Where's the Proof? with Cristy Garcia

WEBVTT 1 00:00:08.160 --> 00:00:16.679 Conversations from the front lines and marketing. This is be tob growth. This 2 00:00:16.879 --> 00:00:20.719 is be tob growth coming to you from just outside Austin, Texas. I'm 3 00:00:20.760 --> 00:00:25.679 your host, Benjie Block, and today joining me from Nashville, Tennessee Director 4 00:00:25.719 --> 00:00:29.800 of growth here at sweetfish, Dan Sanchez, and from Louisville, Kentucky, 5 00:00:29.879 --> 00:00:33.880 our creative content lead, Emily Brady. How's it going, guys? Going 6 00:00:33.920 --> 00:00:37.479 great, Benjie, Whoo, Whoo, I like that cheer. They're all 7 00:00:37.560 --> 00:00:43.920 right. So we are back. This is week two of us doing something 8 00:00:43.960 --> 00:00:49.159 new and bringing topics from around marketing that the three of us are paying attention 9 00:00:49.280 --> 00:00:52.359 to. There's always a lot going on. We're on Linkedin, we're reading 10 00:00:52.719 --> 00:00:57.560 books and blogs or obviously, having conversations on podcasts, and so there's so 11 00:00:57.640 --> 00:01:00.119 much content out there. We want to just have a little round table discussion. 12 00:01:00.159 --> 00:01:03.920 Emily, what are you looking at this week? Yeah, I saw 13 00:01:03.959 --> 00:01:08.079 a post from Jaakenzo on Linkedin and he said we need to fix how we 14 00:01:08.120 --> 00:01:12.959 interview executives on our shows, because a lot of times they've already been interviewed 15 00:01:14.040 --> 00:01:18.799 on several shows or they're coached in what to say. So we don't need 16 00:01:18.879 --> 00:01:23.040 to be asked the same questions they've been asked before or a question that's easy 17 00:01:23.200 --> 00:01:26.760 to come up with a canned answer. So I thought this was interesting and 18 00:01:26.799 --> 00:01:30.400 I was curious about both of your takes on it because you both post podcasts. 19 00:01:30.560 --> 00:01:36.400 So what is your approach to especially when you're interviewing executives? How do 20 00:01:36.439 --> 00:01:45.000 you get different answers? Yep, great question. So I think it's there's 21 00:01:45.000 --> 00:01:48.920 always going to be difficulty. Right, you can't all I loved some of 22 00:01:48.959 --> 00:01:52.480 what Jay was saying, specifically at the end of like surprise them with a 23 00:01:52.599 --> 00:01:57.640 question that it pulls, that something that you know they're passionate about, but 24 00:01:57.640 --> 00:01:59.959 it's maybe a little bit out of left field, so you're not going to 25 00:01:59.959 --> 00:02:02.719 get the can answer. What's hard about that is, I've found as I've 26 00:02:02.760 --> 00:02:07.200 been reaching out to lots of these people and having them on the show, 27 00:02:07.400 --> 00:02:12.000 you don't always know a lot about that person. The pre interview helps, 28 00:02:12.240 --> 00:02:16.360 but striking a chord, like finding that passionate thing that then also somehow ties 29 00:02:16.360 --> 00:02:21.879 into where you want to take it isn't always like obviously takes digging. That's 30 00:02:21.879 --> 00:02:24.520 our job as podcast sose but that's my kind of first thought. is like 31 00:02:24.639 --> 00:02:30.120 it's when someone isn't posting consistently on Linkedin and you've never met the person in 32 00:02:30.199 --> 00:02:35.719 real life. Like that's why we don't always have a unique lane. Sometimes 33 00:02:35.719 --> 00:02:38.240 it comes out later and in the show, and that's always awesome because it 34 00:02:38.240 --> 00:02:43.879 adds a human touch. But to me this is part of the art of 35 00:02:43.879 --> 00:02:47.680 podcasting, is like can we get there and continue to get better, even 36 00:02:47.680 --> 00:02:51.000 though I would say this is one of the most difficult things. Like where 37 00:02:51.000 --> 00:02:53.360 do we jump in? Like how do we actually begin? Daniette, have 38 00:02:53.439 --> 00:02:58.400 you felt that same sort of tension? Now? I actually have a counterpoint 39 00:02:58.400 --> 00:03:00.520 to what Jay said, and I think what I said is actually good for 40 00:03:00.560 --> 00:03:05.719 some shows not for others. So here's what I'm thinking. Like there's a 41 00:03:05.719 --> 00:03:09.639 show called hot ones where the host does a freaking like he's the epitome of 42 00:03:09.680 --> 00:03:13.759 asking great questions that keep people that get interviewed a lot, which is a 43 00:03:13.759 --> 00:03:17.319 lot of celebrities, right, movie stars, famous cooks like Gordon Ramsey, 44 00:03:17.360 --> 00:03:22.639 and like all the most famous people right. He interviews a wide variety of 45 00:03:22.680 --> 00:03:27.039 people that are very, I don't know, interesting to listen to. So 46 00:03:27.120 --> 00:03:30.400 he has to come up with good questions other than the Gimmick of the hot 47 00:03:30.439 --> 00:03:36.560 sauce, of the you know eat taking bites of ten increasingly hot, hotter, 48 00:03:36.840 --> 00:03:40.280 hot wings like he asked really good questions and that's what it's like. 49 00:03:40.360 --> 00:03:44.599 The the novelty of the hot sauce gets people onto the show, but it's 50 00:03:44.639 --> 00:03:47.400 the questions that keep people listening to that show because he's so good at asking 51 00:03:47.479 --> 00:03:51.680 questions. Not all shows are like that, though. If you have a 52 00:03:51.680 --> 00:03:55.879 show that's focused on a very small niche and a very particular topic, you 53 00:03:55.879 --> 00:04:00.840 could also curate it based on what you know has also already been set on 54 00:04:00.879 --> 00:04:05.000 the show and think about it more from your audiences perspective less from the audience 55 00:04:05.080 --> 00:04:09.680 of that select of the person you're having on, even if someone gets interviewed 56 00:04:09.719 --> 00:04:13.439 a lot, because if you're asking them different questions for the sake of that 57 00:04:13.479 --> 00:04:16.360 person, you're doing it for them and for their audience, which is good. 58 00:04:16.399 --> 00:04:18.600 You want to invite some of that audience onto your show, but at 59 00:04:18.639 --> 00:04:21.680 the same time, well, what about your audience? Maybe your audience hasn't 60 00:04:21.720 --> 00:04:27.279 heard that person speel yet. If you haven't as a host, then it's 61 00:04:27.399 --> 00:04:30.879 it's likely that your audience hasn't either. So you could literally run through the 62 00:04:30.879 --> 00:04:33.360 same things and it would be okay, is a great no, but at 63 00:04:33.360 --> 00:04:36.279 the same time you have to consider all your other priorities that you have gone 64 00:04:36.360 --> 00:04:40.519 on. Can you put in the five to ten hours of research of listening 65 00:04:40.600 --> 00:04:46.439 to the last three interviews they were on, going deep to the Google search 66 00:04:46.480 --> 00:04:49.360 to find blog posts they've contributed to, articles they've written to find all their 67 00:04:49.399 --> 00:04:53.959 different points of views or things you could dive in on? And one last 68 00:04:54.000 --> 00:04:57.879 thing that I'd say is that if you're also a subject matter expert in that 69 00:04:57.920 --> 00:05:00.279 topic, chances are you're going to be able to dive into the weeds in 70 00:05:00.319 --> 00:05:04.399 a way a lot of hosts don't. I've been listening to an expert recently 71 00:05:04.600 --> 00:05:09.839 across multiple topics where he is repeating the same stuff and I can tell the 72 00:05:09.879 --> 00:05:13.079 host that are talking to him when they are subject matter experts, because they're 73 00:05:13.079 --> 00:05:15.480 diving into the weeds and I'm like, Oh, this is getting good at 74 00:05:15.519 --> 00:05:17.759 getting nitty gritty because and they didn't do it because of a day amount of 75 00:05:17.759 --> 00:05:20.800 research, they just did it because they knew which questions to ask, naturally. 