Taking the Marketing out of Content Marketing | Echo Chamber

WEBVTT 1 00:00:08.199 --> 00:00:12.880 Conversations from the front lines and marketing. This is B two B Growth. 2 00:00:16.519 --> 00:00:20.160 Welcome to the echo Chamber here on B two B Growth, where we throw 3 00:00:20.199 --> 00:00:23.359 in our two cents on what B two B marketers are talking about on the 4 00:00:23.399 --> 00:00:27.960 Internet. I'm Dan and I'm joined today with Benji and James, and I 5 00:00:28.000 --> 00:00:32.600 wanted to dive into a fun little story of something that came in through my 6 00:00:32.679 --> 00:00:36.840 personal email inbox today that I thought was worth chatting about here on the echo 7 00:00:36.920 --> 00:00:40.359 Chamber. UM. I have a little personal blog at dan Chays dot com 8 00:00:40.439 --> 00:00:43.640 and it gets, you know, gets a modest amount of traffic. I 9 00:00:43.679 --> 00:00:47.119 blog. I experiment with s c O there, so I get ten K 10 00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:52.119 people coming through on my blog and naturally, with just enough rankings, people 11 00:00:52.479 --> 00:00:55.359 pitch me and they send me emails. They're like hey, and it's usually 12 00:00:55.399 --> 00:01:00.359 from companies I've never heard of their international right. They're trying to get some 13 00:01:00.399 --> 00:01:03.040 links to their website and they're saying, hey, we like this article on 14 00:01:03.079 --> 00:01:07.680 your side, could you please link to our tool at our tool to your 15 00:01:07.719 --> 00:01:10.799 list. And if you have any pages that rank on your website, you're 16 00:01:10.799 --> 00:01:14.959 probably getting emailed about these things too. But one came by my inbox just 17 00:01:15.079 --> 00:01:21.599 last week from a company that everybody listening to this knows. It's a massive 18 00:01:22.040 --> 00:01:25.840 company in the email marketing space. I won't say which one, since there's 19 00:01:25.879 --> 00:01:29.840 lots of them, but it's a big one. And honestly, they sent 20 00:01:29.920 --> 00:01:34.560 me one of these outreach requests asking that I linked to on my post about 21 00:01:34.599 --> 00:01:40.359 to their post abound vlogging, that thing the YouTubers are doing. It was 22 00:01:40.400 --> 00:01:42.480 a topic that I explored when I was first starting to get into ranking for 23 00:01:42.599 --> 00:01:47.480 s C. I was trying to rank for terms around vlogging and video studios 24 00:01:47.519 --> 00:01:52.599 and all that. And the funny part was I went over to it to 25 00:01:52.680 --> 00:01:56.760 check out their article that I was supposed to link to, and it was 26 00:01:57.280 --> 00:02:01.439 horrible. It was such a bad article. Like you read it and you 27 00:02:01.439 --> 00:02:07.040 can get a sense immediately that the person who wrote the article has never actually 28 00:02:07.040 --> 00:02:09.400 picked up a video camera. And that might be a bit of an overexaggeration 29 00:02:09.400 --> 00:02:13.039 because we all kind of cameras floating around, but I'm like, it's clearly 30 00:02:13.080 --> 00:02:17.039 obvious that on this massive website blog, that this article was written by somebody 31 00:02:17.080 --> 00:02:23.080 who only spent a few hours researching the topic throw together a two thousand word 32 00:02:23.159 --> 00:02:28.840 article and had multiple points in the article things that were actually bad advice, 33 00:02:29.520 --> 00:02:36.039 points that were inaccurate. How twos on things that were completely irrelevant to vloggers, 34 00:02:36.120 --> 00:02:39.280 like oh, you need a good logo was a recommendation. I'm like 35 00:02:39.719 --> 00:02:45.719 for a vlog No, like it doesn't hurt, but like, why is 36 00:02:45.719 --> 00:02:47.919 there a major section on a logo like things like this? And I want 37 00:02:47.960 --> 00:02:52.439 to throw it off here in the echo chamber because it's kind of a symbol 38 00:02:52.520 --> 00:02:58.360 of what's going on in the content marketing world today. So, James Benji, 39 00:02:58.520 --> 00:03:00.680 what do you think about this approach as large company took Well, I 40 00:03:00.759 --> 00:03:06.599 was talking to Benji about this yesterday we're preving for this episode, and yeah, 41 00:03:06.639 --> 00:03:09.439 I just think it's it's sad, but it also it makes sense. 