Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.540 --> 00:00:02.740 Yeah, 2 00:00:05.240 --> 00:00:08.960 welcome back to BTB growth. I'm dan Sanchez with sweet fish media and I'm 3 00:00:08.960 --> 00:00:13.900 here with Christina jaramillo, who is the president of personal A B. M. 4 00:00:13.900 --> 00:00:17.630 Christina, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me dan, I appreciate it and 5 00:00:17.630 --> 00:00:22.270 I was excited to talk to Christina because she focuses on my kind of 6 00:00:22.270 --> 00:00:27.700 favorite version of A B. M. But before we break into it, I wanted to kick it 7 00:00:27.700 --> 00:00:33.400 off, just dive right into the questions as far as how you define a B in and in 8 00:00:33.400 --> 00:00:36.400 and of itself because there's lots of different definitions of their, some 9 00:00:36.400 --> 00:00:39.800 people define it broadly, some people define it narrowly and there's all 10 00:00:39.800 --> 00:00:43.280 kinds of things in between. So Christina, let's jump into like how do 11 00:00:43.280 --> 00:00:47.710 you define it? What is it, what is it not? Okay, so to me, A B M should be 12 00:00:47.710 --> 00:00:51.390 defined as a business strategy, focusing on fixing the challenges and 13 00:00:51.390 --> 00:00:54.890 revenue leaks that an organization might have, it's about getting more 14 00:00:54.890 --> 00:00:59.550 tier one I. C. P accounts that can provide more maximum lifetime value and 15 00:00:59.550 --> 00:01:04.709 greater revenue growth as well as growing existing accounts. But as you 16 00:01:04.709 --> 00:01:08.390 mentioned, a BMS definitions kind of all over the place. I think people are 17 00:01:08.390 --> 00:01:12.490 just taking in different directions and trying to fit where they think it fits 18 00:01:12.490 --> 00:01:17.150 and so it's gotten diluted and I think more recently the term A B. M has kind 19 00:01:17.150 --> 00:01:21.860 of been synonymous with the technology that enables it. So we're doing A B. M. 20 00:01:21.860 --> 00:01:25.040 Because we have demand base or we have six cents or we have terminus or 21 00:01:25.040 --> 00:01:30.400 whatever. A BM technology and I think those tech tools are seen as, you know, 22 00:01:30.400 --> 00:01:35.300 as a silver bullet, which is not the case. And so because of that, I think a 23 00:01:35.300 --> 00:01:38.530 lot of companies are treating A B. M as marketing as usual, but just with shiny 24 00:01:38.530 --> 00:01:42.720 new tools, they're not focused on how A B. M should be that business strategy 25 00:01:42.720 --> 00:01:46.270 to fix those problems beyond just pipeline. So it's become about 26 00:01:46.270 --> 00:01:50.580 technology and tactics. Like last a couple of weeks ago I was talking to 27 00:01:50.580 --> 00:01:56.020 CMO of a channel sales and tech company and you know, her Ceo had introduced us 28 00:01:56.020 --> 00:02:00.130 because I shared with him that I believe their a B. M. program was 29 00:02:00.130 --> 00:02:04.620 missing 60% of the market because I knew that they were using six cents. So 30 00:02:04.620 --> 00:02:08.840 when I got on the call with this CMO, I asked her automatically, what is your A 31 00:02:08.840 --> 00:02:12.550 B. M strategy, what does it look like? And she started off by mentioning their 32 00:02:12.550 --> 00:02:16.600 textract, she said we use outreach we use and we use six cents marcato zoom 33 00:02:16.600 --> 00:02:20.910 info. So basically she was just talking about the tools they were using and she 34 00:02:20.910 --> 00:02:23.630 even mentioned that they were a case study for six months because they were 35 00:02:23.630 --> 00:02:28.700 using the platform correctly. And to me using six cents platform correctly, 36 00:02:28.700 --> 00:02:34.090 it's different from a B. M effective strategy. So what I really heard in her 37 00:02:34.090 --> 00:02:39.070 conversation was similar to a stat that I saw from I T S M A. I believe it was, 38 00:02:39.080 --> 00:02:41.950 it said about two thirds of a BM organizations are not seeing 39 00:02:41.950 --> 00:02:46.360 significant business impact or improvement with their A B. M. Program. 40 00:02:46.370 --> 00:02:50.830 So I think she kind of fits into that because they might be treating it again 41 00:02:50.830 --> 00:02:54.500 as marketing unusual and just kind of using tools and saying that they're 42 00:02:54.500 --> 00:02:58.460 doing it. And she also mentioned that they were having a lot of deals going 43 00:02:58.460 --> 00:03:01.830 to their safer competitor, more comfortable choice, which was 44 00:03:01.840 --> 00:03:07.500 Salesforce. And I think because they were treating A B. M. As a technology 45 00:03:07.500 --> 00:03:12.230 versus a strategy, that was the problem that that was, you know, exacerbated by 46 00:03:12.230 --> 00:03:17.150 the fact. So I think it comes down to the fact that a lot of people think of 47 00:03:17.150 --> 00:03:21.580 technology as fitting as a B. M. And the tech being synonymous. But it's 48 00:03:21.580 --> 00:03:25.200 only one piece of the puzzle. To me, A B. M. Is not about campaigns and 49 00:03:25.200 --> 00:03:28.880 marketing unusual as usual. Like you start off strategic when you start 50 00:03:28.880 --> 00:03:32.580 campaigns, but the minute you focus on tech and then just those massive 51 00:03:32.580 --> 00:03:36.590 campaigns it's going to become tactical. Um and then you're not be able to get 52 00:03:36.590 --> 00:03:41.850 accounts to revenue. And you know, I think A B. M. Should really be focused 53 00:03:41.850 --> 00:03:45.180 on how you're going to get those tier one accounts to revenue, especially