76 00:05:20.879 --> 00:05:24.120 So the more you're a subject matter expert, the more you're going to 77 00:05:24.160 --> 00:05:26.480 be able to dive into the weeds of what they're saying and I think that 78 00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:30.959 will cover a lot of itself. See, that's that's where I feel like 79 00:05:30.959 --> 00:05:34.759 it comes out more often, is in the follow up questions. So to 80 00:05:34.800 --> 00:05:40.720 me, like knowing exactly where to start, like because you have your consistent 81 00:05:40.839 --> 00:05:46.079 audience. They need context for who that person is and sometimes you can have 82 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:48.680 like I just don't think it's a fast, hard and fast rule. I 83 00:05:48.720 --> 00:05:53.279 think the way that, at least for me, it when I'm conducting interviews. 84 00:05:53.319 --> 00:05:58.199 You can tell where something's going and I feel like great hosts have questions 85 00:05:58.279 --> 00:06:02.480 that they want to ask and then also so consense in someone else's emotion when 86 00:06:02.600 --> 00:06:08.040 their interest is peak. So even, just an example for a BB growth 87 00:06:08.079 --> 00:06:11.360 episode, I had somebody on when I was in my research phase, right 88 00:06:11.399 --> 00:06:14.959 Dan, and I'm going back and I'm listening one of their old podcasts and 89 00:06:15.000 --> 00:06:17.680 I got to this question that that host asked this person and I was like, 90 00:06:18.199 --> 00:06:20.519 that's what they're passionate about. You can tell, you can tell that 91 00:06:20.519 --> 00:06:24.279 they want to talk about it. And then there was no follow up question. 92 00:06:24.319 --> 00:06:26.399 So I just made a note of that and when I jumped on the 93 00:06:26.399 --> 00:06:29.399 pre interview. I said, Hey, I just listened to this conversation you 94 00:06:29.399 --> 00:06:32.240 had. Are you passionate about this? Because it felt like we could have 95 00:06:32.240 --> 00:06:35.160 gone deeper on this other show that I was listening to, which you are 96 00:06:35.199 --> 00:06:38.639 great on, by the way, but do you can we make a whole 97 00:06:38.680 --> 00:06:44.079 episode on that one question? And they lit up and they like that lasted 98 00:06:44.199 --> 00:06:47.240 twenty thirty minutes of our pre interview just talking about going further down that road. 99 00:06:47.360 --> 00:06:50.439 So yeah, I don't know, emily, what are what are your 100 00:06:50.439 --> 00:06:55.240 thoughts from outside, because you're you're not hosting a show right now, but 101 00:06:55.439 --> 00:06:58.879 this post Pique your interest? Yeah, well, follow up question, because 102 00:06:58.879 --> 00:07:00.600 I feel like I'm hearing two different strategies here. Do you guys think it's 103 00:07:00.720 --> 00:07:06.480 better to research the guests extensively as much as you can and then come with 104 00:07:06.560 --> 00:07:13.199 customized questions, or to just have really unique questions to begin with that you 105 00:07:13.240 --> 00:07:16.279 ask every single person? That's kind of why podcasting is great. It's like 106 00:07:16.319 --> 00:07:19.240 we all have our own unique flavor. So, like, I love what 107 00:07:19.319 --> 00:07:24.360 Jay's saying, but I wouldn't apply it to every episode. I do like 108 00:07:24.399 --> 00:07:28.720 sometimes I'll use that strategy because I know this is good. Like they're already 109 00:07:28.759 --> 00:07:31.839 a good conversationalist taking more into account, whereas, like, if I asked 110 00:07:31.920 --> 00:07:36.279 an off the wall question to somebody that's more buttoned up, that could throw 111 00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:43.800 the whole interview like you got to have strong emotional intelligence to do podcasting well, 112 00:07:43.879 --> 00:07:46.680 because some people literally send me back when I send them the questions. 113 00:07:46.680 --> 00:07:49.519 They send me back like a script of what they want to talk about, 114 00:07:49.519 --> 00:07:53.600 and then it's my job to ask good follow up questions that will still make 115 00:07:53.600 --> 00:07:57.240 it seem human, but that helps them that they wrote that much. Other 116 00:07:57.319 --> 00:08:01.920 conversations it's like the exact opposite. If I send them too many questions, 117 00:08:01.959 --> 00:08:07.600 they're like, I thought this was conversational. So it's more about emotional intelligence. 118 00:08:07.639 --> 00:08:11.000 To me, that makes you a good host and knowing how that person 119 00:08:11.040 --> 00:08:16.319 gets comfortable. Then it is about going hard and fast rule. Every single 120 00:08:16.399 --> 00:08:20.399 time I do a podcast I have this wildly unique question I ask my guests 121 00:08:22.279 --> 00:08:26.839 that I don't know that the hard and fast rule works right. This maybe 122 00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:30.240 is a more of a question for you, Benjie, but when you're researching 123 00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:33.559 your guest, if, let's say, you can't find anything on Linkedin, 124 00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:37.480 they're not active there, where do you dig? What other platforms do you 125 00:08:37.519 --> 00:08:41.120 dig for those passions that they have or topics that they want to talk all 126 00:08:41.159 --> 00:08:46.720 aside from actually talking to them? Well, so, because it's like specifically 127 00:08:46.960 --> 00:08:52.600 a marketing podcast, and I'm talking like CMOS primarily, or directors of marketing 128 00:08:52.679 --> 00:08:56.080 right here on BB Growth Eur. Audience knows that welcome to be to be 129 00:08:56.159 --> 00:09:00.559 growth. So I think the way my brain thinks about it is like anything 130 00:09:00.600 --> 00:09:05.840 that is on their website is content that they've created has some sort of purview 131 00:09:05.879 --> 00:09:09.320 of the person I'm probably talking to. So like I could just bring up 132 00:09:09.559 --> 00:09:13.600 recent blog posts, I can just look at recent things that they've been working 133 00:09:13.639 --> 00:09:16.799 on. Sometimes I'll look at especially because we're kind of just finishing quarter one 134 00:09:16.879 --> 00:09:20.039 or where. I guess we're in quarter to now, but I was looking 135 00:09:20.080 --> 00:09:24.440 at like last year's reviews to see highlight moments and things like that, just 136 00:09:24.480 --> 00:09:30.120 so there's some sort of level of intelligence on what their world looks like, 137 00:09:30.360 --> 00:09:33.960 even if it's not specific to the person the company more broadly, like if 138 00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:37.639 they're that high up, they are there thinking about that stuff all the time, 139 00:09:37.879 --> 00:09:41.960 like it's their life. So that's a good way. And then also 140 00:09:41.000 --> 00:09:45.200 I try to check platforms that aren't linkedin like I look up. I looked 141 00:09:45.200 --> 00:09:50.799 them up on instagram or facebook, just things that are more