#CX 27: Creating Delight to Keep Customers for Life w/ Jordan Olivero

WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.040 --> 00:00:04.960 Big customers to try to use a personal touch. Cost touch from the moments 2 00:00:05.120 --> 00:00:08.990 really matter. Just like in marketing, one of them our bets become very 3 00:00:09.189 --> 00:00:13.630 sois as you know, but still has our our vs. we know all 4 00:00:13.669 --> 00:00:19.350 want to see that as a message. A relationship with the right referral partner 5 00:00:19.469 --> 00:00:23.420 could be a game changer for any BEDB company. So what if you could 6 00:00:23.460 --> 00:00:29.500 reverse engineer these relationships at a moment's notice, start a podcast, invite potential 7 00:00:29.620 --> 00:00:34.579 referral partners to be guests on your show and grow your referral network faster than 8 00:00:34.740 --> 00:00:44.490 ever? Learn more at sweet fish Mediacom. You're listening to BB growth, 9 00:00:44.890 --> 00:00:49.570 a daily podcast for B TOB leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard before, 10 00:00:49.729 --> 00:00:53.399 like Gary vanner truck and Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard from 11 00:00:53.479 --> 00:00:57.560 the majority of our guests. That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't with 12 00:00:57.759 --> 00:01:02.479 professional speakers and authors. Most of our guests are in the trenches leading sales 13 00:01:02.479 --> 00:01:07.310 and marketing teams. They're implementing strategy, they're experimenting with tactics, they're building 14 00:01:07.390 --> 00:01:11.510 the fastest growing BB companies in the world. My name is James Carberry. 15 00:01:11.590 --> 00:01:15.109 I'm the founder of sweet fish media, a podcast agency for BB brands, 16 00:01:15.230 --> 00:01:18.390 and I'm also one of the CO hosts of this show. When we're not 17 00:01:18.469 --> 00:01:22.379 interviewing sales and marketing leaders, you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of our 18 00:01:22.420 --> 00:01:26.219 own business. Will share the ups and downs of our journey as we attend 19 00:01:26.340 --> 00:01:30.340 and to take over the world. Just getting well, maybe let's get into 20 00:01:30.379 --> 00:01:41.969 the show. Reducing time to first value, increasing perceived value, doing things 21 00:01:42.090 --> 00:01:47.090 that don't scale, scaling, personalization, these are just some of the topics 22 00:01:47.129 --> 00:01:51.480 that we take on in a very practical episode of the Bab Growth Show. 23 00:01:51.799 --> 00:01:55.680 My name is Ethan Butte. This episode is in the CX series here on 24 00:01:55.760 --> 00:01:59.920 the show and our guest is Jordan Olivero. He's got great tips about things 25 00:01:59.959 --> 00:02:05.790 that he's doing with video, with his executive team, managing handoffs from the 26 00:02:05.829 --> 00:02:08.430 sales team and a lot more. As I said, it's very practical and 27 00:02:08.469 --> 00:02:15.110 I hope you enjoy it. Welcome back to the customer experience podcast. We're 28 00:02:15.150 --> 00:02:17.819 talking about the power of moments, doing things that don't scale. You know 29 00:02:17.860 --> 00:02:22.819 they don't scale but you do them anyway, about gift Ology, about being 30 00:02:22.860 --> 00:02:27.460 your own PR firm inside Your Company for you and your team. I've got 31 00:02:27.500 --> 00:02:30.449 a gentleman here who's the director of customer success at Swim Lane. He was 32 00:02:30.490 --> 00:02:35.849 a customer success in business consultant adviser for years. He spent a dozen years 33 00:02:35.849 --> 00:02:40.050 at IBM and depart is the senior manager of customer success, Jordan Olivero. 34 00:02:40.210 --> 00:02:46.800 Welcome to the customer experience podcast. Thank you's thrill to be with you today. 35 00:02:46.919 --> 00:02:50.199 Thanks for having me. Yeah, we, some of our team members, 36 00:02:50.280 --> 00:02:53.400 met up with you up in Denver at a customer success meet up to 37 00:02:53.439 --> 00:02:55.280 your right, up the road from us. That's right. To borrow it. 38 00:02:57.319 --> 00:03:00.870 You came highly recommended. I'm excited for this conversation and I want to 39 00:03:00.909 --> 00:03:05.030 start where we always start, which is defining customer experience. I argue that 40 00:03:05.110 --> 00:03:08.430 it's the single most important thing our companies produce and deliver, but I think 41 00:03:08.469 --> 00:03:12.789 it has a variety of definitions. How do you look at customer experience? 42 00:03:13.900 --> 00:03:17.740 Well, I think the customer experiences a combination of different impressions that we give 43 00:03:17.900 --> 00:03:23.300 to a customer by delivering on our brand promise. I think it's a a 44 00:03:23.580 --> 00:03:29.770 function of customers success. Other function being and customer outcomes, desired outcomes that 45 00:03:29.969 --> 00:03:34.569 intended the customer headed and purchasing the software, the product serves, and so 46 00:03:35.169 --> 00:03:39.090 yeah, customer experience is crucial and we when done very well. I compliments 47 00:03:39.169 --> 00:03:44.080 those outcomes and drives the retention expansion that covers. Looking forward to that. 48 00:03:44.599 --> 00:03:46.319 That's awesome. I love the you touched on brand. That's another way that 49 00:03:46.639 --> 00:03:50.879 that we've talked about here on the show before, brand being this kind of 50 00:03:50.960 --> 00:03:55.229 holistic, all encompassing thing that everyone is ultimately responsible for. You say that 51 00:03:55.389 --> 00:04:00.069 customer experience is a function of CS. Where does brand sit for you as 52 00:04:00.069 --> 00:04:03.629 at a marketing function? Branded us is a marketing function. If Our promise, 53 00:04:03.789 --> 00:04:09.870 