. Go give that a shot. Go try them out right if you're getting, 400 00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:51.060 if you don't have, the resource is internally or if you're getting on it 401 00:27:51.060 --> 00:27:54.530 all, making a 10 a day, right? If you're getting 10 visitors a day, data 402 00:27:54.530 --> 00:27:58.510 driven marketing will be hard. You should use your intuition. Absolutely. 403 00:27:58.520 --> 00:28:03.110 So you're recommending just sticking with rules for now and doing the split 404 00:28:03.110 --> 00:28:06.010 test, doing those kinds of things and working your way up to the point where 405 00:28:06.020 --> 00:28:08.980 you can afford some machine learning tools. But do you have any, like 406 00:28:08.980 --> 00:28:14.500 machine learning tools specifically that are maybe basic but can still show 407 00:28:14.500 --> 00:28:19.040 you the power of what machine learning to do in website personalization? I 408 00:28:19.040 --> 00:28:24.100 wish I had a better answer to that. To me, it's It is primarily around. The 409 00:28:24.100 --> 00:28:28.420 resource is you have the attention. You could give this. And if you don't have 410 00:28:28.420 --> 00:28:34.760 those or you have, like 10 a day on traffic, then I would suggest using if 411 00:28:34.760 --> 00:28:39.170 this, then that or straight split testing straight a B testing. I 412 00:28:39.540 --> 00:28:42.990 transparently don't don't have a great answer on, like what's an inexpensive 413 00:28:42.990 --> 00:28:49.960 way or T do ml. Happily, ML, when correctly applied, is a big force 414 00:28:49.960 --> 00:28:53.390 multiplier for us, right? Like none of the marketers with whom we work would 415 00:28:53.390 --> 00:28:56.860 have time to create 78 million different ideas. No, no human would. 416 00:28:57.440 --> 00:29:02.220 And most of them did not create 177 different pieces in new content. They 417 00:29:02.230 --> 00:29:05.210 were used a bunch of content they already had on their site. They tweaked 418 00:29:05.210 --> 00:29:08.490 headlines. They changed calls to action. But like a whole new case study, they 419 00:29:08.490 --> 00:29:12.050 didn't go right. They used the stuff they already had and were able to get 420 00:29:12.440 --> 00:29:17.860 Mawr bang for the buck off the investments they've already made using 421 00:29:17.860 --> 00:29:21.180 ml. And again, if you don't have the resources to go do that, you know, do 422 00:29:21.180 --> 00:29:25.360 straight split tester. Try, try rules would be my humble suggestion. 423 00:29:25.940 --> 00:29:29.970 Fantastic. And I think as you were talking to Mike, I think this is This 424 00:29:29.970 --> 00:29:33.200 is kind of a hack and maybe a shortcut way of using machine learning or using 425 00:29:33.200 --> 00:29:36.620 someone else's machine learning tool and then in a kind of applying it to a 426 00:29:36.620 --> 00:29:40.320 different setting. But I do find that it works a little bit. One thing I've 427 00:29:40.320 --> 00:29:44.300 done is take advantage of Facebook's algorithm because Facebook's really 428 00:29:44.300 --> 00:29:48.430 good at figuring out which added image combination Which text is gonna work 429 00:29:48.430 --> 00:29:53.200 now? Use not personalized. But you could still find a test. 150 literally 430 00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:57.220 150 different headlines with a bunch of different images. Go run and spend a 431 00:29:57.220 --> 00:29:59.980 couple 100 bucks on Facebook, and it'll tell you which one works better. And 432 00:29:59.980 --> 00:30:03.120 then you just go and put that on your homepage or your landing page because 433 00:30:03.120 --> 00:30:05.300 it's probably gonna be better than the ones before, even though it's in a 434 00:30:05.300 --> 00:30:10.350 different context. So it's not a true fit, but it's probably gonna be better 435 00:30:10.350 --> 00:30:16.640 than the bottom 50% of what you put out there to test Dan I that that is a 436 00:30:16.640 --> 00:30:22.400 great idea. I'm gonna share that with others. If if that's okay with you, it 437 00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:25.900 resonates a lot. It's not an accident that the thing we're talking about 438 00:30:25.900 --> 00:30:29.530 doing on websites