human to see 142 00:09:50.799 --> 00:09:54.639 what their passions are outside, because I've had pre interviews that go really long 143 00:09:54.679 --> 00:09:58.000 because we end up talking about running because they see that I have like my 144 00:09:58.039 --> 00:10:01.879 marathon bib behind me, or I've talked about Africa a lot because I grew 145 00:10:01.960 --> 00:10:05.120 up overseas, so that'll come up sometimes and we just get a good back 146 00:10:05.159 --> 00:10:09.840 and forth going that way. Dan, do you think there's value in starting 147 00:10:09.919 --> 00:10:13.200 the episode by asking their background, or do you just jump right into it? 148 00:10:13.360 --> 00:10:16.440 I've done it both ways and sometimes I don't know both both can be 149 00:10:16.480 --> 00:10:20.600 really good. Sometimes not knowing what exactly what you're going to be talking about 150 00:10:20.679 --> 00:10:24.320 leads to really good content. Those episodes tend to run long, though, 151 00:10:24.360 --> 00:10:28.480 like Joe Rogan does it, but he goes for three hours because he has 152 00:10:28.519 --> 00:10:31.840 to give it the time to unpack for lack of preparation on the front end. 153 00:10:31.879 --> 00:10:35.200 He has to do long interviews, but that's his style and it's worked 154 00:10:35.200 --> 00:10:37.960 for him. I honestly feel like there's so many avenues to win and you 155 00:10:39.000 --> 00:10:41.279 have to think about it as far as like, okay, if I think 156 00:10:41.279 --> 00:10:46.840 what Jay's reacting to is that so many people do it without preparation for executives 157 00:10:46.960 --> 00:10:52.519 that it would be a huge differentiating factor if a show did, especially if 158 00:10:52.559 --> 00:10:56.919 they were executives that were really popular, like the CMO of gone, who 159 00:10:56.919 --> 00:11:01.399 interviews a lot. So if you're interviewing executives like that all the time and 160 00:11:01.440 --> 00:11:03.759 that's like the main type of audience you or type of guests you have on 161 00:11:03.759 --> 00:11:09.240 your show, then you could be he have a huge differentiating factor by being 162 00:11:09.240 --> 00:11:11.159 the kind of show that prepares a lot with good questions. But if the 163 00:11:11.200 --> 00:11:15.159 market was the other way then you could just do the Joe Rogan thing and 164 00:11:15.159 --> 00:11:16.759 go off the cuff and it would give a whole different angle. There's so 165 00:11:16.759 --> 00:11:20.960 many different ways to win and it's nice to know what the options are so 166 00:11:20.000 --> 00:11:24.279 you can kind of use them to kind of figure out where the less crowded 167 00:11:24.320 --> 00:11:30.759 spaces I got to say, because we have a lot of marketers listening to 168 00:11:30.840 --> 00:11:35.000 this show right now. If you are a cmo or you are someone that 169 00:11:35.120 --> 00:11:39.519 is on other shows often, just think about the fact that a can response 170 00:11:39.720 --> 00:11:43.440 might not be your best thing, even if you get the same questions recurringly, 171 00:11:43.519 --> 00:11:46.399 like don't can your answer all the time. You can also like play 172 00:11:46.480 --> 00:11:52.000 with the host right by allowing there to be a good back and forth. 173 00:11:52.159 --> 00:11:54.600 So I don't want to just talk to like the podcast hosts because we might 174 00:11:54.639 --> 00:11:56.799 have a smaller audience. Of that here on be to be growth, but 175 00:11:56.879 --> 00:12:01.840 for those that are interacting with the shows or even as you think of your 176 00:12:01.919 --> 00:12:05.720 marketing strategy, it's great to know what you do, but there's a human 177 00:12:05.720 --> 00:12:11.240 element to like being able to explain it in a way that's not so canned, 178 00:12:11.399 --> 00:12:16.120 that you actually can showcase that you're passionate about it and the why behind 179 00:12:16.200 --> 00:12:18.960 it. So I think this is a really fun conversation. Emily, anything 180 00:12:20.039 --> 00:12:22.720 you want to throw in here at the end before we sort of wrap this 181 00:12:22.799 --> 00:12:26.360 up and send it to the interview? I think I'm good. I think 182 00:12:26.360 --> 00:12:28.519 I'm ready to start a podcast you guys, after this. Let's go. 183 00:12:30.600 --> 00:12:35.840 We need an Emily Brady podcast. Yeah, this has been a great conversation 184 00:12:35.919 --> 00:12:39.039 and sexually you made me realize that there's a whole nother factor that you can 185 00:12:39.120 --> 00:12:41.279 use a differentiated podcast. Is something that I hadn't considered before, but I'm 186 00:12:41.279 --> 00:12:45.639 like, Dang, there are lots of ways that win here. So even 187 00:12:45.679 --> 00:12:48.360 just walking away from this conversation, I'm like, all right, another tool 188 00:12:48.360 --> 00:12:52.320 in the tool bell in order to recommend a customers or just people out there 189 00:12:52.360 --> 00:12:56.440 on Linkedin, or now I'm by GIBI growth. Lots of ways to win. 190 00:12:56.480 --> 00:13:00.600 I like that. Well, we would love to hear your thoughts. 191 00:13:00.919 --> 00:13:05.919 You can dm all of us over on Linkedin interact with the content we're putting 192 00:13:05.919 --> 00:13:09.759 out over there, or you can find me on instagram. I was just 193 00:13:09.799 --> 00:13:13.799 advocating for finding people on other platforms, but that's somewhere else that I'm pretty 194 00:13:13.799 --> 00:13:16.440 active, and I know emily is over on ticktock all the time. So 195 00:13:16.919 --> 00:13:20.120 feel free to reach out any time to any of the three of us. 196 00:13:20.159 --> 00:13:24.559 All right, so we are on to today's conversation. It's an interview that 197 00:13:24.600 --> 00:13:30.960 I did with Christy Ebert Garcia. She's the chief marketing officer at IMPACTCOM. 198 00:13:30.960 --> 00:13:35.919 This conversation is one on the importance of measurement in our marketing efforts. I 199 00:13:35.919 --> 00:13:39.480 know you'll enjoy it, so check this out. Welcome back to be to 200 00:13:39.559 --> 00:13:43.360 be growth. I'm your host, Benjie Block, and today we are joined 201 00:13:43.440 --> 00:13:50.200 by Christy Ebert Garcia. She is the CM at impactcom. Christy, welcome 202 00:13:50.440 --> 00:13:52.759 into be to be growth UNJEE. Thank you, it's so great to be 203 00:13:52.799 --> 00:13:56.480 here. Thanks for having me on the show. It's great to have you 204 00:13:56.559 --> 00:14:01.679 here and a congratulations is in order because just a couple months back you became 205 00:14:03.080 --> 00:14:07.840 the CMO at impact. So congratulations there. Thanks. Very exciting for sure, 206 00:14:07.879 --> 00:14:11.559 and we would definitely want to tap into the wealth of wisdom that you 207 00:14:11.639 --> 00:14:18.639 have. So let's start here, though. You have this career in marketing 208 00:14:18.679 --> 00:14:22.240 and I just want to know what's been your baby, your favorite part, 209 00:14:22.360 --> 00:14:26.200 something that distinctly sort of stands out from your career so far in marketing. 