from how we decision ourselves relative to our competitors, is one of customer 54 00:04:09.949 --> 00:04:14.699 Beas in the scene and excellence and service and that high personal touch, then 55 00:04:14.780 --> 00:04:17.420 we need to deliver on that kind of promise. We won't schedule and automate 56 00:04:17.459 --> 00:04:21.819 every touch points. Will likely have a touch points that are not stillable, 57 00:04:21.860 --> 00:04:28.050 that are highly personal so we can humanize that. That awesome. I look 58 00:04:28.089 --> 00:04:30.250 forward to following up on doing things that don't scale, because it's one of 59 00:04:30.250 --> 00:04:32.730 those things. I think a lot of people see it on paper they're like, 60 00:04:32.850 --> 00:04:35.170 cannot do it. We can't do that. That won't skills. I'm 61 00:04:35.209 --> 00:04:38.839 looking for to that. But before we go get too much deeper, just 62 00:04:39.000 --> 00:04:43.279 for context of the people can understand where coming from as you share your experiencing 63 00:04:43.319 --> 00:04:46.759 your expertise. Tell us a little bit about Swim Ling. What is that 64 00:04:46.800 --> 00:04:48.959 all about? How is your team? How are you doing there? What's 65 00:04:48.959 --> 00:04:55.110 swimbling all about? Yes, it's all about the analysts who are overwhelmed with 66 00:04:55.269 --> 00:05:00.110 the number of alders they're getting. The kind of work analysis does is often 67 00:05:00.149 --> 00:05:05.550 very administrative and quite Monday. So swimmling does is removes that lending task from 68 00:05:06.300 --> 00:05:11.060 Beus, burdens some of their day today and it gives them that times they're 69 00:05:11.060 --> 00:05:15.420 highly productive so that they can work on or interesting, complex, complex kinds 70 00:05:15.459 --> 00:05:21.769 of so really, I'm sorry, is a platform of that does an automation 71 00:05:21.930 --> 00:05:27.209 and orchestration, so leading some of that pressures to there. It's good. 72 00:05:27.250 --> 00:05:30.050 It sounds like another thing that we've had on the show before, which is 73 00:05:30.250 --> 00:05:33.810 this finding that that new healthy balance between humans and machines, letting the machines 74 00:05:33.930 --> 00:05:38.120 do the thing that machines are good at and letting humans do the do the 75 00:05:38.199 --> 00:05:43.759 complex and interesting analytical work. So love that. What types of the analysts 76 00:05:43.800 --> 00:05:45.879 are we talking about? Like, who are you? Know, if you 77 00:05:45.959 --> 00:05:48.240 were to describe two or three of your ideal customers, who are these people? 78 00:05:48.959 --> 00:05:55.110 I deal customers tend to these security operation centers which are responsible for protecting 79 00:05:55.149 --> 00:06:00.550 the brand that they work for. In some cases there's MSSP's out there who 80 00:06:00.750 --> 00:06:04.939 are managed security service priors who will protect other brands, but they'll do it 81 00:06:05.139 --> 00:06:10.060 as a service. Those are the kinds of organizations with the kinds of groove 82 00:06:10.100 --> 00:06:14.180 or departments that need to be highly productive, because there's a talent shortage out 83 00:06:14.180 --> 00:06:17.379 there today. There's just not enough people that are capable to handle the kind 84 00:06:17.420 --> 00:06:23.329 of volume from all these all these attacks by the offense. So we're helping 85 00:06:23.410 --> 00:06:29.009 the defense protect these brands and these and tees organizations or government agencies, and 86 00:06:29.490 --> 00:06:31.920 we're just making them over of the so it's women boom. Love it and 87 00:06:31.959 --> 00:06:34.120 I love the name. It reminds I was a high school swimmer. So 88 00:06:34.160 --> 00:06:40.480 it's like a swim lane markers and watching the black line on the bottom of 89 00:06:40.480 --> 00:06:43.360 the pools. You try to keep moving forward. So good. So we 90 00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:46.879 had a really great conversation before we hit record and so I want to I 91 00:06:46.920 --> 00:06:48.470 want to get into some of the things that we only drove by really quickly 92 00:06:48.829 --> 00:06:55.189 around this this idea of customer experience and being everyone's responsibility, but see us 93 00:06:55.189 --> 00:06:58.550 having a special role in that. One of the books that really inspired you 94 00:06:58.709 --> 00:07:01.379 that we just chatted about briefly was from chip and Dan Heath, who are 95 00:07:01.379 --> 00:07:08.819 kind of in that vein of business psychology research based, popular and approachable, 96 00:07:08.860 --> 00:07:12.500 highly functional. I think of like Dan pay think in that same zone. 97 00:07:12.699 --> 00:07:15.699 Talk a little bit about the power of moments and how that comes into play 98 00:07:15.769 --> 00:07:18.170 for you. I read the power of moments a year ago and it really 99 00:07:18.250 --> 00:07:24.089 transformed the way I looked at the customer journey and I like the research because 100 00:07:24.209 --> 00:07:29.810 they broke down the kinds of things that are all are common across any memorable, 101 00:07:29.930 --> 00:07:32.920 lasting impressions that we have, the things that you may have done in 102 00:07:33.040 --> 00:07:39.480 college. You still talk about things that happen in your childhood likely didn't happen 103 00:07:39.519 --> 00:07:42.879 by accident, happened by a design. So how we do the same sort 104 00:07:42.879 --> 00:07:47.189 of things in our customer experience and these these moments that are powerful or memorable 105 00:07:47.189 --> 00:07:55.230 or lasting for customers often have three common traces of their types of moments. 