42 00:03:09.759 --> 00:03:17.120 And because of this kind of iconic brand that everybody knows, we've talked about 43 00:03:17.120 --> 00:03:21.800 them on the show before, you're one of the biggest organizations in the world. 44 00:03:22.319 --> 00:03:29.560 And if they're doing this, then they're essentially co signing for this awful 45 00:03:30.199 --> 00:03:36.199 strategy of just taking an amalgamation of whatever is on the top page of the 46 00:03:36.400 --> 00:03:42.560 sert for this keyword and boiling it into a post where they clearly have they 47 00:03:42.560 --> 00:03:45.879 don't have a differentiated point of view. They don't know the first thing about 48 00:03:45.919 --> 00:03:51.240 this thing. And so if an organization that size, with that much brand 49 00:03:51.319 --> 00:03:55.520 cashe is doing this, it makes sense why so many other companies are doing 50 00:03:55.560 --> 00:04:00.599 it, because it's like, oh, well, it must be working because 51 00:04:00.759 --> 00:04:04.039 it's working for them, and so everyone ends up following it, and then 52 00:04:04.080 --> 00:04:10.639 we just have what we have today, which is just a mess of commodity 53 00:04:10.680 --> 00:04:15.120 content and and and it is resulting in a lot of people crapping on s 54 00:04:15.159 --> 00:04:20.079 c O because you google something and all you see is this commodity crap instead 55 00:04:20.079 --> 00:04:25.519 of talking about the enormous opportunity that we have with SEO right now and to 56 00:04:25.639 --> 00:04:31.240 actually deliver something refreshing and with a differentiated point of view, something that humanizes 57 00:04:31.279 --> 00:04:35.279 the brand that created the content a video at the top of the blog like 58 00:04:35.319 --> 00:04:39.439 what we're gonna be doing on p twop growth for the blog post that we're 59 00:04:39.480 --> 00:04:45.480 gonna be creating. There's massive opportunity for differentiation and for bringing a fresh perspective. 60 00:04:46.040 --> 00:04:47.959 So I see it as awesome, Like if one of the biggest brands 61 00:04:47.959 --> 00:04:51.079 in the world is doing it in a way that I think is very much 62 00:04:51.120 --> 00:04:56.120 the wrong way, then that's just that's more for me to win because Google 63 00:04:56.199 --> 00:05:00.720 is getting smart enough now to know regardless of how many links that article gets, 64 00:05:00.720 --> 00:05:03.240 and and there's probably a lot of people that said yes to linking to 65 00:05:03.319 --> 00:05:10.240 that article because it was that iconic brand, and so I'm glad you did 66 00:05:10.319 --> 00:05:15.160 not do that. I've been thinking back, I'm like, when did I 67 00:05:15.240 --> 00:05:20.600 get so biased against company blogs? And it is because of big companies like 68 00:05:20.720 --> 00:05:28.199 this that time and time again they take up space on their website to give 69 00:05:28.199 --> 00:05:31.519 you content that anyone and everyone could give you. And there was a time 70 00:05:31.519 --> 00:05:36.720 when that one but that was years ago at this point, and now I 71 00:05:36.759 --> 00:05:42.279 just will never hit your blog page unless it's by accident, because I can 72 00:05:42.360 --> 00:05:46.600 almost safely assume that you're not pumping out content that is unique to your brand 73 00:05:46.680 --> 00:05:51.879 voice. You're giving something that's just feeding the algorithm in a sense, feeding 74 00:05:51.879 --> 00:05:58.279 the s c O engine. And so we have to change our mindset on 75 00:05:58.480 --> 00:06:03.480 what we're giving away there and how we infuse our unique takes and bring that 76 00:06:03.680 --> 00:06:08.600 to the space. Actually, there's a comedian that I really enjoy, Hassan 77 00:06:08.680 --> 00:06:12.439 Minage. He came out with a new special, but he's been doing these 78 00:06:12.439 --> 00:06:16.279 interviews, and the one thing he harps on a lot about video content. 