210 00:14:26.279 --> 00:14:31.240 That's hard because there's so many things. I'll say that I've never wanted to 211 00:14:31.240 --> 00:14:35.000 be anything else besides a CMO. That's all I've ever wanted, and so 212 00:14:35.120 --> 00:14:39.360 I love I love marketing. I'm a lifelong learner. I study it, 213 00:14:39.360 --> 00:14:43.000 it's my hobby, it's my passion and I'm really glad too, I've been 214 00:14:43.000 --> 00:14:48.399 given the opportunity by impactcom to take this next, next step. But for 215 00:14:48.440 --> 00:14:52.759 me, I'd say if I had to nail down to like one particular thing, 216 00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:58.840 it would be watching the members of my team become leaders on team. 217 00:14:58.879 --> 00:15:03.000 So when we start it. Four years ago at this company we had seven 218 00:15:03.000 --> 00:15:07.840 marketers and now we have sixty. So some of the marketers that we've hired 219 00:15:07.879 --> 00:15:11.600 have had to take on a lot more responsibility and, you know, take 220 00:15:11.639 --> 00:15:15.759 on their own teams and sometimes most of them are first time managers, and 221 00:15:15.919 --> 00:15:18.320 I can't tell you how ourwarding it is to see the work that they're doing 222 00:15:18.360 --> 00:15:22.960 and just the confidence that they've been able to kind of build and just makes 223 00:15:22.960 --> 00:15:24.720 me really proud. So I think that's my yeah, it's always fun to 224 00:15:24.759 --> 00:15:30.000 watch that development. Right, for sure, definitely. Okay, so I 225 00:15:30.039 --> 00:15:33.759 want to I mean, there's so much in marketing we could talk about right. 226 00:15:33.799 --> 00:15:37.799 There's a lot of good but there's also some pretty consistent tensions and I 227 00:15:37.840 --> 00:15:43.000 want to talk about that a bit here. One of the tensions we definitely 228 00:15:43.039 --> 00:15:46.080 feel as how do we prove the value that we're adding, and this is 229 00:15:46.120 --> 00:15:50.600 talked about in the be tob space scroll linkedin. We're talking about it. 230 00:15:50.679 --> 00:15:56.080 How have you personally kind of experience that tension throughout your career? It's a 231 00:15:56.080 --> 00:16:00.000 good question to have. So proving performance as a marketer is a lot easier 232 00:16:00.039 --> 00:16:03.639 than it used to be, and that's largely thanks to the attribution tools that 233 00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:07.000 have come out and pretty much everything is trackable, which is which is cool, 234 00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:10.279 but it's still a challenge and I think one way to overcome that, 235 00:16:10.360 --> 00:16:14.960 and it's also my favorite way of holding myself another's accountable, is really simple. 236 00:16:15.080 --> 00:16:18.240 Say what you're going to do, do it and then share the results, 237 00:16:18.240 --> 00:16:21.559 even if they aren't what you had hoped for, especially if they aren't 238 00:16:21.559 --> 00:16:25.039 what you would hope for, and in that way it's important to set expectations 239 00:16:25.039 --> 00:16:29.279 with your leadership team and your manager of what you'll accomplish and you build trust 240 00:16:29.279 --> 00:16:32.200 by saying this didn't work the way that we wanted it too, but here's 241 00:16:32.200 --> 00:16:34.320 what we learned and and so we're going to try it again right. Only 242 00:16:34.360 --> 00:16:41.080 highlighting the good stuff or being defensive about missteps or blaming others is the number 243 00:16:41.159 --> 00:16:45.840 one way to fail and I've seen CMOS make it time time and time again. 244 00:16:45.919 --> 00:16:48.799 But you really should have goals for all of the campaigns that you're running 245 00:16:48.840 --> 00:16:55.080 and then be able to show numbers and looking at things lower funnel like pipeline 246 00:16:55.159 --> 00:16:57.919 opportunities, creation, let's say, and revenue. It's not hard to do 247 00:16:59.039 --> 00:17:02.279 and it really keeps the team focused on you know the right behaviors in the 248 00:17:02.360 --> 00:17:07.240 right results. So that's that's sort of how we take it in here at 249 00:17:07.279 --> 00:17:11.880 impactcom. Yeah, I think it's one thing to say we gotta tie revenue 250 00:17:11.920 --> 00:17:15.519 to our marketing efforts, but it's sort of another thing to put a plan 251 00:17:15.640 --> 00:17:21.319 in place that executes on that. You haven't always maybe been a part of 252 00:17:21.359 --> 00:17:25.640 marketing teams that just excel right at measuring Roy. You're right, the tools 253 00:17:25.640 --> 00:17:30.839 are coming and they're better than ever, but measuring Roy, having proof of 254 00:17:30.839 --> 00:17:34.519 how valuable you are, very important. When did this light bulb sort of 255 00:17:34.599 --> 00:17:38.720 go off in your head, and I wonder if there was like a distinct 256 00:17:38.759 --> 00:17:41.400 moment or if it's just been over time, or maybe it's the way you've 257 00:17:41.400 --> 00:17:45.359 always been wired. I don't know. Now I don't think I'm naturally wired 258 00:17:45.440 --> 00:17:49.160 that way, but I'd say from the very beginning I knew it was important. 259 00:17:49.200 --> 00:17:52.599 So my first job in marketing and when I first joined, I watched 260 00:17:52.759 --> 00:17:57.079 some sales leaders at that company Complain About Marketing, saying that, you know, 261 00:17:57.200 --> 00:18:00.720 the team wasn't doing a lot or you know, the were' driving leads 262 00:18:00.799 --> 00:18:03.920 or my boss at the time wanted us to list out everything we had done 263 00:18:03.920 --> 00:18:07.200 so that he could then, you know, share it with, I guess, 264 00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:10.480 his leaders in the sales team. But really what it what it was 265 00:18:10.480 --> 00:18:14.359 was it became a laundry list of these tasks, but it didn't answer the 266 00:18:14.440 --> 00:18:17.640 so what questions. Like you wrote a piece of content like so what. 267 00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:19.200 What did you do with it? What did you see from it? We 268 00:18:19.200 --> 00:18:23.240 didn't have those answers and and so it caused frictions. But from then on 269 00:18:23.279 --> 00:18:27.440 I realized it's not about the number of items and tasks, it's the impact 270 00:18:27.519 --> 00:18:33.480 from those items. In the biggest impact in every organization is incremental revenue. 271 00:18:33.519 --> 00:18:36.599 So marketing should be driving it and should be able to report on that outcome. 272 00:18:36.720 --> 00:18:40.240 Otherwise it's just, you know, so what. So that's really how 273 00:18:40.279 --> 00:18:42.119 I think about it. We're gonna have a lot of people in our audience 274 00:18:42.200 --> 00:18:47.880 that are going, I have heard the so what so many times. So 275 00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:52.279 you're you're talking to a choir right now in some ways. But okay. 276 00:18:52.319 --> 00:18:57.720 So you experience that and now you're you're passionate about making sure that we measure. 277 00:18:57.799 --> 00:19:03.119 So I wonder if we're just going, how does Christy measure? What 278 00:19:03.160 --> 00:19:04.559 would you say to that, like what are the things that matter to you. 279 00:19:04.880 --> 00:19:07.200 So the first thing is the you know, whenever you're measuring anything, 280 00:19:07.240 --> 00:19:11.920 you need to benchmark against yourself. Like the the easy thing to do is 281 00:19:11.920 --> 00:19:14.839 say what is it? What's an average open rate or what's an average CAC? 282 00:19:15.559 --> 00:19:18.240 There's really no such thing in every industry and every company, every audience 283 00:19:18.279 --> 00:19:22.720 type, it's different, and so comparing yourself against other companies, I think 284 00:19:22.720 --> 00:19:26.079 it's important to know. You know, probably, but it's really important to 285 00:19:26.119 --> 00:19:30.039 look at your own history of campaign. So each channel has its own on 286 00:19:30.119 --> 00:19:33.000 set of metrics, and so what we do is we benchmark performance against ourselves. 