106 00:07:55.310 --> 00:07:59.620 That are really important. There's the tits in that and that experience, that 107 00:07:59.660 --> 00:08:03.300 journey. There's a peace in the journey and there's a transition beginning and the 108 00:08:03.420 --> 00:08:07.660 end. Those are the places where you have an opportunity to make a moment 109 00:08:07.699 --> 00:08:11.980 that really last the customer. So we've, as a swim laing as a 110 00:08:11.100 --> 00:08:16.810 team, looked across the customer journey. We started with right at the decision 111 00:08:16.850 --> 00:08:22.370 points to buy swim were up until they made decisions to renew or expand or 112 00:08:22.529 --> 00:08:26.639 their their working business with us, with at the cross the gap where all 113 00:08:26.639 --> 00:08:31.959 the touchpoints and where we who owns that touch at this moment in time? 114 00:08:31.360 --> 00:08:35.919 How can we avoid those pits? First, make things a little more, 115 00:08:37.000 --> 00:08:41.950 a little more pleasant, reducing the friction produced customer of the team and just 116 00:08:41.070 --> 00:08:45.190 reduce that effort that they have to spend and dealing with us. How can 117 00:08:45.269 --> 00:08:48.789 be easy to deal with? And I can go on and on a value 118 00:08:48.789 --> 00:08:52.350 of these transitions. I can getting more examples if you like those. Yeah, 119 00:08:52.389 --> 00:08:54.629 that'd be great. You know, it sounds like you've mapped the entire 120 00:08:54.750 --> 00:08:58.700 customer journey. So a how did that project go? How many people were 121 00:08:58.740 --> 00:09:01.460 involved? Where did you start? And then be. How did you identify 122 00:09:01.620 --> 00:09:05.899 kind of the peaks in the pits and are you designing? Are you creating 123 00:09:05.980 --> 00:09:11.090 specific moments kind of tie everything you started with their just tied together a little 124 00:09:11.129 --> 00:09:16.330 bit tighter, and maybe start with like who took this on mapping the customer 125 00:09:16.370 --> 00:09:18.809 journey, because it's obviously a big deal. I think a lot of people 126 00:09:18.889 --> 00:09:20.490 think they have sight into it, but it sounds like you really mapped it 127 00:09:20.970 --> 00:09:24.440 at some level of detail. We didn't have any detail. I got to 128 00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:28.919 be honest. Okay, my first one dios as they had one. It 129 00:09:28.039 --> 00:09:31.440 didn't. Yes, we got in a white board. I got what we're 130 00:09:31.480 --> 00:09:33.480 in a room rous some teams inside. They started white boarding what we thought 131 00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:37.399 that journey look like and that just that just brought a lot of a lot 132 00:09:37.440 --> 00:09:41.509 of conversations with the table. We got clarity around them. Who's going to 133 00:09:41.590 --> 00:09:43.629 own with product? Part of the process? We identifies that. Sorry, 134 00:09:43.870 --> 00:09:48.470 is this a cross functional team or is this the CS team? Well, 135 00:09:48.590 --> 00:09:52.139 the CUSC the made up of Professionals Rovers support as cus. This is a 136 00:09:52.419 --> 00:09:58.940 call of sex as a parent organization of the CEO. Now that groove has 137 00:09:58.059 --> 00:10:01.220 it well and chains. The last sixty seven months I've been here. We've 138 00:10:01.220 --> 00:10:05.659 brought in marketing, the sales of the conversation station, first looking at the 139 00:10:05.700 --> 00:10:11.289 kickoff, the kickoff being a beginning and an opportunity to said that tone and 140 00:10:11.330 --> 00:10:13.889 that pays with the customer and we talked about, okay, what we do 141 00:10:15.009 --> 00:10:18.649 to the light that customer for the end of that call so that they feel 142 00:10:18.970 --> 00:10:22.679 like they're in good hands, they're not going to be left out to drive. 143 00:10:22.120 --> 00:10:26.320 So we did is asked the CEO to record a video to use the 144 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:30.960 cell bow and some instances when he's on the road, traveling, or some 145 00:10:31.039 --> 00:10:33.559 of the dose he's on the office, and he just made it with thirty 146 00:10:33.600 --> 00:10:37.470 second, forty five second video, personalizing it to the the customer, using 147 00:10:37.509 --> 00:10:43.070 their names, maybe referencing the view specific parts of the deal that were important, 148 00:10:43.429 --> 00:10:48.070 and then and then pressed up said it's me. We included it inside 149 00:10:48.110 --> 00:10:50.700 of that kickoff call we did with the customer and the close of that call 150 00:10:50.860 --> 00:10:56.500 it was often you'd find all the customers nine their heads, smiling and and 151 00:10:56.620 --> 00:11:00.539 getting the good sense of this company swimling. That's humanize this part of the 152 00:11:00.580 --> 00:11:05.370 process and and I trust that's excellent. I mean that is a powerful moment 153 00:11:05.490 --> 00:11:09.850 for people. So CEO records truly personal video to make sure that every kickoff 154 00:11:09.970 --> 00:11:15.250 call ends with this feeling that this company cares about me. That's right, 155 00:11:15.529 --> 00:11:18.559 it's great. So talk again about peaks and pits. So it seems like 156 00:11:18.679 --> 00:11:22.240 maybe you felt like there wasn't enough positive momentum coming out of that kickoff call. 157 00:11:22.320 --> 00:11:26.320 So we found a way to address it with a cross functional team. 158 00:11:26.879 --> 00:11:30.080 Talk about some other peaks and pits that you identified. In maybe one or 159 00:11:30.080 --> 00:11:33.389 two samples of how you resolve those, what comes to mind is hit in 160 00:11:33.470 --> 00:11:39.429 the implementation process. So we will give the specific these sails around how long 161 00:11:39.470 --> 00:11:43.149 it takes to that with Swim