the 54 00:03:45.180 --> 00:03:48.780 ones that are disengaging with sales and marketing and put a strategy for 55 00:03:48.780 --> 00:03:54.170 getting those, you know, accounts to revenue. Technology just like content 56 00:03:54.170 --> 00:03:58.460 message is just a piece of the puzzle. Yeah, I do find it's an interesting 57 00:03:58.460 --> 00:04:02.500 case that I don't know there's two different approaches that I've seen and 58 00:04:02.500 --> 00:04:06.680 I've had this with I I have these conversations I t most of all because I 59 00:04:06.690 --> 00:04:10.390 almost feel like some people are like, no, we decide what we want to have 60 00:04:10.390 --> 00:04:14.390 happen and then we go and find tools to accomplish that versus I'm actually 61 00:04:14.390 --> 00:04:18.269 going to reverse a lot as I find out what most of the tools can accomplish 62 00:04:18.279 --> 00:04:22.240 and then based on what's possible. I go in reverse engineer what I think will 63 00:04:22.240 --> 00:04:26.160 work best two different approaches. I find that I like to just kind of start 64 00:04:26.160 --> 00:04:29.570 with what's possible and then kind of map a strategy to that. So I can kind 65 00:04:29.570 --> 00:04:32.440 of See them like using something like six cents and trying to get the most 66 00:04:32.440 --> 00:04:36.340 out of it. But at the same time I can certainly lead you astray because it 67 00:04:36.340 --> 00:04:39.900 can lead you doing things that you hadn't necessarily thought or that are 68 00:04:39.910 --> 00:04:43.400 actually going to lead you to your revenue goal. So that makes a ton of 69 00:04:43.400 --> 00:04:48.530 sense. And maybe maybe it was better than what they did before and just mass 70 00:04:48.530 --> 00:04:54.540 advertising across a huge, huge segment or persona, right? So at least they're 71 00:04:54.540 --> 00:04:59.940 focusing in on a few more accounts, but at the same time, hopefully they're 72 00:04:59.940 --> 00:05:04.070 tracking towards revenue, otherwise it could be a massive miss, right? And I'm 73 00:05:04.070 --> 00:05:07.320 sure across big organizations implementing these A B. M. Campaigns, 74 00:05:07.320 --> 00:05:10.690 it's it's it's hard to know if what you're doing is all mapping towards 75 00:05:10.690 --> 00:05:14.050 revenue, but I'd love to hear more like there's a lot of people that like to 76 00:05:14.050 --> 00:05:18.800 take the the one too many approach and the one too few approach, but where I 77 00:05:18.800 --> 00:05:24.500 know you specialize in Is in that personal 1 - one approach. So I'd love 78 00:05:24.500 --> 00:05:28.290 to hear more about what you guys are doing that personal A B. M as far as 79 00:05:28.300 --> 00:05:32.030 those 1 to 1 approaches. I know we have a few things we've done at sweet fish, 80 00:05:32.040 --> 00:05:35.900 but I'm always looking to hear about how do we make marketing more personal? 81 00:05:35.910 --> 00:05:39.660 It's one thing to personalize it, but it's a whole different thing. It's like 82 00:05:39.670 --> 00:05:44.330 a totally it's a massive jump away from just personalization to be actually 83 00:05:44.330 --> 00:05:48.080 personal. Right? So what are the things that you guys are working on that you 84 00:05:48.080 --> 00:05:51.750 found works well there. Yeah, absolutely. I it's interesting that you 85 00:05:51.750 --> 00:05:55.530 mentioned personalization being different than being personal because I 86 00:05:55.540 --> 00:05:59.290 see a lot of people confusing the words and to me, personalization is maybe 87 00:05:59.290 --> 00:06:03.990 adding industry relevance or company relevance or role relevance or maybe 88 00:06:03.990 --> 00:06:08.050 even someone's name in a campaign versus getting to know what's what 89 00:06:08.050 --> 00:06:11.860 matters to them as a person, what matters to them as part of a smaller 90 00:06:11.860 --> 00:06:15.080 team with an organization and what matters to them as an organization as a 91 00:06:15.080 --> 00:06:20.220 whole that's that's to me is personal. And with a B. M, the one too few one 92 00:06:20.220 --> 00:06:24.680 too many and 1 to 1 it needs to be a balance and I feel like people play 93 00:06:24.690 --> 00:06:28.630 really well, maybe in the one too few and one too many. And that 1 to 1 is 94 00:06:28.630 --> 00:06:33.660 where we saw a lack of programs. So that's what we focus. For example, we 95 00:06:33.940 --> 00:06:38.390 we're working with a company called Schneider national. There a three pl or 96 00:06:38.390 --> 00:06:41.730 a third party logistics firm out of Wisconsin, they have the big orange 97 00:06:41.730 --> 00:06:46.680 trucks with their name on it, you know, so they had a their messaging was about 98 00:06:46.690 --> 00:06:50.290 better people, better process and better technology. They were stuck in 99 00:06:50.290 --> 00:06:55.860 that kind of messaging and campaign framework for over five years and they 100 00:06:55.860 --> 00:07:00.840 were trying to gain traction with an organization called Sigma, which is a 101 00:07:00.840 --> 00:07:05.880 offshoot I believe of Cisco, Cisco with an S policy. And this particular 102 00:07:05.880 --> 00:07:10.280 company had heard Schneider's messaging that better people process tech from 103 00:07:10.280 --> 00:07:14.350 Schneider, but also from competitors because it was very similar to what 104 00:07:14.350 --> 00:07:18.160 everybody else was saying in the industry and they didn't see how that 105 00:07:18.540 --> 00:07:22.180 was filling the gaps or personal impacts to give them a reason to change. 