287 00:19:33.079 --> 00:19:36.839 We say things like pay search. Okay, let's say we expect a 288 00:19:36.920 --> 00:19:40.680 minimum of one dollar and two dollars out and so if that channel isn't producing 289 00:19:40.720 --> 00:19:44.359 that, then we know something's wrong. We're looking at email opens and click 290 00:19:44.400 --> 00:19:48.759 grades and paid social performance and direct buys, and these are all measured against 291 00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:52.759 past campaigns like month over month, quarter, reporter year, every year, 292 00:19:52.000 --> 00:19:55.960 and so that way we know how many leads were going to be expecting from 293 00:19:55.960 --> 00:19:57.400 those channels and what we need, you know, and then how to get 294 00:19:57.480 --> 00:20:02.599 them. But it's important to not be over confident in your media mix or 295 00:20:02.680 --> 00:20:06.079 start to get, like, really complacent, because new channels and marketing strategies 296 00:20:06.119 --> 00:20:11.480 are created all the time and technology makes that possible, and so you really 297 00:20:11.519 --> 00:20:14.279 just need to see on your toes and spend a lot of time researching a 298 00:20:14.359 --> 00:20:17.200 new path to conversion, because your mix today is going to look a lot 299 00:20:17.240 --> 00:20:19.720 different than your mix six months from today and you need to stay on it 300 00:20:19.720 --> 00:20:23.079 if you want to be successful. The other thing that I am lucky, 301 00:20:23.119 --> 00:20:27.920 I'm very fortunate at this company to have a dedicated OPS team, marketing ops, 302 00:20:29.359 --> 00:20:32.079 and so they keep me updated. There's not a day in the week 303 00:20:32.119 --> 00:20:36.160 that I don't know what channels are driving pipeline and what what which ones aren't, 304 00:20:36.480 --> 00:20:38.519 and that's really important for all marketing leaders to know. But you know, 305 00:20:38.640 --> 00:20:41.640 some of us have dedicated people for that and other others don't. They 306 00:20:41.640 --> 00:20:45.160 have to do it themselves. So it's easy for me to say that. 307 00:20:45.920 --> 00:20:49.839 Yeah, I think it's so interesting because you were talking about like six months 308 00:20:49.920 --> 00:20:52.799 from today, how much things will change. But also, when we look 309 00:20:52.799 --> 00:20:57.359 back, before we were really tracking or knew what how, a lot there 310 00:20:57.400 --> 00:21:02.279 wasn't as much conversation around attribut you should models, and also there's a lot 311 00:21:02.319 --> 00:21:06.519 of research out now that talks about that on average takes bake what eight touch 312 00:21:06.640 --> 00:21:10.079 points. So there's a lot right. There's a lot of time and a 313 00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:12.799 lot of effort, a lot of different content pieces. How, when you're 314 00:21:12.799 --> 00:21:15.680 thinking of these things that you're tracking, how do you how does that maybe 315 00:21:15.720 --> 00:21:22.799 factor into your attribution model? Well, there are definitely eight different touch points 316 00:21:22.799 --> 00:21:26.319 and that's been fairly consistent when you're looking at our touch points. But I'd 317 00:21:26.359 --> 00:21:32.599 say track everything you can. The ultimate measure of performances are pipeline and closed 318 00:21:32.599 --> 00:21:34.720 one revenue. So in order to see that, we need to look at 319 00:21:34.759 --> 00:21:38.920 things like mql's as leading indicators. It could take a full year before a 320 00:21:38.960 --> 00:21:45.880 deal is closed and be to be especially with some complex sales processes. So 321 00:21:45.000 --> 00:21:48.000 we need to assume that not everything is going to be visible right away. 322 00:21:48.039 --> 00:21:51.519 It's not like you press a button in the next day you see exactly what 323 00:21:51.559 --> 00:21:55.759 happens. Some some of these different campaigns, and especially in B to be 324 00:21:55.920 --> 00:21:57.920 like, they take they take some time. So whatever you decide to measure, 325 00:21:57.960 --> 00:22:02.319 just measure it consistently and use your own performance as benchmark, like I 326 00:22:02.359 --> 00:22:04.960 said, but you also need to accept the fact that not everything is measurable. 327 00:22:04.960 --> 00:22:07.960 There's some things we want to do because it's is common sense right or 328 00:22:07.960 --> 00:22:11.160 based on experience, and we can't prove a direct line to revenue. So 329 00:22:11.319 --> 00:22:15.960 dark social will be a good example of this. Public Relations, big speaking 330 00:22:15.960 --> 00:22:18.319 opportunities, brand campaigns. You know, people are seeing you on stage, 331 00:22:18.319 --> 00:22:23.160 they're seeing your logo and they're going to remember that somehow sometime, but you're 332 00:22:23.200 --> 00:22:26.559 never going to be able to tie it back exactly to that particular incident. 333 00:22:26.880 --> 00:22:30.000 So you have to be wherever your consumer is right and so you need to 334 00:22:30.039 --> 00:22:33.200 be all over those places, given how many touch points. But like, 335 00:22:33.279 --> 00:22:38.319 will I know that one of our prospects is searching gt for reviews and that 336 00:22:38.359 --> 00:22:41.680 they say they saw the reviews and then they came and converted on the site, 337 00:22:41.680 --> 00:22:45.160 like you know? Absolutely not, like you're never going to know that. 338 00:22:45.319 --> 00:22:48.359 But do we still invest time and budget on optimizing our GT listing and 339 00:22:48.400 --> 00:22:52.279 page? Like? Sure, because we know that consumers are looking at review 340 00:22:52.319 --> 00:22:56.000 sites and the same is true for social media and other other media. So 341 00:22:56.400 --> 00:23:00.799 it's really just about using common sense, drawing from your experience and looking at 342 00:23:00.839 --> 00:23:03.720 past performance. Is there anything that you feel like, when you look at 343 00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:07.440 what we measure when you were you mean knowing that you're talking to a room 344 00:23:07.440 --> 00:23:11.319 full of marketers right now. Do you think there's something that we need to 345 00:23:11.400 --> 00:23:15.799 kind of quit doing in our marketing measurement? I would say the vanity metrics 346 00:23:15.839 --> 00:23:21.880 are are sort of you know, I don't see those being really concrete like 347 00:23:21.920 --> 00:23:26.039 standards are indicators of performance. So I've never been a big let's look at 348 00:23:26.079 --> 00:23:29.720 the impressions and sort of just make assumptions based on the fact that we had 349 00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:33.279 a million views on something like it's I like the moving to outcomes type of 350 00:23:33.279 --> 00:23:37.559 model where you're looking at like the acquisition, the conversion, and so I 351 00:23:37.559 --> 00:23:41.960 try to see on money and channels that can provide that for me versus like 352 00:23:41.160 --> 00:23:45.240 maybe display or, you know, even some for targeting, where you just 353 00:23:45.319 --> 00:23:48.680 you're never going to get that satisfaction of knowing someone actually clicked. But you 354 00:23:48.680 --> 00:23:52.920 know, not to discredit those channels at all, but we you need to 355 00:23:52.920 --> 00:23:56.599 partner with your sales team, I think mostly, and yeah, especially for 356 00:23:56.720 --> 00:24:00.640 the big targeted like account base marketing campaigns. They may not answer a phone 357 00:24:00.640 --> 00:24:04.880 call but they'll open an email or vice versa. So I don't know if 358 00:24:04.880 --> 00:24:08.319 that answers the question. But no, I definitely does. It definitely does. 359 00:24:10.039 --> 00:24:14.160 So I one thing that I think there's a breakdown in is the way 360 00:24:14.200 --> 00:24:18.200 that marketing maybe talks to other departments about what they're doing. That was a 361 00:24:18.200 --> 00:24:21.960 problem in your story earlier, right when you started to realize this. Oh 362 00:24:22.039 --> 00:24:26.720 we have this list and so what? Let's talk about these two different groups. 