Ling. But it was obvious to me that 162 00:11:43.509 --> 00:11:46.220 if we could reduce the time the first value, we would, in the 163 00:11:46.299 --> 00:11:54.340 customer's mind, increase the perceive the value and realize value and during their contract 164 00:11:54.419 --> 00:11:58.419 with us. So we looked at measuring first time the first value, and 165 00:11:58.539 --> 00:12:01.529 that's okay. What can we do to decrease this this time to get there 166 00:12:01.769 --> 00:12:07.529 where parts were contributing and anxiety, where people have to surge to find an 167 00:12:07.529 --> 00:12:09.649 answer to the question when they ask me, why is it taking so long 168 00:12:09.730 --> 00:12:13.929 to get up and running? That's a red and black. We need to 169 00:12:13.970 --> 00:12:16.000 do something about that and as a team, want to look at ways to 170 00:12:16.480 --> 00:12:22.720 reduce that time. And what is for your customers? What is first value, 171 00:12:22.840 --> 00:12:26.639 and do you have any tips on for people who are listening that that 172 00:12:26.840 --> 00:12:31.590 might not be highly conscious of first value? So, for us at bombomb 173 00:12:31.070 --> 00:12:35.350 our first value is getting that first video sent and getting that first reply back. 174 00:12:35.470 --> 00:12:39.710 Right. We want that Aha moment where someone says and succine thing you're 175 00:12:39.750 --> 00:12:41.590 creating on your kickoff calls is this, oh my gosh, this is a 176 00:12:41.629 --> 00:12:46.580 different way to communicate, and so it's important. I think it's super important, 177 00:12:46.620 --> 00:12:48.740 not just for cus but for everybody, recognize what first value is. 178 00:12:50.059 --> 00:12:52.820 Just a conversation alone is healthy. How did you all arrive at yours? 179 00:12:54.340 --> 00:12:56.379 Yeah, we discussing around that. Is it the hum moment that matters, 180 00:12:56.419 --> 00:13:01.809 or is it full value or is it half value? It's not that important 181 00:13:01.970 --> 00:13:03.690 where you land there, as long as you're starting to measure. He's leading 182 00:13:03.809 --> 00:13:09.250 and lagging indicators and asking the customers always a good idea to what's your goal 183 00:13:09.370 --> 00:13:11.370 and when do you think we're going to get there? And ask them, 184 00:13:11.570 --> 00:13:15.759 you know, the wind question to how how we know we've arrived. So 185 00:13:15.960 --> 00:13:18.519 we'd like to look at is are we truly delivering value? That means a 186 00:13:18.600 --> 00:13:24.519 swim lane is up and running in production, with data ingested, integrations, 187 00:13:24.600 --> 00:13:30.350 done, work close created and is contributing through true automation, right and reducing 188 00:13:30.389 --> 00:13:35.149 some of that work that was once. That's good implied right there. Actually 189 00:13:35.350 --> 00:13:37.029 he said it. Maybe it's explicit, it's not implied. Is that? 190 00:13:37.470 --> 00:13:41.980 Having this clear agreement with the customers super important, like what is value to 191 00:13:43.059 --> 00:13:46.179 you? And let's make sure that we're both on the same page, so 192 00:13:46.259 --> 00:13:48.299 I don't assume one thing and you assume another. I think you're in great 193 00:13:48.379 --> 00:13:52.940 shape and you're extremely disappointed. We have you know, we go on without 194 00:13:52.980 --> 00:13:56.009 being clear about that. That's where we start and I could off call. 195 00:13:56.409 --> 00:14:01.009 I jump on. Why did you buy swim lane? And I may have 196 00:14:01.210 --> 00:14:03.649 heard it from the cellar. In fact, I do this transition with the 197 00:14:03.690 --> 00:14:07.610 sales came to understand the reasons why they've lost one when I want to hear 198 00:14:07.809 --> 00:14:11.440 not just from not but I wanted them to say in front of there. 199 00:14:11.559 --> 00:14:18.399 Brought our team to so the entire team of this enterprise account understands what direction 200 00:14:18.480 --> 00:14:22.240 we're heading toward at a big picture of all. If from that managed woint 201 00:14:22.360 --> 00:14:26.110 really beat me. We design everything else around achieveing that and we go back 202 00:14:26.190 --> 00:14:30.190 to it later and we say, you mentioned fact six months ago. We 203 00:14:30.230 --> 00:14:33.190 wanted to keep this. We have fantastic what's next? Right, and that's 204 00:14:33.190 --> 00:14:37.590 the conversation. Is Not too hard. It's reading civil block and tackling, 205 00:14:37.070 --> 00:14:41.460 just clarifying the objectives and then being clear about that plan to get there but 206 00:14:41.620 --> 00:14:46.500 not overwhelming them, and then then delivering up. That's great. Talk about 207 00:14:46.700 --> 00:14:50.059 the handoff there. You just kind of talked about a little bit of a 208 00:14:50.220 --> 00:14:54.370 sales to see US handoff. The salesperson is already told me what in their 209 00:14:54.409 --> 00:14:58.690 own language and in their own perception what the customer needs and wants. So 210 00:14:58.009 --> 00:15:01.129 you're managing that handoff. What are some other handoffs that he mapped out and 211 00:15:01.850 --> 00:15:07.840 which ones were particularly right for improvement? This is a big one. The 212 00:15:07.000 --> 00:15:13.000 sales to the customer success is often filled with tension and I understand why. 213 00:15:13.039 --> 00:15:18.519 If I have I'm not going to speak. I heardly to speak from experience, 214 00:15:18.840 --> 00:15:22.909 there are times where I don't give the benefit of the doubt that the 215 00:15:22.990 --> 00:15:26.990 person's going to treat this customer the way that I think they should beat. 216 00:15:28.470 --> 00:15:31.870 Are they going to deliver? And they probably seals makes the same thing about 217 00:15:33.110 --> 00:15:35.940 customer success. Well, they deliver on this. I put my brand as 218 00:15:35.940 --> 00:15:39.659 state, my personal grand a staying for this customer, brought them in. 219 00:15:39.460 --> 00:15:43.299 Come on, guys, you got to deliver. That question is there and 220 00:15:43.860 --> 00:15:48.139 and attention is good, because we all are after the same struggle that I 221 00:15:48.460 --> 00:15:52.409 had initially was I wanted to be the hero, and so I didn't pay 222 00:15:52.529 --> 00:15:58.090 enough attention to this. It's why I shift into an abundance mindset and and 223 00:15:58.210 --> 00:16:03.929 with that abundance mindset, I partnered with sales to enable them to be successful. 