106 00:07:22.180 --> 00:07:25.310 They didn't see themselves in that story that was being told, which is why 107 00:07:25.310 --> 00:07:29.110 they were ignoring any type of outreach. They were already ignoring email, 108 00:07:29.110 --> 00:07:34.490 social live phone conversations. So we took a look at their contacts and we 109 00:07:34.490 --> 00:07:38.310 started on linkedin, we saw that the Schneider's team had the right context. 110 00:07:38.310 --> 00:07:42.640 The VP of sales even was connected to Sigma's VP of logistics on Lincoln, 111 00:07:42.640 --> 00:07:47.020 which is someone they would have to get in the decision making committee. But 112 00:07:47.020 --> 00:07:49.930 we noticed that sales did not have the right content and messaging to make 113 00:07:49.930 --> 00:07:54.320 that human to human connection. So we redesigned profiles and content to show 114 00:07:54.320 --> 00:07:58.250 mid market firms like Sigma, how they were being underserved by their 115 00:07:58.250 --> 00:08:01.610 transportation management system, which is the TMS it's a solution or one of 116 00:08:01.610 --> 00:08:05.210 the many solutions that Schneider provides Schneider needed to show sigma 117 00:08:05.210 --> 00:08:09.030 that they were and other target accounts that were similar to them that 118 00:08:09.030 --> 00:08:11.810 they were kind of being treated like that middle child by their service 119 00:08:11.810 --> 00:08:15.040 providers because they weren't big enough to get the huge service 120 00:08:15.040 --> 00:08:17.480 providers and get a lot of attention and they weren't small enough to go 121 00:08:17.480 --> 00:08:22.470 with the more boutique kind of firms. They needed the team at sigma to 122 00:08:22.470 --> 00:08:27.160 acknowledge the gaps they had and how they were impacting everything across 123 00:08:27.340 --> 00:08:32.240 uh the organization from operations to supply chain to the P. N. L. How is it 124 00:08:32.240 --> 00:08:36.880 affecting employees any kind of KPI S They had service performance and 125 00:08:36.880 --> 00:08:41.700 customer performance. So ultimately, we created by Eurocentric profiles on 126 00:08:41.700 --> 00:08:45.360 linkedin bio centric content and messaging that spoke to the human 127 00:08:45.370 --> 00:08:49.410 buyers versus at them within key accounts that they wanted to win, 128 00:08:49.410 --> 00:08:53.790 protect and expand this particular case. We were talking to sigma, you know, 129 00:08:53.800 --> 00:09:00.040 when you're speak to human buyers, you have to have industry, company rank 130 00:09:00.040 --> 00:09:03.880 role and even personal relevance. But we've seen that a lot of sales and 131 00:09:03.880 --> 00:09:07.860 marketing communications kind of stops at what we said earlier, the the 132 00:09:08.540 --> 00:09:13.060 personalized which industry and company relevance and then personals when you 133 00:09:13.060 --> 00:09:17.410 add all of them together. And so once we were able to increase the relevance 134 00:09:17.420 --> 00:09:21.600 in, you know, across the board for Schneider, sigma and others that were 135 00:09:21.600 --> 00:09:25.600 mid market targets for them were kind of pulling business development through 136 00:09:25.600 --> 00:09:30.120 the sale cycle versus trying to like push them through. So we were able to 137 00:09:30.120 --> 00:09:34.870 cut The sale cycle down to six months and Snyder was typically used to seeing 138 00:09:34.870 --> 00:09:39.280 12 to 18 months and then the account was they won the account and it was 139 00:09:39.280 --> 00:09:43.540 worth anywhere from 2 to 6 million depending on how they, how long they 140 00:09:43.540 --> 00:09:46.710 can retain them as a client and how long they keep up that personal 141 00:09:46.710 --> 00:09:51.230 relevance throughout the journey. It's a massive deal. So it sounds like they 142 00:09:51.230 --> 00:09:54.760 kind of had a positioning problem but they're probably like a very, I mean 143 00:09:54.760 --> 00:09:57.720 it's hard to position when you're like fully customizable, right? And lots of 144 00:09:57.720 --> 00:10:00.960 people are playing that game. So I really like how you did the research to 145 00:10:00.960 --> 00:10:06.020 find what I believe it, you said it was sigma, right? The customer they were 146 00:10:06.020 --> 00:10:11.070 targeting was they just did enough research on it to find and prove to 147 00:10:11.070 --> 00:10:14.510 sigma that what they could do would save them time would save the money 148 00:10:14.510 --> 00:10:18.360 would be beneficial for them. By doing enough research on sigma to be able to 149 00:10:18.360 --> 00:10:23.000 say like this is how we can help you specifically how we help in general. 150 00:10:23.010 --> 00:10:27.310 How we can help you. Right. And that makes a massive difference. Does that 151 00:10:27.310 --> 00:10:30.890 mean you or like the marketing team just had to do a massive amount of 152 00:10:30.890 --> 00:10:33.700 research to figure out what they were using and how they were losing money 153 00:10:33.700 --> 00:10:37.110 and all that kind of stuff. Do you are you doing that with just sigma or do 154 00:10:37.110 --> 00:10:41.020 you do it with like 10-20 accounts? Like how much how deep did you go to do 155 00:10:41.020 --> 00:10:44.490 that? And how with how many accounts? We typically work with a couple of 156 00:10:44.490 --> 00:10:48.010 dozen accounts but it's you know it's it's the goals that they were looking 157 00:10:48.010 --> 00:10:52.880 at. So we when we chose sigma we knew that it was going to have what kind of 158 00:10:52.880 --> 00:10:56.040 revenue potential it was going to have. So we only choose accounts that