363 00:24:26.799 --> 00:24:29.960 Right. So there's how we communicate with sales and then there's also how 364 00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:34.920 marketing communicates with the C suite when we're thinking about our attribution and all of 365 00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:38.920 this. In your current organization you're blessed with a great relationship. I know 366 00:24:38.960 --> 00:24:45.039 from previous conversation with you you guys get along really well, but talk me 367 00:24:45.200 --> 00:24:49.759 through a little bit of what that relationship like looks like and your guys conversations 368 00:24:49.799 --> 00:24:53.799 around attribution. Maybe we can glean some things, learn some things from that. 369 00:24:53.880 --> 00:24:59.039 Yeah, so I would say the conversations with the sales team and with 370 00:24:59.079 --> 00:25:03.519 my marketing team and with the executive team are different. So for my marketing 371 00:25:03.519 --> 00:25:06.599 team, like will go deep, right. We'll say, okay, let's 372 00:25:06.599 --> 00:25:11.119 test the color of this cartoon person's hair on paid social to see if we 373 00:25:11.160 --> 00:25:15.440 get better engagement if the hair color is brown. I mean that level of 374 00:25:15.440 --> 00:25:18.839 detail, AB testing, and all marketers do this right. It's not something 375 00:25:18.839 --> 00:25:22.400 that so in all that time talking about, because who cares? Again, 376 00:25:22.519 --> 00:25:26.559 so what? But I do. But you're talking to a marketer. That's 377 00:25:26.599 --> 00:25:30.400 a type of insights that you need right as a market doesn't necessarily mean your 378 00:25:30.400 --> 00:25:33.119 sales team needs at or the executive team needs to hear it. So it's 379 00:25:33.160 --> 00:25:37.599 really understanding your audience, which is real number one of marketing. But when 380 00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:41.599 I'm talking to the other executives in my company, we're looking at numbers. 381 00:25:41.640 --> 00:25:45.519 I mean we're talking about lessons learned, we're talking about kind of things that 382 00:25:45.519 --> 00:25:48.720 we're excited about, what challenges exist, how can we overcome those challenges? 383 00:25:48.759 --> 00:25:51.720 And then, at the end of the day, like let's look at the 384 00:25:51.759 --> 00:25:55.920 retront on investment of the team. And so without sales there would be no 385 00:25:55.960 --> 00:25:59.920 return on investment. Like there is no unless it's an audit, you know, 386 00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:03.440 an online sign up or something like. Marketing is not in Asilo. 387 00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:07.880 But you're working with your teams, whether that's a Bedr or ae or, 388 00:26:07.920 --> 00:26:11.279 you know, at sales leaders, you're you need to be working together and 389 00:26:11.319 --> 00:26:14.119 so ensuring that they have what they need. The sales team has what they 390 00:26:14.160 --> 00:26:18.480 need from the marketing team and that there's a feedback loop is critical to being 391 00:26:18.519 --> 00:26:22.240 successful. But they're all slightly different conversations and their nuance conversations. Let's go 392 00:26:22.279 --> 00:26:26.039 with the slightly different between sales and maybe a C suite, like is there 393 00:26:26.039 --> 00:26:30.000 anything in particular there that you've noticed, because it is slightly different audiences, 394 00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:34.200 but we're all still kind of generally want in sales and c suite or paying 395 00:26:34.240 --> 00:26:37.880 attention to the bottom line and and the money. But I wonder if there's 396 00:26:37.920 --> 00:26:41.799 any other nuances that you've become aware of. Yeah, I mean I think 397 00:26:41.839 --> 00:26:48.079 the executive team sometimes can put marketing in to the sales bucket, like they 398 00:26:48.079 --> 00:26:51.960 may think costs of sales and market any team it's typically like a combined line 399 00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:56.119 item on your balance sheet. But marketing sales are so different, and so 400 00:26:56.279 --> 00:26:59.519 it's if you're talking to executives who don't have a marketing background her maybe we're 401 00:26:59.519 --> 00:27:02.799 sales peop like they might have a completely different view of what marketing does. 402 00:27:02.839 --> 00:27:04.640 Then what you know? Somebody with a marketing background would know. So I 403 00:27:04.640 --> 00:27:08.359 would say when I'm having conversations with the sales team. We can. We 404 00:27:08.400 --> 00:27:12.960 can say, okay, let's basically coordinate touch points, like there's this big 405 00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:17.079 campaign going out, you're going to get a notification from sales force when this 406 00:27:17.160 --> 00:27:19.920 happens and here's your response and we we've written up all these flows for you, 407 00:27:19.920 --> 00:27:25.400 guys, and objection handling and everything's being tracked by sales force and Marquetto 408 00:27:25.480 --> 00:27:29.640 and visible and and so it's definitely a lot more tactical. Some people, 409 00:27:29.720 --> 00:27:30.880 the executives, love to hear the details. Don't get me wrong. I 410 00:27:30.880 --> 00:27:36.720 mean we're I'm lucky to have founders that care very deeply about marketing, but 411 00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:40.440 there's so much going on at any given time in a marketing org of any 412 00:27:40.440 --> 00:27:45.599 company that it would be impossible to have those granular conversations about every project or 413 00:27:45.640 --> 00:27:49.519 campaign that you're working on. So save those for your team. Yep, 414 00:27:49.599 --> 00:27:55.440 Yep. One thing I find talking specifically with CMOS is that they often are 415 00:27:55.519 --> 00:28:00.279 the one in marketing that got whether it's promoted or the reason that they are 416 00:28:00.319 --> 00:28:06.799 there is because they're good at tying numbers to what they're doing. And then 417 00:28:06.839 --> 00:28:10.839 you have other marketers who maybe they have aspirations of building a career in a 418 00:28:10.920 --> 00:28:12.880 maybe even moving into a position like that, but that mindset shift, it's 419 00:28:12.880 --> 00:28:15.640 like they're more focus on what you're talking