224 00:16:03.049 --> 00:16:06.960 In turn, I was too, and started by asking the question, 225 00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:10.840 what is it that you need to see us to to feel really confident that 226 00:16:11.320 --> 00:16:15.240 that you can hand over the customer to us, and then just delivering on 227 00:16:15.360 --> 00:16:18.549 that. And it's a time taste time every time to time, and IDM 228 00:16:19.029 --> 00:16:22.710 took a little bit of time here, but we're in a great places. 229 00:16:22.429 --> 00:16:26.990 I love it's such a healthy way to approach relationships, not just externally with 230 00:16:27.110 --> 00:16:32.190 customers, but internally as well with your teammates, because you're really talking about 231 00:16:32.190 --> 00:16:34.620 a mindset shift their right. I mean an abundance find set is just a 232 00:16:36.059 --> 00:16:37.820 change in the way you look at those. Everything else is happening the same. 233 00:16:37.899 --> 00:16:41.259 You just do it differently in the outcomes are dramatically different. Right. 234 00:16:41.659 --> 00:16:45.899 We design the process so that the customers the hero. I were trying to 235 00:16:45.899 --> 00:16:49.129 tell story, and where they're guide and we want them to be the hero. 236 00:16:49.370 --> 00:16:53.129 It's now we're just shifting to the times we guide to God along their 237 00:16:53.169 --> 00:16:56.769 journey and which is really in transfer of Druss. So we just try to 238 00:16:57.649 --> 00:17:02.840 work with each other so that there's this this handoff where the customer isn't feel 239 00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:06.680 like they're repeating the same thing two different people of swim when we want to 240 00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:10.920 be able to communicate them with the communicate understanding, and that ways there. 241 00:17:11.240 --> 00:17:15.430 It's great. Talk to me now about some of the things that don't scale. 242 00:17:15.430 --> 00:17:19.390 I don't imagine. They're probably turning on five hundred the new accounts a 243 00:17:19.390 --> 00:17:23.230 day and so the CEO needs to make five hundred videos a day. That's 244 00:17:23.269 --> 00:17:27.390 that's one that can probably scale to a point. Talk about some other things 245 00:17:27.470 --> 00:17:32.420 that you've chosen to do, even though on paper it doesn't really add up. 246 00:17:32.420 --> 00:17:37.059 It looks like I don't know if we can scale this in customer success. 247 00:17:37.140 --> 00:17:41.299 We try to use a personal touch versus custom touch from the moments really 248 00:17:41.579 --> 00:17:45.089 matter. Just like in marketing, one who markets become very sophisticated, as 249 00:17:45.130 --> 00:17:49.170 you know, but so has our our bs or we know when a machine 250 00:17:49.329 --> 00:17:52.730 send us a message and we know when a real humans send us a message. 251 00:17:52.849 --> 00:17:57.490 So we try to scale those announcements, maybe around a new release available 252 00:17:57.490 --> 00:18:03.480 or known as you or a face is now available. But when I'm speaking 253 00:18:03.519 --> 00:18:07.079 directly to a stake older, these are end private accountil over a hundred case. 254 00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:11.599 So ladies know that it's a highly irrelevant message, and so I'm speaking 255 00:18:11.680 --> 00:18:17.549 directly in a relevant context. I'm sending one to one communications to them and 256 00:18:17.869 --> 00:18:21.950 oftentimes I'll turning on that video. It may not be a recorded video, 257 00:18:22.150 --> 00:18:26.269 but these zoo means you won't have a call with me and see us without 258 00:18:26.309 --> 00:18:32.460 my video. And then that approach to colms with customers is now spread other 259 00:18:32.539 --> 00:18:36.940 parts of our organization where more of my colleagues are turned on their videos and 260 00:18:37.180 --> 00:18:42.210 having a little more nonverbal communication, having a face to recognize increases trust and 261 00:18:42.329 --> 00:18:47.210 press of prosody, and those are some things that we've been thinking about. 262 00:18:47.210 --> 00:18:51.450 What we do these wonder one things, oh well, more thing about places. 263 00:18:51.930 --> 00:18:56.279 These gifts are, the gifts that we send out are necessarily sealable, 264 00:18:56.480 --> 00:19:00.680 with the high attention to these peaks, when they see that first value or 265 00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:06.240 have gone live sec in use case, we try to sound a meanful guest 266 00:19:06.480 --> 00:19:11.109 and we don't send in the round Christmas time, times of the year where 267 00:19:11.109 --> 00:19:15.710 it's almost expected, right when you're about to renew. No, we try 268 00:19:15.750 --> 00:19:19.869 to do it at these prising moments, because those tens is really important. 