are 159 00:10:56.040 --> 00:11:01.130 worth 67 plus figures. Otherwise it requires so much time and so much 160 00:11:01.140 --> 00:11:05.350 effort and so much research and so much content creators. The message creation 161 00:11:05.360 --> 00:11:10.280 we make sure that we know that they fit the I. C. P. To a. T. And that what is 162 00:11:10.280 --> 00:11:14.980 going on internally in that target account is going to fit really well. So 163 00:11:14.980 --> 00:11:18.810 we always go backwards and start with well what are you doing best with your 164 00:11:18.810 --> 00:11:21.460 current clients and not what you think you're doing best with your current 165 00:11:21.460 --> 00:11:25.200 clients, what do your clients think that you're doing best for them? And 166 00:11:25.200 --> 00:11:28.750 then we, like you said reverse engineer who would be a target that you know 167 00:11:28.750 --> 00:11:32.120 what's an organ organization that looks very similar and might have similar 168 00:11:32.130 --> 00:11:36.040 things happening behind the scenes that we're not aware of. So that's why we 169 00:11:36.040 --> 00:11:40.010 work with a limited number of accounts and 1 to 1. But whatever we learn from 170 00:11:40.010 --> 00:11:45.030 our 1 to 1, we then can scale it by applying it to the one too few and one 171 00:11:45.030 --> 00:11:48.410 too many and those that are running maybe an A B. M. Tech or some other 172 00:11:48.410 --> 00:11:53.710 kind of campaign. And so that's the, when we play in that 1 to 1, how many, 173 00:11:53.710 --> 00:12:00.420 how many did you do? Like sigma? Was it just like just Yeah, no, there was a 174 00:12:00.430 --> 00:12:04.380 couple of handfuls, but that was the quarter where they wanted to win. Their 175 00:12:04.380 --> 00:12:08.840 particular Snyder's goal was to increase revenue with a new client 176 00:12:08.840 --> 00:12:13.340 versus another time we had done it with an existing client that they wanted to 177 00:12:13.340 --> 00:12:16.650 expand and just make sure that they retained. So it depends on the quarters, 178 00:12:16.940 --> 00:12:19.210 you know what their goals are. Each company has goals. Do we want to 179 00:12:19.210 --> 00:12:22.820 protect our at risk accounts? Do we want to expand current accounts? Do we 180 00:12:22.820 --> 00:12:26.900 want new logos, but again, they have to be really lucrative accounts because 181 00:12:26.900 --> 00:12:31.720 this is a time heavy approach, that makes sense. And so you're saying, what 182 00:12:31.720 --> 00:12:35.590 I'm hearing you say is your kind of handling 12 at a time, whatever the 183 00:12:35.590 --> 00:12:40.240 priority is for that quarter you're kind of going after. I mean this, I 184 00:12:40.240 --> 00:12:43.600 mean this is like the top of the pyramid, right? This is the 1 to 2 185 00:12:43.600 --> 00:12:47.760 accounts that you really want to focus on are going all in on. So that makes a 186 00:12:47.760 --> 00:12:52.920 ton of sense. What do you do, let's say for audiences listening who have some 187 00:12:52.920 --> 00:12:56.300 really big contracts but they're not millions were in the high hundreds of 188 00:12:56.300 --> 00:12:59.950 thousands. What do you typically do with your own clients that are in that 189 00:12:59.950 --> 00:13:04.420 size? That's a similar approach? You know, what our focus is also is, you 190 00:13:04.420 --> 00:13:07.150 know, are we trying to shorten sail cycle times? Like another thing, not 191 00:13:07.150 --> 00:13:11.360 only do we get a good big deal with that particular story told, but we did 192 00:13:11.370 --> 00:13:16.330 cut the sale cycle by a third, which is awesome in itself. So it depends if 193 00:13:16.330 --> 00:13:19.440 that's their goal. Do we want to even expand deal sizes? Do we see that 194 00:13:19.440 --> 00:13:23.580 there's an opportunity for that because it's a similar approach, but it is, 195 00:13:23.580 --> 00:13:27.700 take a lot of research into what's going on. So what do we use intent data 196 00:13:27.700 --> 00:13:32.270 depending on if that's something that's available to us? Do we see what's going 197 00:13:32.270 --> 00:13:36.820 on? Are they an acquisition mode? Are they just get a lot of funding so that 198 00:13:36.830 --> 00:13:41.030 it's a similar approach. It's just a case by case but it does require a lot 199 00:13:41.030 --> 00:13:45.360 of, lot of research. So what we do is we're not a stand alone marketing were 200 00:13:45.360 --> 00:13:48.570 usually like a supplement to marketing because they can't necessarily have 201 00:13:48.570 --> 00:13:54.260 time or the resources to do what we do. What aspect to usually help assistant. 202 00:13:54.270 --> 00:13:56.930 Do you do the research or do you just kind of set up like the overall 203 00:13:56.930 --> 00:14:01.050 framework of like, well here's the problem and here are some solutions of 204 00:14:01.050 --> 00:14:05.650 how we can help guide. Yeah, we do strategy and execution. So we'll start 205 00:14:05.660 --> 00:14:10.620 of you know what the problems that we are that we see again depending on what 206 00:14:10.620 --> 00:14:16.630 their goal is expansion retention, new logo but we do the research, we create 207 00:14:16.630 --> 00:14:20.540 the content to support that research and we kind of, we work with sales 208 00:14:20.540 --> 00:14:25.740 really well because we our marketing specifically for sales conversations 209 00:14:25.740 --> 00:14:29.050 that they want to have. So we will create case studies, we will create 210 00:14:29.050 --> 00:14:32.790 white papers, we will create row actual articles to support the selling 211 