about earlier, like the hair color 420 00:28:15.680 --> 00:28:19.400 or the person in that is, and it showing them kind of like the 421 00:28:19.400 --> 00:28:25.200 whole picture, getting them interested in the numbers. It can be like a 422 00:28:25.240 --> 00:28:29.240 more difficult kind of thing. I wonder how you've specifically in your career seen 423 00:28:29.359 --> 00:28:33.000 the benefit it's of like moving into this model win, I'm going to be 424 00:28:33.000 --> 00:28:36.759 able to prove our value. I'm going to go into the numbers and like 425 00:28:36.960 --> 00:28:40.960 show what we're doing overall for the growth of this company. Yeah, no, 426 00:28:41.160 --> 00:28:44.119 I think marketing is one of those roles that everyone thinks that they can 427 00:28:44.160 --> 00:28:48.640 do because everyone can come up with a great idea. Like there's there's some 428 00:28:48.720 --> 00:28:51.440 really you know, you get a bunch of people in a room like what 429 00:28:51.480 --> 00:28:52.839 do you think we should do for this advertisement? Like you're going to get 430 00:28:52.839 --> 00:28:56.279 some really cool ideas from people that aren't on the marketing team. Or I 431 00:28:56.279 --> 00:28:59.519 saw this at my old company. You know, there's a lot of that. 432 00:28:59.599 --> 00:29:03.559 But what makes marketers good is consistency. Like we have one hit wonders 433 00:29:03.559 --> 00:29:06.880 in the marketing world, right. I mean we have people that do a 434 00:29:06.880 --> 00:29:10.599 great campaign or advertising agencies to do a great campaign and then they sort of 435 00:29:10.599 --> 00:29:12.279 just disappear, a fall off the mountain and they can't repeat it. And 436 00:29:12.319 --> 00:29:18.440 so I like the small winds and being able to tie them to consistent performance 437 00:29:18.480 --> 00:29:22.440 over time, and that's what every investor is looking for. Like what's repeatable 438 00:29:22.440 --> 00:29:26.519 about this model? I can go to my executive team and say, here's 439 00:29:26.519 --> 00:29:30.480 what's repeatable about my model, like we're pulling from information and tracking that we've 440 00:29:30.480 --> 00:29:33.839 had over the course of two years or three years or whatever, and I 441 00:29:33.880 --> 00:29:37.599 can tell you that if we do Xy, is going to happen at a 442 00:29:37.640 --> 00:29:41.160 high level. Right, there's always, you know, kind of things that 443 00:29:41.240 --> 00:29:45.759 come up and you don't know everything, but you should be able to have 444 00:29:45.839 --> 00:29:48.839 a good sense of what you can do and it should be repeatable and scalable. 445 00:29:49.480 --> 00:29:52.119 You know, every every now and then I have a great idea and 446 00:29:52.119 --> 00:29:55.880 I my team does and we say, okay, let's try it for this 447 00:29:55.920 --> 00:30:00.519 campaign and we realize it only works because it's bespoke and and that's great for 448 00:30:00.559 --> 00:30:03.640 your high value contacts, right. It's great for the CMOS that you're trying 449 00:30:03.640 --> 00:30:06.680 to reach, let's say, selling into, like they're probably not going to 450 00:30:06.680 --> 00:30:08.160 click on your ads, and so you have to come up with something really 451 00:30:08.200 --> 00:30:11.960 creative. But it's highly manual and that's okay, but if that's all you're 452 00:30:12.000 --> 00:30:17.160 doing, you're going to have a hard time proving value. And the same 453 00:30:17.200 --> 00:30:21.079 if only you're doing this evergreen, always on marketing approach, the numbers go 454 00:30:21.160 --> 00:30:22.359 up and now and that's just that's just life. You know you're going to 455 00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:26.960 have an off month, like maybe something got stuck in paid searched and you 456 00:30:26.000 --> 00:30:30.279 know a campaign got shut off, or maybe you know some news item happen 457 00:30:30.319 --> 00:30:34.160 and people aren't paying attention right now to what you're selling, and that's great. 458 00:30:34.200 --> 00:30:38.039 That's why you need that. You know that history of performance and that's 459 00:30:38.039 --> 00:30:41.200 what says the great mercury part. I love the words you use, their 460 00:30:41.240 --> 00:30:48.079 consistency, small winds, repeatable, scalable. I think that's definitely where the 461 00:30:48.079 --> 00:30:53.559 conversation should be. Not always does, isn't always where it is. Anything 462 00:30:53.599 --> 00:30:59.359 that you would say to let's say, hypothetically, I'm a director of marketing 463 00:30:59.400 --> 00:31:02.920 and I'm getting maybe some heat from the sea sweet because they want to see 464 00:31:03.000 --> 00:31:06.839 proof of value. So we use these words right, consistency or small winds 465 00:31:06.880 --> 00:31:11.079 repeatable and if someone's going okay, I got to prove value, they're going 466 00:31:11.119 --> 00:31:14.440 Christy. Where should I start or what should I be tracking immediately? Like 467 00:31:14.519 --> 00:31:18.279 what's that in road? Yeah, so it's like if you fail, the 468 00:31:18.359 --> 00:31:22.960 plan you you're going to you should plan to fail. Like there's Yo, 469 00:31:22.160 --> 00:31:26.400 there's not anything that you should be doing that doesn't have some sort of expected 470 00:31:26.480 --> 00:31:30.400 outcome. Remember when we were in elementary school, maybe we had signed projects 471 00:31:30.400 --> 00:31:33.359 and we've always had to write our hypothesis of what was going to happen right 472 00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:36.680 at the same is true for every campaign that you launch. You should have 473 00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:41.200 what the goal is like, even if it's a small thing, because otherwise, 474 00:31:41.200 --> 00:31:41.799 how do you know if you're doing a good job? How do you 475 00:31:41.799 --> 00:31:45.519 know if you hit that goal? So I would say if you're not doing 476 00:31:45.519 --> 00:31:48.440 those things, start doing them, especially to this hypothetical director of marketing, 477 00:31:48.480 --> 00:31:53.119 like before you launch anything, especially when you're spending money, you should have 478 00:31:53.799 --> 00:31:57.279 some form of forecasting of what's going to happen. How do you start? 479 00:31:57.279 --> 00:32:01.119 Well, you need to get some great tracking software or you need to make 480 00:32:01.160 --> 00:32:06.519 sure that you have others in the company like that you're working with that can 481 00:32:06.559 --> 00:32:09.200 speak to the success of the campaign, like working directly with your sales team, 482 00:32:09.279 --> 00:32:13.160 like understanding what it is that they need. Let them be the advocate 483 00:32:13.279 --> 00:32:15.000 for you. You know, I think you know, marketers don't have to 484 00:32:15.039 --> 00:32:17.119 run up and say, you know, look what I did, like put 485 00:32:17.160 --> 00:32:21.480 this on the refrigerator with a magnet, like you know. It's much better 486 00:32:21.519 --> 00:32:25.519 to have those third parties kind of come and say this was a really great 487 00:32:25.519 --> 00:32:29.759 team effort from marketing, and that's to me is I'll take that win any 488 00:32:29.839 --> 00:32:34.200 day the week. HMM. Was We start to wrap up here. I 489 00:32:34.240 --> 00:32:37.920 love again, I think the last few minutes here specifically, I'm going I 490 00:32:37.400 --> 00:32:44.839 we definitely the consistency