269 00:19:19.869 --> 00:19:22.750 And you're speaking my language, by the way, and talking about the trust 270 00:19:22.869 --> 00:19:29.859 and reciprocity through facetoface communication, really connecting with people eyed eye rather than just 271 00:19:29.980 --> 00:19:33.779 simply voice two voice. It's it really goes a long way. It's some 272 00:19:33.900 --> 00:19:37.539 most you introduced before. I really want to talk to you about this customer 273 00:19:37.539 --> 00:19:40.250 advisory board that you just ran. We would have done this a few weeks 274 00:19:40.250 --> 00:19:44.609 ago, but you're preparing for this really awesome event that I'm excited to hear 275 00:19:44.690 --> 00:19:48.650 about. But talk to me a little bit about building the culture of your 276 00:19:48.769 --> 00:19:53.920 team and advocating for CS internally inside the organization, especially for the customer success 277 00:19:53.960 --> 00:20:00.359 leaders who are listening. Absolutely so the customer advisor world. Talk to first 278 00:20:00.359 --> 00:20:04.039 season. I'll talk to talk about customer of Culture, of customer success. 279 00:20:04.440 --> 00:20:10.670 To the advisory board is something that a lot of companies try to initiate product 280 00:20:10.789 --> 00:20:15.869 management perspective to get ahead of where the customers are going. They invite these 281 00:20:15.990 --> 00:20:21.819 senior level folks into group of maybe ten to twelve people, like we did, 282 00:20:22.099 --> 00:20:25.619 and we asked the questions. Where are you making? That's your business. 283 00:20:26.420 --> 00:20:30.299 We're in this security orchestration automation from responsible domain. Why did you buy 284 00:20:30.339 --> 00:20:34.700 a products to solve this solution? Are you getting the return on the investment 285 00:20:34.769 --> 00:20:40.450 you made? Where some things or problems you think we need to address and 286 00:20:40.650 --> 00:20:44.650 find solutions to and the next year or two? We didn't ask them to 287 00:20:45.009 --> 00:20:49.440 rank features and solutions. We asked them to rate problems. Let us take 288 00:20:49.480 --> 00:20:55.839 on the heavy lifting of finding solutions and great solutions as the experts we want. 289 00:20:56.039 --> 00:21:00.119 Our biggest customers are most influential customers. They're huge advocates for us to 290 00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:03.160 help guide us. So that was a full day and a half event that 291 00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:07.950 I host it. You're Denver late February when great we had the executive team 292 00:21:07.990 --> 00:21:11.829 there and about twelve two other customers. Cool and and where did they come 293 00:21:11.950 --> 00:21:15.029 from? All over the world or across the country? We invite a few 294 00:21:15.190 --> 00:21:18.180 from Australia and Europe, but they think could make it so mostly the proground 295 00:21:18.259 --> 00:21:22.140 country. That's awesome. So how did you? How did you pick them? 296 00:21:22.180 --> 00:21:26.059 Again, these were these were some of your longest term clients or your 297 00:21:26.099 --> 00:21:27.819 highest value clients or like. What was it? You know, for someone 298 00:21:27.940 --> 00:21:32.019 thinks, okay, I want to do something like this, I want to 299 00:21:32.059 --> 00:21:36.130 get great customer intimacy, I want to build even deeper relationships with them, 300 00:21:36.210 --> 00:21:38.410 I want to learn from them directly. And, by the way, congratulations 301 00:21:38.450 --> 00:21:44.009 on going to problems over the product itself. Again, just going back to 302 00:21:44.170 --> 00:21:47.130 Henry Ford's you know, I would have given him faster horses or whatever. 303 00:21:47.240 --> 00:21:49.160 You know, that kind of classic line is like when you talk about the 304 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:52.519 problems, it's up to eat, up to the team in the company to 305 00:21:52.559 --> 00:21:56.279 figure out the created solutions that make sense for them. But for someone thinking 306 00:21:56.279 --> 00:21:59.920 about putting something like this together, how like what would just the wheal basic 307 00:21:59.960 --> 00:22:03.509 nuts and bolts of from okay, let's do this to okay, it's happening. 308 00:22:06.230 --> 00:22:11.990 First I say go to like Geospe, MICO seppy is the authority and 309 00:22:12.069 --> 00:22:15.660 a great trust of advisor on this or a lot of this material online. 310 00:22:17.460 --> 00:22:19.619 School of them a few times. He's a great guy. So first off, 311 00:22:19.700 --> 00:22:23.460 we can credits. Do there. A second start planning at least four 312 00:22:23.500 --> 00:22:27.539 to five months out, select the venue and then start to think about her 313 00:22:27.660 --> 00:22:32.890 in fight. have an invite come from the CEO. Those invites could be 314 00:22:33.089 --> 00:22:37.490 too long standing customers for brand new customers. We're looking for is people who 315 00:22:37.529 --> 00:22:41.809 areally bought into your vision or really excited buy your products and have a skegic 316 00:22:41.890 --> 00:22:45.119 perspective. This is not a user group, so it's been careful about the 317 00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:49.839 level of and scenority of the people they invite this kind of conversation. Was 318 00:22:49.880 --> 00:22:52.640 At home? Yeah, absolutely, that's goods and it's so. Was this 319 00:22:52.720 --> 00:22:57.160 at a hotel? Was this is a your office, like downtown US station 320 00:22:57.160 --> 00:23:02.910 at the Crawford Hotel? Was the any of the colations? And then across 321 00:23:02.950 --> 00:23:07.789 the street of the Oxford Bill we use their stay room. Of Fantastic venue 322 00:23:07.789 --> 00:23:11.549 or a lot of a lot of gratitude and thanks to that team Nice. 323 00:23:11.549 --> 00:23:15.099 I'm glad you got such great feedback on the event to as they concluded. 