00:14:32.790 --> 00:14:36.940 conversation. Um and I actually have an example of that when we can get to a 212 00:14:36.940 --> 00:14:41.740 little later but that's what we do. So we do it from start to finish and then 213 00:14:41.750 --> 00:14:46.020 then whatever we use or what we create can be used in the campaign. So like if 214 00:14:46.020 --> 00:14:49.860 we create a case study or an article we can use it in the one too few or one to 215 00:14:49.860 --> 00:14:53.710 many campaigns and see, you know, this is this is the framework that really 216 00:14:53.710 --> 00:14:58.580 worked along with this segment of this industry. What are some other 217 00:14:58.580 --> 00:15:01.710 approaches? It sounds like you're really heavy and like essentially 218 00:15:01.710 --> 00:15:05.740 putting together custom proposals is how you're becoming the most personal, 219 00:15:05.750 --> 00:15:10.320 so you're creating marketing collateral, maybe even landing pages and stuff that 220 00:15:10.320 --> 00:15:15.240 are completely customized for the one account which is highly personal. Tell 221 00:15:15.240 --> 00:15:18.080 me a little bit like what that looks like tactically like what are the kinds 222 00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:21.260 of elements you're producing or in collaboration with these marketing 223 00:15:21.260 --> 00:15:25.610 teams in order to get these things in front of the a counter or you sending 224 00:15:25.610 --> 00:15:31.050 it pretty much is like a customized white paper to the main account. Um, we 225 00:15:31.050 --> 00:15:34.130 might be sending customized content of the main account, but we don't 226 00:15:34.130 --> 00:15:39.590 necessarily call them out by name. So we kind of allude to what we know is 227 00:15:39.590 --> 00:15:43.740 going on, what we've heard is going on in the company. Um, you know, if we've 228 00:15:43.740 --> 00:15:48.750 heard it from news or research that we found or even from Champions, Internal 229 00:15:48.750 --> 00:15:51.520 Champions in the organization that might not be decision makers, but are 230 00:15:51.520 --> 00:15:54.720 telling us, you know, we're having problems with X, Y, Z. And we really 231 00:15:54.720 --> 00:15:58.630 think that you can help us and we'd show how what they're doing right now 232 00:15:58.630 --> 00:16:02.960 can better be either improved or if they need to switch vendors or whatever 233 00:16:02.960 --> 00:16:08.130 the case may be. So we're doing it that way. We're not actually. So it's it's 234 00:16:08.130 --> 00:16:14.730 more, it's not necessarily customize as it names the the prospective client, 235 00:16:14.730 --> 00:16:18.800 but it can be used as an evergreen piece later on. If that makes sense. 236 00:16:18.810 --> 00:16:22.210 Makes a ton of sense. And it sounds like it's really, it's almost like 237 00:16:22.210 --> 00:16:25.800 farther, it's much farther down the funnel where you're working probably as 238 00:16:25.800 --> 00:16:28.270 much with sales as you are with the marketing at that point. I mean if 239 00:16:28.270 --> 00:16:31.840 you're focusing on one or two accounts at the time than sales probably speaks 240 00:16:31.840 --> 00:16:36.450 a lot into it and but you're still generating marketing assets that can be 241 00:16:36.450 --> 00:16:41.900 used up the funnel. So that's what are some other approaches you've taken that 242 00:16:41.900 --> 00:16:46.490 you found work well Personal, A. B. M. So one thing that we're really big on 243 00:16:46.490 --> 00:16:51.360 and a lot of our clients are kind of either just getting started with this 244 00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:54.490 or they see that it's an issue, they just don't know how to address it. We 245 00:16:54.500 --> 00:16:59.550 have shown them that there can't be a handoff between sales and marketing. So 246 00:16:59.550 --> 00:17:03.520 once the selling conversation begins, marketing needs to be there along the 247 00:17:03.520 --> 00:17:08.200 way. So whatever sales learns, um, during their internal conversation or 248 00:17:08.200 --> 00:17:12.190 their conversations with the prospects or maybe a demo call whatever they need 249 00:17:12.190 --> 00:17:15.470 to share that information so that marketing can come along and support 250 00:17:15.470 --> 00:17:20.060 them with another piece of collateral that might or maybe even some talking 251 00:17:20.060 --> 00:17:23.950 points for the next time. So I'll give you an example. We were working with an 252 00:17:23.960 --> 00:17:28.900 e commerce tech firm that learned in a good way. Not the hard way um that 253 00:17:28.900 --> 00:17:33.130 sales and marketing has to continue to work hand in hand. They were using a 254 00:17:33.130 --> 00:17:37.410 BMT conversations with the health care health care product firm and this 255 00:17:37.410 --> 00:17:43.090 product firm served long term care facilities, skilled nursing assisted 256 00:17:43.090 --> 00:17:47.770 living hospice V. A. Hospitals. And the firm wanted to move from a traditional 257 00:17:48.140 --> 00:17:52.760 old school phone and fax system to modern self service e commerce platform. 