feels a lot like what you just described in ads. Because I 439 00:30:29.530 --> 00:30:34.540 spent the last 15 years and Antec right, we it made no sense to us at all. Did 440 00:30:34.540 --> 00:30:37.580 Facebook or Google will say, Hey, give me five search Creative. I'll figure 441 00:30:37.580 --> 00:30:41.620 out the right ones to show to whom I'll show the better ones Mawr. I'll show 442 00:30:41.620 --> 00:30:45.780 the worst ones less. Nobody done that on websites. The bottom of the funnel 443 00:30:45.790 --> 00:30:50.060 where this money is actually made. Okay, so we did. And what you're talking 444 00:30:50.060 --> 00:30:54.060 about is a proxy for Hey, how do I get that research? In the end, I'm not 445 00:30:54.060 --> 00:30:57.250 gonna personalize on my site using that approach, right? I'm gonna do winner 446 00:30:57.250 --> 00:31:00.540 take all of the show, everybody the same experience. But I will learn, 447 00:31:00.550 --> 00:31:05.540 right. It's I I can to your point. You're effectively running a multi 448 00:31:05.540 --> 00:31:08.680 variant test on more traffic than you get to your website because you're 449 00:31:08.680 --> 00:31:12.640 paying for the impressions. That's it. If you're gonna run a multi variant 450 00:31:12.640 --> 00:31:16.000 test to go find a winner take all winter to put on your site, that's a 451 00:31:16.000 --> 00:31:19.740 thoughtful way to do it. At least that's what I usually tell customers 452 00:31:19.740 --> 00:31:22.420 who wanna run Facebook ads. And I'm like, Hey, don't expect a lot of 453 00:31:22.420 --> 00:31:26.040 conversions on the front and think of it as like market research, right? And 454 00:31:26.040 --> 00:31:30.810 then maybe we go get some great zero later. Great lead A great amount of 455 00:31:30.810 --> 00:31:34.890 leads later. It has been a fascinating conversation guy. If people wanna learn 456 00:31:34.890 --> 00:31:39.880 mawr about this topic of website personalization, machine learning and 457 00:31:39.880 --> 00:31:44.730 how you can apply to a B M work and they find you online and your your 458 00:31:44.730 --> 00:31:49.050 company in order to learn more you generously shared earlier in televised 459 00:31:49.050 --> 00:31:53.680 dot com. It will have a bunch of content around this. We've done a bunch 460 00:31:53.680 --> 00:31:58.950 of webinars taught. A couple, of course, is really tried. Thio talk to us as 461 00:31:58.950 --> 00:32:02.960 fellow marketers about how to get the most out of ml uh, in your marketing 462 00:32:02.960 --> 00:32:08.440 efforts and for me, I'm g y a l i f on Twitter. That's my handle. First 463 00:32:08.440 --> 00:32:11.620 initial last night, G a leaf. Look forward to continue the conversation 464 00:32:11.620 --> 00:32:15.920 there. And Dan, thank you so very, very much for having me dio Fantastic. 465 00:32:15.930 --> 00:32:20.900 Thanks again for joining me on GDP growth. I want Yeah. Are you on Lincoln? 466 00:32:20.910 --> 00:32:24.770 That's a stupid question. Of course you're on LinkedIn here. Sweet fish. 467 00:32:24.770 --> 00:32:28.820 We've gone all in on the platform. Multiple people from our team are 468 00:32:28.820 --> 00:32:33.030 creating content there. Sometimes it's a funny gift for me. Other times it's a 469 00:32:33.030 --> 00:32:36.770 micro video or a slide deck, and sometimes it's just a regular all 470 00:32:36.770 --> 00:32:40.880 status update that shares their unique point of view on B two b marketing 471 00:32:40.890 --> 00:32:44.770 leadership or their job function were posting this content through their 472 00:32:44.770 --> 00:32:50.220 personal profile, not our company page. And it would warm my heart and soul if 473 00:32:50.220 --> 00:32:54.080 you connected with each of our evangelists, will be adding Mawr down 474 00:32:54.080 --> 00:32:58.790 the road. But for now, you should connect with Bill Reed, R C O O Kelsey 475 00:32:58.790 --> 00:33:02.760 Montgomery, our creative director. Dan Sanchez, our director of audience 476 00:33:02.760 --> 00:33:07.160 growth. Logan Lyles, our director of partnerships, and me, James Carberry. 477 00:33:07.170 --> 00:33:10.910 We're having a whole lot of fun on linked in pretty much every single day 478 00:33:10.920 --> 00:33:12.860 on. We'd love for you to be a part of it.