324 00:23:15.500 --> 00:23:21.579 So double back talk to me about building the culture of CS inside the organization 325 00:23:21.619 --> 00:23:26.740 at large? For sure, I start with asking teams to observe or share 326 00:23:26.059 --> 00:23:30.849 their good and bad experiences with brands, what was outstanding and what wasn't. 327 00:23:32.009 --> 00:23:36.369 Why talk about what your colleagues this is about. How just in conversations and 328 00:23:36.450 --> 00:23:40.809 passing about a month into starting to swim lane, we had a big all 329 00:23:40.890 --> 00:23:45.240 hands and CEO gave me a couple hours. Everybody in the whole company here 330 00:23:45.279 --> 00:23:48.400 in town. It's just the spend time on customers suss. So it took 331 00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:52.720 about forty five minutes to go through a Tish deck. But really spend the 332 00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:56.549 next hour on the game. They called it turn busters and designer from scratch. 333 00:23:57.109 --> 00:24:04.750 Had A number of different risks to pretension presented to the ten different teams. 334 00:24:06.190 --> 00:24:10.619 They were five by they would head to head and each of them were 335 00:24:10.660 --> 00:24:14.940 married. A response to holly would handle that risk, and then both teams 336 00:24:15.059 --> 00:24:18.420 presented what they would do and the rest of the company voted which team has 337 00:24:18.460 --> 00:24:22.779 been better, better response, and it just started to get everyone's thinking about. 338 00:24:22.819 --> 00:24:29.410 Okay, retention matters of Spansion, matters, spies seven times more cost 339 00:24:29.450 --> 00:24:33.410 effective to sell to your customers and a fine acquire a new one, and 340 00:24:33.569 --> 00:24:37.609 so it just shape the culture. To think about this now. I did 341 00:24:37.769 --> 00:24:41.400 have a colleague and told me, Jordan, this is just about a month 342 00:24:41.400 --> 00:24:44.519 ago. So when you can use both to the whole company, I was 343 00:24:44.599 --> 00:24:48.079 suspicious. I wasn't quite sure we were going to be able to achieve what 344 00:24:48.599 --> 00:24:53.470 we have actually come and and give a lot of props and there's a private, 345 00:24:53.670 --> 00:24:57.589 private phrase, but we're there. It seem stating some time to shoot 346 00:24:57.670 --> 00:25:03.670 that culture, celebrating successes in the journey, highlighting comments from customers in the 347 00:25:03.750 --> 00:25:07.069 company wise slash channel, this is a big one, and then casting a 348 00:25:07.140 --> 00:25:11.859 compelling mission. I think, I think, I think I did that early 349 00:25:11.980 --> 00:25:18.500 on and now we're starting to make as a great little checklist of actionable stuff. 350 00:25:18.539 --> 00:25:22.529 So if you're listening, hit that thirty two back button and write a 351 00:25:22.569 --> 00:25:26.609 couple of those down, because those are just really simple, straightforward, practical 352 00:25:26.730 --> 00:25:29.930 things. As you say them, I say, well, Gosh, that's 353 00:25:29.970 --> 00:25:33.569 so obvious. At the same time there's so many of these things that we're 354 00:25:33.609 --> 00:25:37.079 just not doing. That are easy, lowhanging things. So congratulations on getting 355 00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:44.640 broader company buy in into customer success. The net result is a better customer 356 00:25:44.720 --> 00:25:48.039 experience, especially with the journey mapping that you've done. One of our core 357 00:25:48.119 --> 00:25:52.589 values here at bombomb and on the customer experience podcast is relationship. So I's 358 00:25:52.630 --> 00:25:56.069 like to give you a chance to think or mentioned someone who's had a positive 359 00:25:56.069 --> 00:26:00.950 impact on your life or career and to to talk about a company that you 360 00:26:00.029 --> 00:26:07.420 think is doing customer experience really, really well. Phil grewer comes to mind. 361 00:26:07.539 --> 00:26:10.980 He's a local here in bolder and then I meant ten years ago and 362 00:26:11.579 --> 00:26:17.460 since we started our fessional relationship when I was working IVM's a great advisor giving 363 00:26:17.460 --> 00:26:22.329 advice of my career. Then it shifted a little bit later when he invited 364 00:26:22.369 --> 00:26:25.490 me to join his team and work for it, and I was such a 365 00:26:25.650 --> 00:26:30.890 way because he not only maybe oversold my abilities, put me into a position 366 00:26:32.049 --> 00:26:37.000 where I use my strengths. I was stressed challenge and then when his boss 367 00:26:37.400 --> 00:26:41.640 asked me to work for him, he didn't hold on. He let me 368 00:26:41.720 --> 00:26:45.279 go and and did even the thing that was not his self interest. So 369 00:26:45.920 --> 00:26:51.069 we still have the great relationship. We go sing together occasionally and say both 370 00:26:51.069 --> 00:26:55.069 rivers. Someone I want to just call out and think that's great, we're 371 00:26:55.150 --> 00:26:57.950 all lucky. If we have one person in our career like that, and 372 00:26:59.069 --> 00:27:02.619 hopefully we all have a few of them. Is there a company that you've 373 00:27:02.619 --> 00:27:07.099 had a great experience with recently or great his great experiences over time? Company 374 00:27:07.099 --> 00:27:11.339 that kind of stands out to you is as someone who really puts the customer 375 00:27:11.460 --> 00:27:15.259 first. I'm trying to think of one that stands above the rest. I 376 00:27:15.299 --> 00:27:18.289 can become a few examples that I think will eve into our conversation. One 377 00:27:18.410 --> 00:27:22.690 is is topal a. About ten years ago, five ten