258 00:17:53.140 --> 00:17:57.610 But the firm had two sides of the business to support the new purchases 259 00:17:57.610 --> 00:18:02.370 that were strong demand uh And rentals. And our client software was designed 260 00:18:02.370 --> 00:18:06.570 specifically to integrate with S. A. P. C. R. P. Um That didn't have the 261 00:18:06.570 --> 00:18:10.870 capability at the time to meet the needs of the rental business. So 262 00:18:10.880 --> 00:18:15.480 despite having these teams team calls, seeing a demo executing the executive 263 00:18:15.480 --> 00:18:19.360 buying committee at the health care product firm was still hung up on the 264 00:18:19.360 --> 00:18:23.930 rental side of the business. What they didn't see is the risks, the costs um 265 00:18:23.940 --> 00:18:28.770 impacts of choosing an e commerce platform that sat outside their er P. 266 00:18:28.770 --> 00:18:33.360 But would accommodate both sides of the business. So instead of keeping them, 267 00:18:33.370 --> 00:18:36.900 what they were looking to do is get everything under one solution. And it 268 00:18:36.900 --> 00:18:40.150 was going to be difficult because there was gonna be some holes. Sales was 269 00:18:40.150 --> 00:18:43.510 trying to have further conversations with the team but the VP of I. T. Was 270 00:18:43.510 --> 00:18:47.630 basically acting as their gatekeeper and kept the distance between sales and 271 00:18:47.630 --> 00:18:51.150 the buying team. So it was really hard you know to have these internal 272 00:18:51.150 --> 00:18:53.860 conversations because all the requirements were being collected in a 273 00:18:53.860 --> 00:18:57.260 vacuum so instead of giving them the time to make the wrong decision, 274 00:18:57.260 --> 00:19:01.040 marketing sales work together to create a consensus in their favor. So what we 275 00:19:01.040 --> 00:19:05.680 did was we created content to show the effect of working outside ASAP with a 276 00:19:05.680 --> 00:19:10.900 platform like maybe magenta and the impact that it would have on go to live 277 00:19:10.900 --> 00:19:15.500 on performance on P. N. L. And on corporate initiatives because I. T. 278 00:19:15.500 --> 00:19:20.090 Would have to be tied up for at least 6 to 12 months on this e commerce project. 279 00:19:20.100 --> 00:19:24.450 So by showing how their decision to go the other way was going to affect them 280 00:19:24.450 --> 00:19:30.030 in different ways They were able to work together to ensure when with sales 281 00:19:30.030 --> 00:19:33.810 and marketing versus going that 5050 chance that the buying team would make 282 00:19:33.810 --> 00:19:38.110 their decision in their favor. So we kind of help them see the bigger 283 00:19:38.110 --> 00:19:42.390 picture as opposed to one little piece of the puzzle and that was made it 284 00:19:42.390 --> 00:19:45.950 easier for them to make the right decision or in our favor. I should say 285 00:19:45.960 --> 00:19:50.200 makes a lot of sense. I've been not in huge company has been some mid sized 286 00:19:50.200 --> 00:19:53.690 companies. I've been the decision maker. I'm like large Crm purchases and 287 00:19:53.690 --> 00:19:57.520 different things like that and I'm like man if I would have had a sales where 288 00:19:57.520 --> 00:20:00.360 it would have been delivering me that information to help make a case to my, 289 00:20:00.370 --> 00:20:04.220 to my people who are arguing against me. I would have been like so much, it 290 00:20:04.220 --> 00:20:08.020 would have been so much easier. That makes a ton of sense from being that 291 00:20:08.270 --> 00:20:11.610 you're just kind of like you're, you're asking me all these questions. I don't 292 00:20:11.610 --> 00:20:14.560 have all the answers. But if my vendor who's trying to sell to me, he's 293 00:20:14.560 --> 00:20:19.260 actually like, there you go. You're just like Just do this. You're 294 00:20:19.270 --> 00:20:21.910 interesting that one person who's really rooting for you inside that 295 00:20:21.910 --> 00:20:26.160 organization. Right. Exactly. That's the idea. I'm curious to know if you 296 00:20:26.160 --> 00:20:30.760 have any campaign ideas for people who want to do personal A B. M. Who are 297 00:20:30.760 --> 00:20:35.390 like in the way, way down like their average contract sizes are in the tens 298 00:20:35.390 --> 00:20:39.440 of thousands and a. R. R. And maybe over the long long haul if they have 299 00:20:39.440 --> 00:20:42.150 annual recurrent revenue can add up to a lot, but generally they're not, 300 00:20:42.150 --> 00:20:45.510 they're not making that big of a game with each new customer. How do you 301 00:20:45.510 --> 00:20:51.010 become more personal with a B. M. If your, if your contract sizes and that 302 00:20:51.010 --> 00:20:55.400 tens of thousands range. So first of all I would talk to these sales people 303 00:20:55.400 --> 00:20:59.430 and tell them to take a look at their linkedin profile. Does it look like 304 00:20:59.430 --> 00:21:03.720 you're looking for a new role because you're talking to me about your 305 00:21:03.720 --> 00:21:08.330 President Club awards quote after quote unquote attainments, how much you've 306 00:21:08.330 --> 00:21:12.790 made in the last couple of years for your company because me as a prospect 307 00:21:12.790 --> 00:21:16.620 and I know my clients have said this as well the minute they see that, you know, 308 00:21:16.630 --> 00:21:19.290 a wall goes up because they know they're going to be sold, the minute 309 00:21:19.290 --> 00:21:24.140 they accept the connection, change it to be story based. How are you helping 310 00:21:24.140 --> 00:21:27.430 your buyers? How have you helped them recently so that other people can kind 311 00:21:27.430 --> 00:21:32.040 of see themselves in that story. So if you come across as a seller, it's 312 00:21:32.040 --> 00:21:35.030 harder. But if you come across as someone that's developing or sharing 313 00:21:35.030 --> 00:21:38.690 value and giving relevant value, it will make it much easier to open that 314 00:21:38.690 --> 00:21:43.860 door to a connection and possibly a conversation down the