79 00:06:16.360 --> 00:06:21.160 He's like, I could go after becoming huge on TikTok or on YouTube shorts. 80 00:06:21.160 --> 00:06:25.600 He's like, I've got I could just figure out what the algorithm likes 81 00:06:25.720 --> 00:06:29.319 and just give the algorithm more and more and more of that. But then 82 00:06:29.360 --> 00:06:32.839 what am I ultimately serving when I do that? I'm serving YouTube's algorithm people. 83 00:06:32.920 --> 00:06:38.000 He's like, I'm becoming a slave to some person in some office in 84 00:06:38.040 --> 00:06:42.040 California who just needs to figure out how to keep people on YouTube shorts longer. 85 00:06:42.319 --> 00:06:45.800 Instead, when I know what I want to say, when you know 86 00:06:45.839 --> 00:06:49.360 what your company wants to say in a blog format or in a podcast format. 87 00:06:49.680 --> 00:06:55.319 Content at large, that's how quality content is created because no longer are 88 00:06:55.360 --> 00:07:00.439 you just serving the algorithm, You're serving what you feel some level of fction 89 00:07:00.480 --> 00:07:04.199 around. So even when we talk about content marketing, Dan, I thought 90 00:07:04.240 --> 00:07:10.720 your post recently on should we drop the marketing word out of content marketing it 91 00:07:10.800 --> 00:07:14.600 fits so well with this discussion because it's like, man, ultimately, when 92 00:07:14.600 --> 00:07:18.439 we create excellent content, that in and of itself becomes its own form of 93 00:07:18.600 --> 00:07:24.759 marketing. But we're so focused on the marketing word in content marketing that our 94 00:07:24.839 --> 00:07:30.120 content kind of becomes crap. It's a thin veil of content that's really not 95 00:07:30.160 --> 00:07:33.720 even marketing, because you could say, like, well, doing quality content 96 00:07:33.800 --> 00:07:39.759 is good marketing, and I would agree it's really sales based content, right, 97 00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:44.000 because this article is so bad that literally it's so bad because it will 98 00:07:44.040 --> 00:07:46.600 get so many links that will probably rank. People will come here, and 99 00:07:46.600 --> 00:07:50.680 it's really just to create a retargeting audience, I guess, but yeah, 100 00:07:50.759 --> 00:07:54.839 it's creating a retargeting audience, maybe to advertise later or just to get the 101 00:07:54.879 --> 00:07:58.680 myth almost said it, almost to get the brand in front of you, 102 00:07:58.720 --> 00:08:01.399 so you see the logo and the colors and stuff to kind of build familiarity 103 00:08:01.399 --> 00:08:05.000 because we all know synergy works and marketing to get them in front of you. 104 00:08:05.720 --> 00:08:11.040 But people see through, which is why gen Z is searching TikTok more 105 00:08:11.079 --> 00:08:16.920 than they are Google, because they're finding better answers on TikTok while they're using 106 00:08:16.920 --> 00:08:20.000 YouTube. And I mean I use YouTube way more for search on some topics 107 00:08:20.040 --> 00:08:22.920 now because I can prove in the video that someone knows what they're saying. 108 00:08:22.959 --> 00:08:26.439 Like I did a search for lawnmowers being a new homeowner. And I didn't 109 00:08:26.519 --> 00:08:30.120 trust the blog post because they're all affiliate links to Amazon. IM like, 110 00:08:30.120 --> 00:08:33.039 they don't even know if this lawnmower works. But in the YouTube video it's 111 00:08:33.080 --> 00:08:37.000 hard to fake, right because they can be sitting there with six lawnmowers and 112 00:08:37.120 --> 00:08:39.759 look they're all right next to me. I've tried them all. You're like, 113 00:08:39.879 --> 00:08:41.759 I believe you. It's right there. Of course, you know that 114 00:08:41.879 --> 00:08:46.240 if they work or not, you've tested them all, you've given it some 115 00:08:46.480 --> 00:08:50.759 thought, and you can actually make a good recommendation. But this one thing 116 00:08:50.840 --> 00:08:52.519 that really stood out about is how bad it is. In fact, it's 117 00:08:52.519 --> 00:08:56.200 so bad. I have to read like one little tiny a few sentences from 118 00:08:56.200 --> 00:09:01.639 it and then you'll understand the degree to which this is bad. Okay, 119 00:09:01.759 --> 00:09:03.960 So under the section on this article, one of the main headings is what 120 00:09:05.000 --> 00:09:07.399 you need to start vlogging, and one of the subpoints is video camera, 121 00:09:07.720 --> 00:09:11.000 and this is what they say. The type of video camera you should use 122 00:09:11.120 --> 00:09:15.559 is up to you. Some people record their entire vlog on their phones. 