years ago, 378 00:27:23.130 --> 00:27:30.240 they used to without notice, freely give free Burritos two customers that they just 379 00:27:30.400 --> 00:27:36.359 felt like it, and I thought that was a really unique way to create 380 00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:41.039 the light through surprise. It wasn't expected, it wasn't some kind of punch 381 00:27:41.160 --> 00:27:44.670 card where we get by ten, you get one free. It was just 382 00:27:44.910 --> 00:27:48.950 this this delightful encounter that you have with their rant. That's what comes to 383 00:27:48.990 --> 00:27:53.069 mind. Even I can probably think of others, we can't. It's tough 384 00:27:53.109 --> 00:27:56.230 to beat a free burrito. That's right, that's a good one. So 385 00:27:56.430 --> 00:28:00.019 would you think that was like recognizable faces, or do you think it was 386 00:28:00.099 --> 00:28:03.579 just kind of random? Like I'm feeling this lady. I'm I'll give her 387 00:28:03.579 --> 00:28:07.299 a Burrito. I like this guy. It's possible recognized spaces. I think 388 00:28:07.339 --> 00:28:11.740 that's what's one of the things what they did is they created advocates. As 389 00:28:11.779 --> 00:28:15.490 a result, they would even as far with me, for example, by 390 00:28:15.490 --> 00:28:18.890 inviting me to be on their farm team. This is going back a good 391 00:28:18.170 --> 00:28:23.730 gosh almost ten years now, and that's farm team was a bunch of people 392 00:28:23.809 --> 00:28:29.519 they wanted to create as evangels and they educated us on their whole food with 393 00:28:29.640 --> 00:28:33.119 the tegrity brand and the process and how they think and why they think that 394 00:28:33.240 --> 00:28:37.240 way. And there's a select group of people. But we we offended. 395 00:28:37.279 --> 00:28:41.549 We became ev angels for their brand with our networks, and I thought that 396 00:28:41.630 --> 00:28:45.349 was a really interesting way way to approach the custom surience. That's really interesting. 397 00:28:45.390 --> 00:28:48.750 Where you just a customer at the time, or did you have some 398 00:28:48.910 --> 00:28:52.269 professional relationship or like, how did that get going? How many of there 399 00:28:52.309 --> 00:28:55.150 were you? This is fascinating to me. I didn't know about the farm 400 00:28:55.230 --> 00:28:59.180 team. Know, it's true. Two Thousand and ten is two thousand and 401 00:28:59.180 --> 00:29:03.180 eleven as when it when it started. Yeah, and ironically, and go 402 00:29:03.259 --> 00:29:07.059 into this a little bit, come us out if you want, but it 403 00:29:07.339 --> 00:29:11.609 was it was at a Chicago location, rem a the CFO in the line 404 00:29:11.650 --> 00:29:15.289 aster ball way and in that moment, because I was so intrigued by the 405 00:29:15.369 --> 00:29:19.690 farm team and what was going on, I did him to speak at college 406 00:29:19.690 --> 00:29:23.720 school, mandamen Rosello to school and and he said Mumtation, and a month 407 00:29:23.799 --> 00:29:27.799 later he came and introduced some front of executives and he talks about it in 408 00:29:27.880 --> 00:29:34.759 more easy so those kinds of interactions with ran just really develop this oilty genuine 409 00:29:36.039 --> 00:29:38.950 interest. That's excellent. Hey, Jordan, this has been really fun. 410 00:29:40.589 --> 00:29:44.789 I think there are a number of super practical takeaways. I'm looking forward to 411 00:29:44.789 --> 00:29:48.069 going back through my notes for people that want to stay connected with you or 412 00:29:48.109 --> 00:29:51.230 they want to connect with swim lane or some places that you might send them 413 00:29:51.589 --> 00:29:56.420 and testing so swimmling. Swimmlingcom pretty pretty straightforward for me. Love the kneck 414 00:29:56.500 --> 00:30:02.339 of anyone's listening. Jordan Oliver ARROWCOM great place to go, or on twitter, 415 00:30:02.380 --> 00:30:07.210 Jordan all Arrow one. That's awesome. Thank you so much for your 416 00:30:07.289 --> 00:30:11.690 time today. Really look forward to to connecting again and connecting in person up 417 00:30:11.690 --> 00:30:17.009 in denverse sometime. Forward to it to thank you for having hey. I'll 418 00:30:17.049 --> 00:30:19.569 be honest, if someone reached out to me about joining the chipotle farm team. 419 00:30:19.809 --> 00:30:23.640 I'd be open to that. Hey, if you want more stories about 420 00:30:23.759 --> 00:30:29.240 companies that are doing cx well, if you want more stories of people having 421 00:30:29.319 --> 00:30:33.359 positive impacts on lives and careers and, above all, if you want more 422 00:30:33.559 --> 00:30:40.670 conversations about how sales, marketing and customer success experts are creating better alignment in 423 00:30:40.869 --> 00:30:48.630 pursuit of a better customer experience, then check out Bombombcom podcast. That's bomb 424 00:30:48.109 --> 00:30:55.940 Bombcom podcast, or go to your favorite podcast player and check out the customer 425 00:30:56.140 --> 00:31:00.259 experience podcast, subscribe, give it a rating. I'd love your feedback. 426 00:31:00.539 --> 00:31:03.529 Might name is Ethan Butt and you can hit me up at Ethan Etch N 427 00:31:03.849 --> 00:31:11.170 at Bombombcom. Thanks so much for listening. We totally get it. We 428 00:31:11.289 --> 00:31:15.930 publish a ton of content on this podcast and it can be a lot to 429 00:31:15.009 --> 00:31:19.119 keep up with. That's why we've started the BOB growth big three, a 430 00:31:19.279 --> 00:31:23.680 no fluff email that boils down our three biggest takeaways from an entire week of 431 00:31:23.799 --> 00:31:30.559 episodes. Sign up today at Sweet Phish Mediacom Big Three. That sweet PHISH 432 00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:33.150 MEDIACOM Big Three