line. If you can 315 00:21:43.870 --> 00:21:48.030 teach people they're going to be much more open to, you know, speaking with 316 00:21:48.030 --> 00:21:53.810 you. So it makes a lot of sense. And rewriting linked in profiles is good. I 317 00:21:53.820 --> 00:21:56.840 still want to put that in like the personal category, right? You're 318 00:21:56.840 --> 00:22:01.820 offering content to be more relevant for sure. But are there any ways to 319 00:22:01.820 --> 00:22:05.270 make it more personal where you've actually customize something to that 320 00:22:05.270 --> 00:22:10.370 company? Customsize that to the company? Yeah, I think just before you send like 321 00:22:10.370 --> 00:22:13.510 if you know that you're trying to win a specific organization or just get even 322 00:22:13.510 --> 00:22:17.050 closer towards a deal with an organization? Think about what you're 323 00:22:17.050 --> 00:22:20.940 sending them. Are you sending them just that next piece or that next touch in 324 00:22:20.940 --> 00:22:23.640 your cadence. So you know, we need to have 10 touches before they're going to 325 00:22:23.640 --> 00:22:29.320 get to this stage in the buying journey or is it actually relevant to them? Or 326 00:22:29.320 --> 00:22:32.780 if you're going to send them a piece of collateral, I've been sent white papers 327 00:22:32.790 --> 00:22:37.750 or case studies or e books that are hundreds of pages long and I'm not 328 00:22:37.750 --> 00:22:41.360 going to read the entire thing before you pick me again next week. So if 329 00:22:41.360 --> 00:22:44.420 you're going to send me that, tell me to read page five through 10 or 330 00:22:44.420 --> 00:22:47.530 whatever and say, I want you to read this because I know you're going to be 331 00:22:47.530 --> 00:22:51.430 interested in X, Y, Z. So that gives you that other layer of relevance as 332 00:22:51.430 --> 00:22:55.010 opposed to a copy and pasted email that looks like you just sent it to everyone. 333 00:22:55.020 --> 00:22:58.440 You took the time to know well I'm interested in this, this is going to 334 00:22:58.440 --> 00:23:02.880 help me do my job better and make me better and you took that extra time. 335 00:23:02.890 --> 00:23:05.760 You know, it's not a lot of effort. I think people just think it's gonna be 336 00:23:05.760 --> 00:23:09.000 too time consuming so they automatically don't want to do it. But 337 00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:11.900 if you take that extra couple of minutes to say that I know this is 338 00:23:11.900 --> 00:23:15.430 going to be important to you because and I'm not just reaching out to you to 339 00:23:15.430 --> 00:23:19.550 add to my number of touches in Salesforce or whatever it is, people 340 00:23:19.550 --> 00:23:23.130 are gonna know the difference. Yeah, it does make a huge difference. And even 341 00:23:23.140 --> 00:23:26.170 think about it is on linkedin now have, 342 00:23:27.240 --> 00:23:29.810 I don't know, I'm pretty active on linkedin. So people ask me questions 343 00:23:29.810 --> 00:23:32.970 about podcasting, but I'll take the time to go to Sweet Fish Media dot com. 344 00:23:32.970 --> 00:23:35.920 Search for an episode we've done on that find and send it to him. Right? 345 00:23:35.920 --> 00:23:39.660 That's that little customized touch that says like, hey, I heard you, I saw 346 00:23:39.660 --> 00:23:44.560 you and uh, here's, here's my best way I can help you in a short amount of 347 00:23:44.560 --> 00:23:49.790 times. I can't spend too much time on like an individual account, but you can 348 00:23:49.790 --> 00:23:53.420 still customize it. You can still make it personal. Yeah, you can still put in 349 00:23:53.420 --> 00:23:57.270 the extra effort and people notice it right away. Is there anything else you 350 00:23:57.270 --> 00:24:02.770 do with large accounts that help it to become more person? All more human? 351 00:24:04.140 --> 00:24:10.030 Yeah, I mean you have to well, let me just put it put it this way, I, we 352 00:24:10.030 --> 00:24:14.130 think of every interaction. So every touch point, whether it's an invite to 353 00:24:14.130 --> 00:24:17.380 connect, it's an email, it's a phone call, it's a voicemail, whatever it is 354 00:24:17.380 --> 00:24:23.020 that you're doing. However you, you run your sales or marketing team, Every 355 00:24:23.020 --> 00:24:29.090 touch point has to be relevant because it has to talk to what the people are 356 00:24:29.090 --> 00:24:32.630 interested or speak to the person and what's interesting to them or what's 357 00:24:32.640 --> 00:24:39.600 what's happening in their world and if it's not relevant then you can set 358 00:24:39.600 --> 00:24:44.750 yourself back because every person, every every interaction is kind of like 359 00:24:44.750 --> 00:24:48.470 a sales conversation. If you're not adding value in building layer upon 360 00:24:48.470 --> 00:24:52.840 layer each time then people are gonna notice. And like you said it shows that 361 00:24:52.840 --> 00:24:56.910 you've actually taken the time to to hear what they had to say to learn a 362 00:24:56.910 --> 00:25:00.230 little bit about them. Um And wherever you're getting your info, if you're 363 00:25:00.230 --> 00:25:02.810 getting it from the news, if you're getting it from intent data, if you're 364 00:25:02.810 --> 00:25:05.790 getting it from zoom info, if you're getting it even from their website 365 00:25:05.800 --> 00:25:09.610 because a lot of websites put their press releases and what they're their 366 00:25:09.610 --> 00:25:13.100 bosses are. You know like if you're looking at a mid market company and it 367 