123 00:09:15.919 --> 00:09:20.080 The key to being successful is the content you produce that makes people want to 124 00:09:20.120 --> 00:09:22.799 come back for more. High quality videos do very well, but if you 125 00:09:22.840 --> 00:09:28.519 don't have content that engages your audience, they won't watch Wait what did I 126 00:09:28.600 --> 00:09:33.279 just read? What is that? There's no practical application to even a video 127 00:09:33.320 --> 00:09:37.799 camera, which is so easy, like literally just going Google like the top 128 00:09:37.840 --> 00:09:41.600 performing cameras. So even in a commodity space where most people would have been 129 00:09:41.639 --> 00:09:45.279 like, oh yeah, these are the top three most used cameras for vlogging. 130 00:09:45.799 --> 00:09:48.399 Pick a DSLR mereless and phone or like a point and shoot a phone 131 00:09:48.399 --> 00:09:52.720 in a popular DSLR camera would have been good. But that's why you can 132 00:09:52.759 --> 00:09:56.440 read this and be like, this person has no idea that it's almost to 133 00:09:56.440 --> 00:09:58.600 the point where I think a I might have written it, but it's it's 134 00:09:58.639 --> 00:10:03.480 a little it too coherent because AI content is so much worse that it's not 135 00:10:03.600 --> 00:10:07.480 quite there. But I could tell a human road it just just very quickly. 136 00:10:07.480 --> 00:10:11.440 But it's grammatically correct. And I'm like, you think of those uh 137 00:10:11.639 --> 00:10:16.480 podcasts where it's like to help put you to sleep. You could just you 138 00:10:16.559 --> 00:10:22.399 read this blog almost falling asleep as day was reading. Yeah, I mean 139 00:10:22.399 --> 00:10:24.840 practically part of it was the tone, but it's kind of like it said 140 00:10:24.919 --> 00:10:30.159 nothing said nothing. Some people use their phones. It's up to you You're 141 00:10:30.200 --> 00:10:35.440 like that was not only like it just was unhelpful. You've literally wasted my 142 00:10:35.519 --> 00:10:39.200 time. Okay, so I get pitched a little bit to do things like 143 00:10:39.480 --> 00:10:41.360 essentially linked build for other people, but not as much as I'm sure either 144 00:10:41.399 --> 00:10:48.080 of you are getting pitched. Have you ever said yes? And if you 145 00:10:48.720 --> 00:10:52.600 have never said yes, could someone pitch you in a good enough way where 146 00:10:52.639 --> 00:10:56.279 you would say yes? Like explain when you would say yes. I would 147 00:10:56.279 --> 00:11:00.559 never say yes because I don't want to mess with the website, so I 148 00:11:00.679 --> 00:11:03.840 just delete it because I'm like, this is sounds like a lot of work 149 00:11:03.879 --> 00:11:07.960 and I'm not going to do that. So I've said yes when their value 150 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:11.840 proposition to me, or in fact they never offer a value proposition, but 151 00:11:13.000 --> 00:11:18.080 I intuitively know like I have negotiating power. So if a tool usually they're 152 00:11:18.080 --> 00:11:20.480 almost always software tools, comes to me and they're like, hey, we'd 153 00:11:20.519 --> 00:11:22.919 like to be mentioned in your list. We have this tool that does X 154 00:11:22.559 --> 00:11:26.480 and I'm in the market for that. I'm like, yeah, sure, 155 00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:30.360 I'll add you to my list. It looks like you have a good tool. 156 00:11:30.919 --> 00:11:33.960 How about I get a free subscription to your tool in exchange for this 157 00:11:33.039 --> 00:11:35.919 link? When, when, and if it's something, and then I feel 158 00:11:35.919 --> 00:11:37.919 a little bit better about it, because