pieces what makes great marketers stand out amongst just like good 491 00:32:44.880 --> 00:32:47.680 markers, because a lot of people do have that story. They could tell 492 00:32:47.720 --> 00:32:52.359 you about the one campaign they ran that one time. So I love that 493 00:32:52.400 --> 00:32:55.000 you pointed that out. As people walk away from this episode, maybe, 494 00:32:55.119 --> 00:32:59.519 well, I usually jog, so I'm imagining someone running and they're listening to 495 00:32:59.519 --> 00:33:02.480 this and as they're finishing up listening to US talk today. Chrissy, anything 496 00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:07.920 you want to leave us with as far as final thoughts around our attribution model, 497 00:33:07.960 --> 00:33:12.440 things that we're tracking maybe it's a start stop. Any final thoughts here 498 00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:15.680 before we close out today? I well, I would say there's never been 499 00:33:15.680 --> 00:33:19.400 a better time to be a marketer. Ever. Ever, this is and 500 00:33:19.640 --> 00:33:22.279 it's only going to get better. I think marketing has rightfully earned our seat 501 00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:24.960 at the table. It's no longer view to be this. You know, 502 00:33:25.359 --> 00:33:30.279 a marketer is this creative genius who's kind of like out here and dresses in 503 00:33:30.279 --> 00:33:34.519 Hawaiian tshirts and, you know, write a motorcycle that you like see in 504 00:33:34.559 --> 00:33:37.279 the movies and stuff like. That's not reality. It's, you know, 505 00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:43.119 people who, yes, creativity helps, but you can train yourself to be 506 00:33:43.160 --> 00:33:46.559 a good marketer, like you can, and there's so many resources out there 507 00:33:46.640 --> 00:33:52.000 right now where you can get educated on on what's going on and in the 508 00:33:52.000 --> 00:33:53.519 space and like you know what some of the new things are. There's free 509 00:33:53.559 --> 00:33:59.160 courses right to become a marketer. It's it's a really wonderful time to be 510 00:33:59.240 --> 00:34:01.960 to be here, and so I'm grateful that I landed in this, this 511 00:34:02.039 --> 00:34:07.319 field. That's it's all I've ever wanted and I I can't express how much 512 00:34:07.359 --> 00:34:09.239 I love it. I was talking to the CFO the other day and I 513 00:34:09.280 --> 00:34:13.360 was like. Is it weird that I don't have a lot of hobbies like 514 00:34:13.360 --> 00:34:15.960 like if I'm not if I'm not working, I'm sort of like studying and 515 00:34:16.000 --> 00:34:20.239 I just love it. But it's important to be a lifelong learner in marketing 516 00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:22.079 and and you will. You will be successful. You just got to keep 517 00:34:22.079 --> 00:34:25.599 out it. It's good leaving us with some hope today. I appreciate that 518 00:34:25.639 --> 00:34:30.159 too. Let's jump here as we wrap up. Talk to us a little 519 00:34:30.159 --> 00:34:35.480 bit about impactcom, and then also, where can people stay connected with you 520 00:34:35.519 --> 00:34:39.159 and the work that you're doing? Sure so. Impactcom is a the leading 521 00:34:39.199 --> 00:34:47.119 partnership management platform. We help businesses grow revenue through partnerships. So partnerships mean 522 00:34:47.119 --> 00:34:52.840 influencers, other businesses, affiliates, referral marketing is what you know. Some 523 00:34:52.840 --> 00:34:58.480 people have called it in the past, but it's not just one thing. 524 00:34:58.519 --> 00:35:05.599 It's leveraging other people who have maybe an insight or a particular audience or some 525 00:35:05.679 --> 00:35:09.280 talent or software integration or something that you know you can use to benefit your 526 00:35:09.320 --> 00:35:14.920 business, giving them something in return, largely and mostly a commission, although 527 00:35:14.960 --> 00:35:19.440 sometimes product is what the incentive is. In the influencer space. I know 528 00:35:19.480 --> 00:35:22.239 a lot of brands will send product and kind of ask for them to to 529 00:35:22.400 --> 00:35:27.960 review them. But authenticity plays a huge role and so so finding a good 530 00:35:28.000 --> 00:35:30.519 partner that can refer you business and and that you can do something for them 531 00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:35.480 and it's a right fit. That's sort of what we're trying to drive education 532 00:35:35.519 --> 00:35:38.079 and awareness around. You can find partners in our market place, you can 533 00:35:38.079 --> 00:35:43.239 contract with them, you can recruit them into your program you start tracking, 534 00:35:43.320 --> 00:35:47.199 doing all the measurement, paying them. Everything can be done through impactcom and 535 00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:51.119 we work with some of the greatest brands in the entire world. So I 536 00:35:51.119 --> 00:35:53.840 feel like I'm very lucky to have this job and the company is a fantastic 537 00:35:53.880 --> 00:35:59.719 place, but we're definitely checking along here. Partnerships have exploded over the past 538 00:35:59.760 --> 00:36:01.320 couple of years, I think, largely due to, I believe that e 539 00:36:01.440 --> 00:36:07.760 commerce exploding right so anyone who's driving sales for e commerce is also doing pretty 540 00:36:07.760 --> 00:36:10.760 well these days. HMM, Christy, how can people connect with you as 541 00:36:10.840 --> 00:36:15.840 Linkedin best or what would you say there? It is so I'm I have 542 00:36:15.880 --> 00:36:21.079 a weird Christine name. There's no age. It's Cristi Christy Garcia. You 543 00:36:21.079 --> 00:36:23.920 can find me on Linkedin and yeah, I'd love to connect with any marketers 544 00:36:23.960 --> 00:36:28.079 who want to have a conversation. Appreciate you stopping by B Tob Growth. 545 00:36:28.079 --> 00:36:30.320 This has been a really fun conversation than spend. I really appreciate it. 546 00:36:30.440 --> 00:36:37.360 Thank you for all of our listeners who are tuned in today. I appreciate 547 00:36:37.400 --> 00:36:43.440 you listening. We hope that these conversations help fuel your growth, help continue 548 00:36:43.480 --> 00:36:46.119 to make you more innovative in the work that you're doing. Don't miss an 549 00:36:46.119 --> 00:36:49.920 episode. If you have yet to subscribe to the show, do that on 550 00:36:49.920 --> 00:36:53.199 whatever podcast player is your favorite. You can connect with me as well over 551 00:36:53.320 --> 00:36:57.559 on Linkedin. Just Search Benjie Block. I'm talking about business, marketing in 552 00:36:57.559 --> 00:37:00.119 life over there and would love to connect with you. Keep doing work that 553 00:37:00.159 --> 00:37:05.360 matters and will be back real soon with another episode. Christie, thanks again 554 00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:20.159 for being here. Be Tob growth is brought to you by the team at 555 00:37:20.159 --> 00:37:22.320 sweet fish media. Here at sweet fish, we produce podcast for some of 556 00:37:22.360 --> 00:37:27.400 the most innovative brands in the world and we help them turn those podcasts into 557 00:37:27.480 --> 00:37:30.719 Microvideos, linkedin content, blog posts and more. We're on a mission to 558 00:37:30.719 --> 00:37:40.039 produce every leader's favorite show. Want more information, visit Sweet Fish Mediacom