00:25:13.100 --> 00:25:18.500 says the Ceos goal for the next year is to increase new increase revenue by X. 368 00:25:18.500 --> 00:25:20.590 Percent. That's something that's relevant to them because you know that 369 00:25:20.590 --> 00:25:23.020 that's going to be trickling down to them eventually. So see how you can 370 00:25:23.020 --> 00:25:27.690 speak to that and it just it shows that you're actually interested and you're 371 00:25:27.690 --> 00:25:30.760 not just wanting to sell them, you want to actually become a partner to them. 372 00:25:30.770 --> 00:25:35.160 Um And every single interaction has to answer that. So don't just hit send, 373 00:25:35.160 --> 00:25:38.830 don't just do something for the sake of doing it. Don't just make a phone call 374 00:25:38.830 --> 00:25:41.950 to make a phone call figure out what the intent is behind it because the 375 00:25:41.950 --> 00:25:47.610 intent is really important. Fantastic. I want to ask one last question. If 376 00:25:47.610 --> 00:25:51.430 somebody wanted to get started with personal A B. M. And I don't have a 377 00:25:51.430 --> 00:25:55.360 full A. B. M. Program implemented already. What's the way they can kind 378 00:25:55.360 --> 00:25:59.330 of like start and get tests and test the idea before they start to develop 379 00:25:59.330 --> 00:26:03.920 something that's more robust? Yeah. So let's do it from the sales point of 380 00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:07.180 view. Pick a couple accounts that you want. That note that you fit your I. C. 381 00:26:07.180 --> 00:26:10.690 P. Don't just pay accounts you said oh these will look good on my ball of 382 00:26:10.690 --> 00:26:14.750 clients. Do they fit you? Do they fit your company? Can you solve their 383 00:26:14.750 --> 00:26:18.450 problems better than other people? Can you address the issues that they're 384 00:26:18.450 --> 00:26:21.770 having and then kind of do a little bit of research and do a little bit of 385 00:26:21.770 --> 00:26:25.000 homework even if you have to do it on your down time about those accounts and 386 00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:29.400 who are they, who are the target people that you need to connect with and reach 387 00:26:29.400 --> 00:26:33.030 out to them and however you reach out, If you use linkedin, if you use email, 388 00:26:33.040 --> 00:26:37.570 make sure that you have some relevance and test it out with one or two 389 00:26:37.570 --> 00:26:40.690 accounts at first and see how it goes. And you might have to put a little time 390 00:26:40.690 --> 00:26:43.990 and effort into it and see how that goes and then you can try to scale it a 391 00:26:43.990 --> 00:26:47.040 little bigger and then hopefully get a little more buy in for maybe the rest 392 00:26:47.040 --> 00:26:50.760 of your team. Um see if you can kind of launch a pilot program that's a little 393 00:26:50.760 --> 00:26:54.670 bigger than that based on your findings are, but I think take time to teach 394 00:26:54.670 --> 00:26:58.870 yourself to always learn what's going on in your target accounts because I'm 395 00:26:58.870 --> 00:27:03.560 sure if one account is having an issue, then more accounts are going to be 396 00:27:03.560 --> 00:27:06.030 having that issue and it's just going to help you in the long run because 397 00:27:06.030 --> 00:27:10.480 this, the personally BM approach the 1 to 1 approaches the long game. It's not 398 00:27:10.480 --> 00:27:15.720 gonna be, I'm gonna get results since 30 days, it's more like 60 9100 and 20 399 00:27:15.720 --> 00:27:19.050 days. So think of it that way. Don't think of, you know, instant 400 00:27:19.050 --> 00:27:22.660 gratification because that's not the way this is gonna work. That's perfect. 401 00:27:22.940 --> 00:27:26.350 So Christina, thank you so much for joining me on GDP growth. Where can 402 00:27:26.350 --> 00:27:32.450 people go to learn more about personal a b M and connect with you online? Yeah, 403 00:27:32.460 --> 00:27:36.490 personally BM dot com is great. We also have another resource called Stop the 404 00:27:36.490 --> 00:27:41.170 sales drop dot com. It's a podcast. We've done some events, We've done some 405 00:27:41.170 --> 00:27:46.220 videos, there's articles from our team as well as guest posts. So it's a free 406 00:27:46.220 --> 00:27:51.700 community that people can just kind of learn from and reach out to me on 407 00:27:51.710 --> 00:27:55.830 linkedin. I'm there all the time and give me some relevant reason as why we 408 00:27:55.830 --> 00:27:59.360 should connect, not just you listen to me on the podcast and it's Kristina 409 00:27:59.360 --> 00:28:03.330 with a K. Fantastic. Thanks again for joining me on GDP growth. Thanks so 410 00:28:03.330 --> 00:28:03.860 much dan 411 00:28:05.840 --> 00:28:12.840 Gary V says it all the time and we agree every company should think of 412 00:28:12.840 --> 00:28:17.850 themselves as a media company first, then whatever it is they actually do. 413 00:28:18.340 --> 00:28:22.150 If you know this is true, but your team is already maxed out and you can't 414 00:28:22.150 --> 00:28:26.550 produce any more content in house. We can help, we produce podcasts for some 415 00:28:26.550 --> 00:28:30.470 of the most innovative BB brands in the world and we also help them turn the 416 00:28:30.470 --> 00:28:35.500 content from the podcast and blog posts, micro videos and slide decks that work 417 00:28:35.500 --> 00:28:38.890 really well on linked in. If you want to learn more, go to Sweet fish Media 418 00:28:38.890 --> 00:28:44.560 dot com slash launch or email Logan at sweet fish Media dot com.