if it's a tool that i'd actually 159 00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:39.960 like, Oh, I'd like to use that, then I feel good about 160 00:11:39.960 --> 00:11:43.919 putting it on the blog. So it freaking works. Otherwise, if it 161 00:11:43.960 --> 00:11:46.960 looks like a Jinkie tool or a tool that I already had access to or 162 00:11:46.000 --> 00:11:50.039 something like that, or something I could do for free, or I've already 163 00:11:50.039 --> 00:11:52.440 paying for it, then I wouldn't. But the fact that I'm like, 164 00:11:52.600 --> 00:11:54.519 it's valuable enough for me to put the link on there and I actually use 165 00:11:54.600 --> 00:11:58.039 it afterwards, now that I have a free subscription to it, I'll add 166 00:11:58.080 --> 00:12:00.919 it to the list. So in those says, it works, but it's 167 00:12:01.039 --> 00:12:03.240 rare. It's rare that that works out that way. That's an important note 168 00:12:03.279 --> 00:12:07.679 that it's always baffled me. And it was really the genesis of content based 169 00:12:07.720 --> 00:12:11.879 networking. And it's like, you have to give value to the person that 170 00:12:11.919 --> 00:12:16.879 you're trying to extract value from first, like and so for you to come 171 00:12:16.879 --> 00:12:20.600 and ask me for a link on my blog that is only beneficial to you, 172 00:12:22.080 --> 00:12:24.480 like my blog post is already ranking for the key word that we're trying 173 00:12:24.519 --> 00:12:30.120 to rank for mission accomplished, I won. So it baffles me that this 174 00:12:30.200 --> 00:12:33.679 is still happening. This stopped being effective. I don't know half a decade 175 00:12:33.720 --> 00:12:37.600 ago, but it's from what I understand, at least from what Dan tells 176 00:12:37.600 --> 00:12:41.600 me about s c O, the back links aren't even that critical of a 177 00:12:41.600 --> 00:12:50.240 factor anymore. You can rank by just abiding or serving the user's intent better, 178 00:12:50.440 --> 00:12:52.840 Like you don't need a bunch of back links to get something to rank. 179 00:12:52.879 --> 00:12:58.080 And so it is interesting to me that a brand that big, that 180 00:12:58.159 --> 00:13:03.240 has the resources that they have, are still are still using such an outdated 181 00:13:03.320 --> 00:13:07.399 strategy. They still matter, but not in the same way that people think 182 00:13:07.399 --> 00:13:09.840 they do. And getting these like you could just get them organically, because 183 00:13:09.879 --> 00:13:13.519 Google will literally just surface your article and test it. They'll literally like throw 184 00:13:13.559 --> 00:13:16.000 it up there for a few days, see if it gives with people. 185 00:13:16.399 --> 00:13:20.159 And naturally, if the gives of people one of the metrics they'll look at 186 00:13:20.159 --> 00:13:22.679 other than time on page. And if they click through into the site and 187 00:13:22.720 --> 00:13:26.159 say all that is, do some people start back linking to it? They 188 00:13:26.200 --> 00:13:30.879 will, and they'll start building a natural, organic back linking profile. And 189 00:13:30.879 --> 00:13:33.519 that's the thing that people are trying to gain but just doesn't work. Nearyway 190 00:13:33.559 --> 00:13:35.480 as well as it used to, because it's one factor of many factors they 191 00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:39.720 now have at the disposal to know of content is quality. There's also a 192 00:13:39.799 --> 00:13:43.399 site ranking factors and stuff, and they know brands work. So this is 193 00:13:43.399 --> 00:13:48.519 why this will work for this bigger company because people trust big brands still. 194 00:13:48.159 --> 00:13:52.639 Just to show how important it is to build a substantial brand and have affinity 195 00:13:52.679 --> 00:13:56.000 with people because you can throw out crappy content and they're still going to click 196 00:13:56.039 --> 00:13:58.919 through to your article to at least check it out because of the affinity they 197 00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:01.240 already have with you. But that article is going to take down a little 198 00:14:01.240 --> 00:14:03.759 bit of that affinity. Every time you throw this out, you're going to 199 00:14:03.840 --> 00:14:07.960 lose that affinity. I now have a bad taste in my mouth toward a 200 00:14:07.960 --> 00:14:13.840 brand that I previously like, really really loved and now it's like, and 201 00:14:13.879 --> 00:14:16.919 they recently got acquired that We're probably given away too many details. You probably 202 00:14:16.960 --> 00:14:20.240 know who we're talking about, but I'm like, oh, they got acquired 203 00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:24.919 in there. Now they're in this like corporate machine doing all the dumb stuff. 204 00:14:24.960 --> 00:14:30.399 They lost the character that their brand had. So going back to Benji, 205 00:14:30.759 --> 00:14:35.840 this thought of like should we take the marketing out of content marketing. 206 00:14:35.159 --> 00:14:39.759 Even in that case, in that blog post, there probably wasn't a lot 207 00:14:39.799 --> 00:14:43.080 of marketing in that blog post. It's not like they're saying, hey, 208 00:14:43.240 --> 00:14:48.279 use our you know, email platform, But there was zero focus on the 209 00:14:48.360 --> 00:14:52.440 content. I mean, they probably had you clearly had somebody that knows nothing 210 00:14:52.480 --> 00:14:56.799 about blogging right that thing. And so god knows how many other articles they've 211 00:14:56.799 --> 00:15:00.440 had that same person right. And and it's not in an even on the 212 00:15:00.480 --> 00:15:05.159 person. It's indiment on the strategy and the person on the leader that's having 213 00:15:05.159 --> 00:15:09.080 this strategy be executed. But it's not even necessarily that I think brands are 214 00:15:09.639 --> 00:15:16.600 stuffing too much marketing into their content as much as it is, they just 215 00:15:16.759 --> 00:15:22.440 aren't focusing on making the content actually compelling and resident. They're not focusing on 216 00:15:22.440 --> 00:15:26.039 the content as the product, which is why companies need to think about it 217 00:15:26.120 --> 00:15:30.639 more of beating a media companies. A media company thinks of the content as 218 00:15:30.639 --> 00:15:33.480 the product that they monetize, because if you think about it like that, 219 00:15:33.519 --> 00:15:37.440 then you actually think like, oh, shoot, like we need people to 220 00:15:37.480 --> 00:15:39.399 convert on this content as and subscribe to get more, because the more we 221 00:15:39.559 --> 00:15:43.720 consumption we get, the more of a product base we have, but they're 222 00:15:43.759 --> 00:15:48.399 trying to attract like cheap leads with this. And you know, across the 223 00:15:48.440 --> 00:15:52.120 top of this website they have log in and sign up are the main It's 224 00:15:52.200 --> 00:15:54.799 like a floating nab bar at the top, which is typical for a sales 225 00:15:54.799 --> 00:15:56.559 site, and it should be. That's what a sales site does. But 226 00:15:56.600 --> 00:16:00.919 if you're doing a media company, you need the content to resonate so that 227 00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:03.960 they come and read more, or watch more, or listen to more. 228 00:16:04.519 --> 00:16:07.360 So the thinking is off. If you think about it to just make it 229 00:16:07.480 --> 00:16:11.399 quick lead, then it's not going to be the same, which is why 230 00:16:11.440 --> 00:16:14.000 you need to take the marketing out of the content and just focus on the 231 00:16:14.039 --> 00:16:17.759 content. It's once you have the attention, it's easy to monetize later. 232 00:16:18.240 --> 00:16:19.960 It really is. And in the same way, you know, just just 233 00:16:21.000 --> 00:16:26.480 like media companies are monetizing that attention through advertising, companies are monetizing that attention 234 00:16:26.519 --> 00:16:30.840 through selling their product. But it's a longer path to selling that product. 235 00:16:30.039 --> 00:16:36.399 But when you can build that affinity, there's endless opportunities that come with that. 236 00:16:36.480 --> 00:16:37.799 So it's it's a heavy lift on the front end to do this, 237 00:16:37.840 --> 00:16:44.600 which is why I think we're not seeing companies truly try to do this. 238 00:16:44.879 --> 00:16:47.960 Like we're talking to somebody the other day. It's like there are a lot 239 00:16:48.159 --> 00:16:52.440 of marketers at series B series C companies that are talking about community building, 240 00:16:52.559 --> 00:16:56.559 building media companies. How do we build a media company? So it is 241 00:16:56.600 --> 00:17:00.240 being talked about, but still we're not seeing. And you saw you saw 242 00:17:00.279 --> 00:17:04.359 Patrick Campbell do it at profit well and then he got you know, acquired 243 00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:10.519 for two million dollars, and so he was really prolific and the kind of 244 00:17:10.559 --> 00:17:14.079 B two B needs to become media companies. Well, looks like it worked 245 00:17:14.079 --> 00:17:17.839 out for that guy because his great great great grandkids will never work a day 246 00:17:17.839 --> 00:17:21.960 in their life. And so it's hard, and he would tell you it's 247 00:17:21.960 --> 00:17:25.160 freaking hard. Like I got to go up and hang out with Patrick in 248 00:17:25.240 --> 00:17:27.440 his office a couple of years ago, and great, dude, I don't 249 00:17:27.440 --> 00:17:32.240 think he would shy away from telling you how hard it is to to actually 250 00:17:32.240 --> 00:17:36.039 do this, To to take the marketing out of content marketing and focus on 251 00:17:36.079 --> 00:17:41.680 the content. You've you've got to build a team of people that understand how 252 00:17:41.680 --> 00:17:45.640 to actually do this, and and it takes investment. But when you when 253 00:17:45.680 --> 00:17:52.200 you get it right and you have the attention, you have all the leverage. 254 00:17:52.680 --> 00:17:55.400 And I've been saying this, you know, I forget who I got 255 00:17:55.440 --> 00:17:57.400 this from, but I think it was one of the market feedback calls that 256 00:17:57.440 --> 00:18:02.240 I did a couple of weeks ago. It's like, if you can build 257 00:18:02.319 --> 00:18:07.720 an asset, an independent media asset that if everything went to hell in your 258 00:18:07.759 --> 00:18:12.119 business and you could sell this media asset to one of your competitors for tens 259 00:18:12.119 --> 00:18:17.000 of millions of dollars, That's what we're really talking about here. Like, 260 00:18:17.160 --> 00:18:19.480 you have the value of your company, and if you're doing this thing right, 261 00:18:21.400 --> 00:18:25.680 you also have the value of a media property that captivates the attention of 262 00:18:25.720 --> 00:18:29.400 your market and allows allows you, as the owner of it, to control 263 00:18:29.440 --> 00:18:33.440 the narrative for the industry. And so that is an incredibly valuable asset to 264 00:18:33.559 --> 00:18:37.720 own. And uh and I just can't wait for more and more brands to 265 00:18:37.720 --> 00:18:40.839 really get it. All Right, So that was long enough ramble. We're 266 00:18:40.880 --> 00:18:42.839 gonna wrap this thing up. Thank you all for jotting about. This is 267 00:18:42.920 --> 00:18:45.720 something that we've been talking about a lot internally, so I'm glad we got 268 00:18:45.720 --> 00:18:51.519 this recorded. But that's it for today's Echo Chamber episode. Remember there are 269 00:18:51.559 --> 00:18:56.839 a lot of ways to win. Commodity content is the enemy. Focus on 270 00:18:56.920 --> 00:19:02.000 affinity over awareness. You can find all things GDP growth at bTB Growth Show 271 00:19:02.079 --> 00:19:06.759 dot com. Make sure to connect with Dan Benji and myself over on LinkedIn 272 00:19:07.160 --> 00:19:25.359 and we're out. We're always excited to have conversations with leaders on the front 273 00:19:25.400 --> 00:19:29.400 lines of marketing. If there's a marketing director or a chief marketing officer that 274 00:19:29.480 --> 00:19:32.799 you think we need to have on the show, reach out. Email me 275 00:19:33.079 --> 00:19:37.200 Benji dot block at sweet fish Media dot com. I look forward to hearing 276 00:19:37.240 --> 00:19:37.519 from you.